Re[2]: [WSG] classguide

2004-02-27 Thread Mike Brown
! Is this approach (multiple stylesheets) something others use on larger sites with a lot of styling? Regards Mike Brown SIGNIFY :: the logic behind ph: +64 4 803-3211 | fax: +64 4 803-3241 mob: +64 0274 885-992 | http

[WSG] Purpose of this mailing list

2004-03-09 Thread Mike Brown
to be on another duplicating what they do. But I do want to be on a list discussing web standards. Regards Mike Brown SIGNIFY :: the logic behind ph: +64 4 803-3211 | fax: +64 4 803-3241 mob: +64 0274 885-992 | http

Re[2]: [WSG] Purpose of this mailing list

2004-03-09 Thread Mike Brown
Mark I realise that there are other CSS QA lists out there, but this list is Mark different in the sense that it is really the extension of a group and the Mark group's meetings. I would say that at the moment the membership of the list Mark these days far exceeds the attendance of our meetings,

Re: [WSG] css from photoshop file?

2004-03-18 Thread Mike Brown
? :: do elements on the page have to be exactly the pixels apart shown in the design, or do you have some flexibility there? :: is it clear from the design what elements are heading elements - h1, h2, etc? HTH Regards Mike Brown SIGNIFY :: the logic behind

Re[2]: [WSG] Budget Design

2004-05-31 Thread Mike Brown
. I can't even say something like, don't undercharge you work - value it and charge appropriately, because there will be times where you undercharge because you desparately need the work. :) Regards Mike Brown SIGNIFY :: the logic behind

Re: [WSG] divs and copying their content

2004-07-28 Thread Mike Brown
Mike Brown SIGNIFY :: the logic behind ph: +64 4 803-3211 | fax: +64 4 803-3241 mob: +64 0274 885-992 | P.O. Box 24-068, Manners St, Wellington Level 8, CMC Building, 89 Courtenay Pl, Wellington

[WSG] [OT] NZ vs Aust

2004-08-24 Thread Mike Brown
:// ... No, Kiwis are not Australians - Love it or Shove it and as for Australians .. hmmm ... - all talk, no walk springs to mind :) Mike Brown (ducking and running in NZ) ** The discussion list for

Re: [WSG] best way to format Skip Nav link

2004-09-29 Thread Mike Brown
they will be incorporated into designs in, of course, the most tasteful way :) Bottom line, if you can add it to the design, it's a good thing to do. Regards Mike Brown SIGNIFY LTD :: the logic behind

[WSG] IE5 Mac hanging on loading a page

2004-09-30 Thread Mike Brown
. I'm stuck, and also only use Macs for browser testing so don't have a lot of experience with them. Any ideas? Regards Mike Brown SIGNIFY LTD :: the logic behind

Re[2]: [WSG] IE5 Mac hanging on loading a page

2004-09-30 Thread Mike Brown
display fine in IE5 Mac: It's just this one page for some reason! thanks though Mike Brown SIGNIFY LTD :: the logic behind

Re: [WSG] IE5 Mac hanging on loading a page

2004-10-03 Thread Mike Brown
this :) A floated element on the page, a span, didn't have a width declared, and needed one for IE5 Mac. That was causing the hanging. It is a known problem, but one I'd forgotten about. Thanks to Philippe Wittenbergh for the solution! Mike Brown SIGNIFY LTD :: the logic

Re: [WSG] select as form label

2004-10-21 Thread Mike Brown
Nick Lo wrote: Thanks for your response, unfortunately that wasn't my question though I realise at a glance it's how my question read. It was specifically referring to this type of instance... p label class=blank for=input_phone_1 select name=input_phone_1_type id=input_phone_1_type

[WSG] Safari form problem

2004-11-14 Thread Mike Brown
. Any ideas why? The css used is here: Thanks. Mike Brown SIGNIFY LTD :: the logic behind ** The discussion list for http

