Re: [WSG] Page structure - navigation

2005-06-23 Thread Vicki Berry
Rick Faaberg wrote: Is there something wrong with "go to" whatever section? It's been said that "go to" could imply to someone using a screen reader that the link will take them to another page. You might prefer to say "Go to ... on this page". Joe Clark had an entry in Axxlog a while ba

Re: [WSG] Page structure - navigation

2005-06-23 Thread Patrick H. Lauke
Rick Faaberg wrote: Is there something wrong with "go to" whatever section? One could argue that the "go to" is already implied by the fact that it's a link. But I'd agree that, if I had to choose between skip and go, I'd go with the latter because of its greater clarity. -- Patrick H. Lau

Re: [WSG] Page structure - navigation

2005-06-23 Thread Erica Jean
ubject: Re: [WSG] Page structure - navigation   correct, but simply including the word 'main' is enough... 'skip to' is optional. "main content" is pronounced correctly.   Studies (sorry, can't find the url, but think it came via Joe Clark) have shown that a lo

Re: [WSG] Page structure - navigation

2005-06-23 Thread Rick Faaberg
On 6/23/05 6:32 PM "Terrence Wood" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> sent this out: > Studies (sorry, can't find the url, but think it came via Joe Clark) > have shown that a lot of screen reader users don't understand the > concept of 'skip to' and consequently ignore those links. Is there something wrong wit

Re: [WSG] Page structure - navigation

2005-06-23 Thread Terrence Wood
display:none makes the link invisible in some screen readers, the off-left method is better solution for hiding content in the visual design intended for screen reader/keyboard users. Example: // remove from visual design .hide { position:absolute; left: -px; } // show to

Re: [WSG] Page structure - navigation

2005-06-23 Thread Terrence Wood
correct, but simply including the word 'main' is enough... 'skip to' is optional. "main content" is pronounced correctly. Studies (sorry, can't find the url, but think it came via Joe Clark) have shown that a lot of screen reader users don't understand the concept of 'skip to' and consequently

RE: [WSG] Page structure - navigation

2005-06-23 Thread Webmaster
Erica JeanSent: Friday, 24 June 2005 10:48 AMTo: wsg@webstandardsgroup.orgSubject: Re: [WSG] Page structure - navigation Actually, the site I read said the link should read "Skip to the main content."   Whole thing.   Because otherwise

Re: [WSG] Page structure - navigation

2005-06-23 Thread Patrick H. Lauke
Erica Jean wrote: And neither link would nessicarily have to show up on your finished page if you style them with display:none;. It would be there for the sole purpose of users with screen readers. Not necessarily. Keep in mind users with limited mobility who cannot use a mouse and therefore

Re: [WSG] Page structure - navigation

2005-06-23 Thread Kay Smoljak
On 6/24/05, Dennis Lapcewich <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > "What is more important to you, getting a high ranking on a search engine > so potential customers (who may or may not become a real customer) are able > to find the site, or keeping the customers you already have by offering > site navigati

Re: [WSG] Page structure - navigation

2005-06-23 Thread Erica Jean
rence Wood Date: 06/23/05 20:22:31 To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Cc: Terrence Wood Subject: Re: [WSG] Page structure - navigation   The technique is called reverse source order, and yes in theory it does improve your ranking in SERP's because content laden words appear at the top of the pag

Re: [WSG] Page structure - navigation

2005-06-23 Thread Terrence Wood
The technique is called reverse source order, and yes in theory it does improve your ranking in SERP's because content laden words appear at the top of the page. It also means the first screenful in a text only browser is content. I've been using this technique for over two years now, and if y

Re: [WSG] Page structure - navigation

2005-06-23 Thread Darren Wood
indeed. if i used a screen reader I'd rather see: * Skip To Main Content * Skip To Navigation than * Skip To Main Content * Home * Tradeshows * Cutomer Service * Corporate Information * Contact Us * Request Catalog * Download Forms * Order Tracking But

Re: [WSG] Page structure - navigation

2005-06-23 Thread Patrick H. Lauke
Darren Wood wrote: Moving your nav to the bottom of your structure removes the need for a skip to content... But, conversely, can create the need for a "skip to navigation" link before the content. Both solutions have pros and cons. -- Patrick H. Lauke __

Re: [WSG] Page structure - navigation

2005-06-23 Thread Dennis Lapcewich
Ask your client ... "What is more important to you, getting a high ranking on a search engine so potential customers (who may or may not become a real customer) are able to find the site, or keeping the customers you already have by offering site navigation that is easy to locate and use?" Yo

Re: [WSG] Page structure - navigation

2005-06-23 Thread Erica Jean
carily see anything wrong with it.   I suppose it all comes down to user preference really.   ---Original Message---   From: Peter Ottery Date: 06/23/05 19:34:50 To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: Re: [WSG] Page structure - navigation   Hi Ian, I dont think its a massive issue to do th

Re: [WSG] Page structure - navigation

2005-06-23 Thread Peter Ottery
Hi Ian, I dont think its a massive issue to do that (put the navigation at the end of the source and position it at the top of the page visually). Theres probably some people that would say this is potentially better for screenreaders, in that they aren't confronted with a massive navigation list a

Re: [WSG] Page structure - navigation

2005-06-23 Thread Darren Wood
Nothing's wrong with putting your nav at the bottom of your source. Actually I think its a rather good idea! People using screen readers dont want to bombarded with the same set of links each time they visit a new page. Thats why the whole skip to content thing came about...so users with screen

[WSG] Page structure - navigation

2005-06-23 Thread Ian Main
Good morning group, I have a question regarding page structure and hierarchal order. I have a client who insists making me place the site's navigation at the bottom of the page structure and than positioning it at the top via CSS. His reasons of doing this is for search engine optimisation? Quit