Re: [WSG] CSS and the University Syllabus
Paula Petrik said: Using caption seems to pose difficulties. What difficulties does the caption pose? This is an interesting point because, in my experience, people have issues with captions *only* becuase they are used to using a heading when preparing documents in Word which doesn't have caption's. Using CSS you can style the caption to look like a heading if you wish. Is it necessary? Yes, it improves accessibility, it is more semantically correct, and it has other benefits. Here's an example: you want to generate a list of tables for inclusion in an index. By using the caption element you could generate such a list programmatically without having to fluff around looking for a preceding heading. Easy. And useful. Should Readings and Internet Visits? be tagged as h3 Why not just leave them with their p tags? Yes, they should be marked up differently to regular paragraphs because they indicate a change in context from the surrounding/preceding text. Again, it also makes it easier to find and manipulate programmatically. If you find yourself in a situation where you are using a class to siginificantly alter the appearance of an element, or you have repitious information, then the first question you should ask yourself is Am I using the right element here, is there some other element that does the job better?. Especially if the element in question is a paragraph. kind regards Terrence Wood. ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] CSS and the University Syllabus
I'm using a series of definition lists for my syllabus: http://www.tdrake.net/palomar/100-schedule.html Ted -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Paula Petrik Sent: Tuesday, December 13, 2005 9:50 PM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: [WSG] CSS and the University Syllabus The discussion on CSS Driven? prompted me to query the group on something that has been bothering me for some time; namely, of all the templates available on the web, there are very few that address the academic syllabus--despite the fact that there are thousands (millions?) of syllabi on the web. At first glance, putting a syllabus on the web looks to be a no-brainer, but it strikes me that a syllabus is a special beast and poses some structural and presentational problems. For example, I have been including a table on the schedule page of the course sites to delineate what's to be done when because it seems to be tabular data--week in one column and work (of various kinds) in another. (Yes, I have lived in fear of the Table Police.) I have tried to do the schedule using divs, but it seems hopelessly complicated and not worth the effort. Recently, I've begun to think that the readings are, in fact, a list and should be written accordingly. Using caption seems to pose difficulties. Is it necessary? Should Readings and Internet Visits? be tagged as h3 and styled accordingly? Why not just leave them with their p tags? How to connect the main site with things that apply to all classes to each course? Here are some examples from the past term: http://archiva.net/hist120ay05/hist120ay05_schedule.htm http://www.archiva.net/hist389ay05/hist389ay05_schedule.htm http://www.archiva.net/hist616ay05/hist616ay05_schedule.htm Please note that there are important elements missing, among them skip nav. I have had to do these very quickly but am doing an entire redesign to address these lacunae; these examples will shortly go into the archives along with the really tacky ones. Any advice will be gratefully received. Paula Paula Petrik Professor Department of History Art History Associate Director Center for History New Media George Mason University http://www.archiva.net ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
RE: [WSG] CSS and the University Syllabus
Looks good, Paula. Again, I think a table is fine for this type of data. I don't understand your problem with the caption. It serves the same purpose as your Week by Week h3 but IMO does it better. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Paula Petrik Sent: Wednesday, 14 December 2005 4:50 PM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: [WSG] CSS and the University Syllabus The discussion on CSS Driven? prompted me to query the group on something that has been bothering me for some time; namely, of all the templates available on the web, there are very few that address the academic syllabus--despite the fact that there are thousands (millions?) of syllabi on the web. At first glance, putting a syllabus on the web looks to be a no-brainer, but it strikes me that a syllabus is a special beast and poses some structural and presentational problems. For example, I have been including a table on the schedule page of the course sites to delineate what's to be done when because it seems to be tabular data--week in one column and work (of various kinds) in another. (Yes, I have lived in fear of the Table Police.) I have tried to do the schedule using divs, but it seems hopelessly complicated and not worth the effort. Recently, I've begun to think that the readings are, in fact, a list and should be written accordingly. Using caption seems to pose difficulties. Is it necessary? Should Readings and Internet Visits? be tagged as h3 and styled accordingly? Why not just leave them with their p tags? How to connect the main site with things that apply to all classes to each course? Here are some examples from the past term: http://archiva.net/hist120ay05/hist120ay05_schedule.htm http://www.archiva.net/hist389ay05/hist389ay05_schedule.htm http://www.archiva.net/hist616ay05/hist616ay05_schedule.htm Please note that there are important elements missing, among them skip nav. I have had to do these very quickly but am doing an entire redesign to address these lacunae; these examples will shortly go into the archives along with the really tacky ones. Any advice will be gratefully received. Paula Paula Petrik Professor Department of History Art History Associate Director Center for History New Media George Mason University http://www.archiva.net ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help ** ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] CSS and the University Syllabus
Paula Petrik wrote: For example, I have been including a table on the schedule page of the course sites to delineate what's to be done when because it seems to be tabular data--week in one column and work (of various kinds) in another. (Yes, I have lived in fear of the Table Police.) I have tried to do the schedule using divs, but it seems hopelessly complicated and not worth the effort... Here are some examples from the past term: http://archiva.net/hist120ay05/hist120ay05_schedule.htm Your use of a table is indeed correct, the data is very much tabular. Please don't live in fear of the table police, anyone who tells you tables should never be used, unconditionally, doesn't know what they're talking about. Tables are only frowned upon when they are used to mark up data that is not even remotely tabular, simply to achieve visual layout. -- Lachlan Hunt http://lachy.id.au/ ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
Re: [WSG] CSS and the University Syllabus
Tables are only frowned upon when they are used to mark up data that is not even remotely tabular, simply to achieve visual layout. Yep, especially when nested :-) Just today I came across a site that nests tables up to 9 levels deep. With a menu of 6 links that uses 5.5kB of code. They were trying to sell me their software that generates this rubbish. I'm telling them that until they clean up their act, I wouldn't recommend it if they paid me :-) But they probably don't care. Anyway, I digress. If you have tabular data, put it in a table - that's what they are for! Regards -- Bert Doorn, Better Web Design http://www.betterwebdesign.com.au/ Fast-loading, user-friendly websites ** The discussion list for http://webstandardsgroup.org/ See http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm for some hints on posting to the list getting help **