Re: [WSG] Defining A Definition List

2004-11-29 Thread Mike Brown
personal preference as to what is semantically best. That's what's called a slippery slope argument - just because you can find some examples where things aren't clear-cut, doesn't mean every case isn't clear cut. Again, sometimes a list is a list and a list is the right thing. Regards Mike Brown

[WSG] Standard for text email newsletters

2004-12-07 Thread Mike Brown
it as a standard for text emails? Regards Mike Brown SIGNIFY LTD :: the logic behind ph: +64 4 803-3211 | fax: +64 4 803-3241 mob: +64 0274 885-992 | P.O. Box 24-068, Manners St, Wellington Level 1, 250a

[WSG] First Wellington WSG meeting

2004-12-09 Thread Mike Brown
year. Thanks to everyone who showed up, and to Terry Wood for his help and presentation! I'm looking forward to a lot of good things coming from this. Oh, and of course thanks to Russ and Peter and others here for the help and impetus to set things up in Wellington. Regards Mike Brown

Re: [WSG] Semantic markup for publication titles

2004-12-16 Thread Mike Brown
SEMANTIC MARKUP FOR PUBLICATION TITLES In print the name of a publication is typically type-set in an oblique or italic font. A similar *visual* effect can be achieved either through the use of: - an italic font-tag iPublication/i (probably deprecated) - an emphasis tag emPublication/em -

Re: [WSG] Semantic markup for publication titles

2004-12-16 Thread Mike Brown
Natalie Buxton said: Cite isn't really appropriate is it? CITE: Contains a citation or a reference to other sources So you are not referencing a source, just mentioning a publication. well, I think it *is* a reference to [an]other source. Although I think the specs could be clearer!

Re: [WSG] e-Government Implementation Guidelines

2004-12-21 Thread Mike Brown
the same lines has already been compiled here: Might be a good starting point in and of itself, and also to avoid duplication. Regards Mike Brown SIGNIFY LTD :: the logic behind

[WSG] Wellington WSG - update

2004-12-23 Thread Mike Brown
and a more general audience - eg managers, business analysts, visual designers etc. In particular, I think the chance to observe Jonathan using assistive technology to access the web will be eye-opening for those of us who take vision for granted. Have a great Christmas/holidays everyone! Regards Mike

Re: [WSG] IE 5 Mac choking on CSS?

2005-01-25 Thread Mike Brown
the same problem before and it was caused by not giving a floated element a width. It seemed that IE5 Mac froze on that. If you have any floated elements, check to see they have widths. HTH Regards Mike Brown SIGNIFY LTD :: the logic behind

Re: [WSG] Standards?

2005-02-01 Thread Mike Brown
Kay Smoljak wrote: On Tue, 1 Feb 2005 09:57:46 -, designer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I can appreciate that I am getting a 'quality' product, but from a practical point of view, what am I getting that improves my business? As far as visitors to my site are concerned there seems to be no

Re: [WSG] Standards compliant site, clients wants to make updates themselves

2005-03-20 Thread Mike Brown
Bert Doorn wrote: However, I get many prospects who want to update sites themselves. In many cases, these are very small businesses with just one or two people, none of which have any idea about (x)HTML. Most of them have very small budgets, so they can't afford a complete CMS type setup (and

[WSG] Rounded corner and IE Win help needed

2005-03-28 Thread Mike Brown
Ok, so this is driving me crazy! I have an unordered list being used for navigation. The bottom item on the list needs to have a rounded corner. I figure: - make the last li position: relative - add a span inside the last li the exact

Re: [WSG] Rounded corner and IE Win help needed

2005-03-28 Thread Mike Brown
Sigurd Magnusson wrote: Well if you put a border on the span you see that the image is in the wrong place within the span; Doing background-position: bottom right; within the ul#subnav li.last span { certainly gets you most the way there; had you done that? No! I hadn't thought it necessay

Re: [WSG] Valid Code, but Poor Accessibility

2005-03-30 Thread Mike Brown
Matthew Cruickshank wrote: David Nicol wrote: I would be very grateful if someone could direct me to an existing resource or article addressing the subject of how a validly-coded web site can fail to be truly accessible. i.e. why valid code is not, in itself, enough to guarantee accessibility.

