RE: [WSG] Styling legends and fieldsets
>> On 10/19/05, Mike Brown wrote: >> This really is a rhetorical question born of frustration... >> It would certainly help in producing accessible forms if we didn't >> have to say, "we can use legend and be properly accessible, or we can >> use heading and be able to place it where we want, but we can't use >> legend and place/style how we want. Choose one". > On 10/19/05, Joshua Street wrote: > Yes. Yes, yes ... please, god! Logically speaking (correct me if I'm wrong here): a legend should simply be handled as a block-level element that is required as the first-child of a fieldset element. In terms of document flow, this would mean you would get something like this by default: [fieldset] -- |[legend]| || ||[legend text node]|| || |[related form inputs ...] | -- Browsers could then effect their own default relative positioning to place it where they wanted, but it should be possible to overwrite this easily via (most likely) CSS or (less likely) JavaScript. Legends appear to work something like this in Firefox (although I haven't looked into the fine details of how they are managed yet). However, it is a source of continual frustration that this is not possible in other browsers, notably Opera and IE. Chris DISCLAIMER: This e-mail is confidential and should not be used by anyone who is not the original intended recipient. If you have received this e-mail in error please inform the sender and delete it from your mailbox or any other storage mechanism. Neither Macmillan Publishers Limited nor any of its agents accept liability for any statements made which are clearly the sender's own and not expressly made on behalf of Macmillan Publishers Limited or one of its agents. Please note that neither Macmillan Publishers Limited nor any of its agents accept any responsibility for viruses that may be contained in this e-mail or its attachments and it is your responsibility to scan the e-mail and attachments (if any). No contracts may be concluded on behalf of Macmillan Publishers Limited or its agents by means of e-mail communication. Macmillan Publishers Limited Registered in England and Wales with registered number 785998 Registered Office Brunel Road, Houndmills, Basingstoke RG21 6XS
Re: [WSG] Styling legends and fieldsets (Out of office until Nov 1)
Hello, I am out of the office until Nov 1. I will have limited access to email so for any urgent queries please contact [EMAIL PROTECTED] on (04) 474 8884. Thanks, Andy >>> wsg 10/20/05 08:43 >>> It depends how you want to style it mostly times you can whip moz and IE into shape (with margin, position, and padding) but I've always found Opera to be problematic. Usually I've had to revisit the visual design. Make a case that a form is a special information object (e.g. interactive) where it's constiuents need to be treated as a single unit, thus form elements need to be differentiated (visually) from the normal flow of the page. Legends aren't headings (in relation to the page), but labels that summarise a collection of form controls. kind regards Terrence Wood. Mike Brown said: > This really is a rhetorical question born of frustration, but why is the > styling of legends and fieldsets so bad across browsers? ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help **
Re: [WSG] Styling legends and fieldsets
It depends how you want to style it mostly times you can whip moz and IE into shape (with margin, position, and padding) but I've always found Opera to be problematic. Usually I've had to revisit the visual design. Make a case that a form is a special information object (e.g. interactive) where it's constiuents need to be treated as a single unit, thus form elements need to be differentiated (visually) from the normal flow of the page. Legends aren't headings (in relation to the page), but labels that summarise a collection of form controls. kind regards Terrence Wood. Mike Brown said: > This really is a rhetorical question born of frustration, but why is the > styling of legends and fieldsets so bad across browsers? ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help **
Re: [WSG] Styling legends and fieldsets
A little bit on the legend tag and Internet Explorer at the IEBlog http://blogs.msdn.com/ie/archive/2005/10/12/480242.aspx Hope this can be somewhat helpfull to you. Actually it might make you even more frustrated, but it's definitely related and worth the read. Vincent
Re: [WSG] Styling legends and fieldsets
On 10/19/05, Mike Brown <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > This really is a rhetorical question born of frustration... > It would certainly help in producing accessible forms if we didn't have > to say, "we can use legend and be properly accessible, or we can use > heading and be able to place it where we want, but we can't use legend > and place/style how we want. Choose one". Yes. -- Joshua Street http://www.joahua.com/ +61 (0) 425 808 469 N���.�Ȩ�X���+��i�� n�Z�֫v�+��h��y�m�쵩�j�l��.f���.�ץ�w�q(��b��(��,�)උazX����)��
[WSG] Styling legends and fieldsets
This really is a rhetorical question born of frustration, but why is the styling of legends and fieldsets so bad across browsers? Why can't you, visually, place the legend wherever you want? Even just being able to place it above the fieldset without overlaps and having the legend sit halfway on and halfway off the fieldset "background" would be nice! Is there any technical reason why this can't be implemented by browsers? It would certainly help in producing accessible forms if we didn't have to say, "we can use legend and be properly accessible, or we can use heading and be able to place it where we want, but we can't use legend and place/style how we want. Choose one". Mike ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list & getting help **