Re: [WSG] IE three pixel bug has beaten me

2005-04-18 Thread Mike Brown
Andreas Boehmer [Addictive Media] wrote: This is the second time I am coming across the IE three pixel bug, but this time it really got me: Andreas not sure if this will fix it, but try ending the hack with a comment eg style /*

Re: [WSG] Strange horizontal spacing in nav list

2005-05-10 Thread Mike Brown
jackie reid wrote: Hello everyone... I am in a quandry... ie displays my navigation with whopping great big spaces in between the list items. Why is this so... and how can i make them go away? Been trying to get it sorted for a couple of hours now and am getting frustrated to the max. Please

[WSG] Web standards presentation

2005-05-21 Thread Mike Brown
if anyone is interested, I did a presentation on web standards last week and have put it online: I hate to do the best viewed in thing :), but it's best viewed in Mozilla/Firefox in fullscreen mode. It uses Eric Meyer's S5 presentation thingie. If you print out,

Re: [WSG] Web standards presentation

2005-05-21 Thread Mike Brown
Jan Brasna wrote: Mike, this is awesome, I love the notes! ;) Who was the target audience, please? Thanks! The audience was managers of websites, people who commission websites. Especially in the government sector. It wasn't designed as a hands-on presentation, but more as an introduction

[WSG] Suckerfish IE woes

2005-06-06 Thread Mike Brown In IE6 I can't fully fully mouseover the dropdown menu items before they disappear. It works in IE5 and Mozilla. The HTML and CSS validate. And the problem isn't consistent - sometimes I can mouseover most of the dropdown menu, other times

Re: [WSG] Suckerfish IE woes

2005-06-07 Thread Mike Brown
Jason sorry about that. I managed to get it working and took it down. The problem was I hadn't added a background colour for the ul and that was affecting the dropdown in IE. Imagine! :) Mike Jason Foss said: Can you repost that link for me Mike? It's not working atm... On 6/7/05, Mike Brown

[WSG] Wellington WSG meeting Thusday 16 June

2005-06-14 Thread Mike Brown
in the air after the Wellington rugby side beat the visiting Lions tonight :) Hope you can make it if you're in Wellington! Regards Mike Brown on behalf of the Wellington WSG ** The discussion list for See

Re: [WSG] What not to do for colour blind users

2005-07-24 Thread Mike Brown
David Pietersen wrote: Mordechai is totally right in that it is hue that makes it difficult, but it is only within the specific context of combining the two (either Red/Green or Blue/Green). I had a series of progressively more advanced CB tests when I went to join the Army, and ended up

[WSG] Form markup question

2005-08-11 Thread Mike Brown
Hi what's the correct markup for when you want to provide help, or an example, of what should be filled in for a particular form field? For example: Visually I want something like this Known as[ input text field ] Name you prefer to be know as ... I've thought to markup as follows:

Re: [WSG] Screen Resolution for Fluid Layouts

2005-08-27 Thread Mike Brown
Lea de Groot said: Honestly, it doesn't seem to matter how big the screen is. Jo(e) Public surfs at 100%. I don't like it, but its true. For the number of years I've been building sites (over 6 years full time) I'm struggling to remember ever seeing a client or user (as opposed to a

[WSG] Browser tolerance - was Barclays standards redesign

2005-09-07 Thread Mike Brown
Kenny Graham wrote: Exactly. I was actually thinking the other day, browsers should be more like compilers... they should refuse to parse incorrect code. Then the enforcement would be on the output end, too. It would be nice, but would only work if -every- browser did it. Otherwise

Re: [WSG] Content that jumps

2005-09-15 Thread Mike Brown
Taco Fleur - Pacific Fox wrote: The content has stopped jumping, haven't changed anything in the structure. Has anyone seen anything like this before? Yup. I've found that the content gets really tired from jumping after a while and stops. Usually it takes a few hours solid jumping for it

Re: [WSG] avoid Verdana - I cant get the whole point.

2005-10-03 Thread Mike Brown
Julián Landerreche said: I have been reading few articles (like about avoiding Verdana font. But I cant get the whole point in this issue. So, please, can someone point me what am I missing about avoiding Verdana? Honestly, I pretty

[WSG] Zoom Layouts

2005-10-05 Thread Mike Brown
Hey I don't think there is, but is there any sort of consensus of the use of zoom layouts? In particular: 1) How do you signal that

Re: [WSG] Zoom Layouts

2005-10-05 Thread Mike Brown
Patrick H. Lauke said: I actually had a bit of a discussion with Joe Clark on this issue during his London workshop last month. I'd argue that users of things like screen magnifiers, who are the target audience for zoom layouts, don't need excessively larger fonts and that the reversing of

Re: [WSG] Avoiding the evil br

2005-10-09 Thread Mike Brown
Richard Czeiger wrote: I think the bigger question is can someone proivde an example of when best to use the br / tag in general? What type of content semantically requires a line break. - Original Message - From: Hope Stewart I'm unsure whether I should in fact avoid using br:

[WSG] Styling legends and fieldsets

2005-10-18 Thread Mike Brown
This really is a rhetorical question born of frustration, but why is the styling of legends and fieldsets so bad across browsers? Why can't you, visually, place the legend wherever you want? Even just being able to place it above the fieldset without overlaps and having the legend sit halfway

[WSG] Radio New Zealand site relaunch

2005-10-24 Thread Mike Brown As a disclaimer, I had some involvement with the HTML/CSS templates, but even so, I think it's a good example of a site that's nice visually and reasonably standards-compliant. Mike SIGNIFY LTD :: the logic behind

Re: [WSG] Radio New Zealand site relaunch

2005-10-25 Thread Mike Brown
John Lewis wrote: Hi Mike, I was interested to see that you are using the back-slash hack when importing your stylesheets, commented as: Excluding old versions of IE etc. I guess what I'm most interested in is how that decision was made? Is it part of your company's approach/philosophy or was

Re: [WSG] Radio New Zealand site relaunch

2005-10-25 Thread Mike Brown
Andy Kirkwood|Motive wrote: My interest in Mike's post is in the client-developer relationship. What swayed the client toward excluding Mac IE from stylesheet support could be beneficial when considering the merits of such an approach with other standards-aware clients. Perhaps the RNZ

Re: [WSG] Text choices on our own sites

2005-10-30 Thread Mike Brown
Samuel Richardson wrote: When I explain to clients why standards are important I bring up the following list: And explain it to them point by point. Of course if I was a client, I'd immediately question the compliance of the

Re: [WSG] standards, accessability and validation?

2005-11-01 Thread Mike Brown
Mark Harris wrote: At a WSG meeting in Wellington, earlier in the year (see, Jonathon Mosen did a live demo of JAWS to an audience of web developers. Watching the light bulbs go on as it read out an interminable database URL from an

Re: [WSG] standards, accessability and validation?

2005-11-01 Thread Mike Brown
Leslie Riggs wrote: We are hoping to have this available online as a Quicktime file soon. When it is, it's definitely worth showing to people. Jonathan is a wonderful speaker and funny speaker, and I guarantee that no one will see his presentation and go away feeling the same about

[WSG] Webstock launches

2005-11-02 Thread Mike Brown
Goodger (lead engineer on Firefox) and Joel Spolsky (Joel on Software). We think it's going to be a wonderful time and extend an invitation to come to Wellington next year and enjoy the conference! Mike Brown for Web Standards New Zealand

[WSG] Next Wellington WSG meeting

2005-11-08 Thread Mike Brown
Just a reminder that this will be on Thursday 17th November. More details here: Free Webstock poster for everyone attending :) Mike ** The discussion list for

[WSG] Forms, data tables and screenreaders

2005-11-20 Thread Mike Brown
Hi I'm trying to recreate this visual look: So, I'm thinking it's a form with two data tables inside the form. I've marked it up as such here: My limited understanding of screenreaders is that they have a mode for

Re: [WSG] web standards training course/events in Sydney next year?

2005-11-22 Thread Mike Brown
Cade Whitbourn wrote: Anybody know of any good training courses or events that are being held in Sydney (or the other capital cities) next year on web standards/best practice web design/usability etc (other than WE06 and the regular wsg meetings?) Webstock Hey,

Re: [WSG] CSS Driven?

2005-12-12 Thread Mike Brown
Al Sparber wrote: I do agree that English is a crazy language - but that's as far as I go :-) The gent from Harvard provide the link to the W3C's definition of should, which seems to jive with mine. As for a standards-based page, agreeing that it is not a hard and fast rule that tables be

Re: [WSG] Font Sizes - Best practice

2006-02-20 Thread Mike Brown
Lachlan Hunt wrote: russ - maxdesign wrote: Could it not be argued that the unimportant legal content is sometimes more important to some users than the general content on the page? :) I'm sure there are some that think such notices should be shown in large bold letters, read and agreed to

Re: [WSG] Confusing the users... In Page Links

2006-02-21 Thread Mike Brown
Herrod, Lisa wrote: This is really interesting article in that it contradicts findings of a recent study we completed just 2 weeks ago. We recently conducted user testing on a site with 22 participants, which is a significant sample (often we test with 8 to 12). The demographic was 18 skilled

Re: [WSG] Certified Usable

2006-03-19 Thread Mike Brown
Andreas Boehmer [Addictive Media] wrote: Sydney-based Usability company PTG has made the claim that they can certify the usability of their websites: In an article on the AIMIA website, Craig Errey, manager of PTG, says we're apparently the

Re: [WSG] Recommendations for Usability sub-contractor; SEC=UNCLASSIFIED

2007-02-28 Thread Mike Brown
I think best would be people reply to Sarah off-list, because: - we don't want to get into a debate as to which usability consultants are good or not, or even what makes a good usability consultant - those of us outside of Canberra have very limited interest in the subject :) Mike who,

Re: [WSG] asp and accessibility

2007-03-11 Thread Mike Brown
Bob Schwartz wrote: Do database driven, dynamically created asp pages pass muster for accessibility? What makes a site accessible? Being on this list, you surely have some idea of the answer. But to help, some of the key things are: - it has semantic, well-structured HTML - in particular

Re: [WSG] asp and accessibility

2007-03-11 Thread Mike Brown
Bob Schwartz wrote: Yes, I have an idea, but never having seen any of the devices people talk about here, I often have doubts about what I think I have understood. Go here: and listen to / look at Darren Fittler's presentation. He's blind and uses a

Re: [WSG] markup for headline and tagline

2007-05-05 Thread Mike Brown
What markup do you favor for a headline-tagline pair? (The second element could be a tagline or a byline.) h1Thundering Pigs/h1 citea blog by Bob/cite h1Thundering Pigs/h1 p class=taglinea blog by Bob/p h1Thundering Pigs/h1 div

[WSG] FullCodePress - shameless plug

2007-08-13 Thread Mike Brown
FullCodePress - the geek Olympics! This weekend (18/19 August) the New Zealand web team, the Code Blacks will take on the Australian team in a 24hr challenge to

[WSG] [Plug] Webstock 08

2007-09-12 Thread Mike Brown
Webstock 08 - Wellington, New Zealand 11-15 February - has just launched. Mike *** List Guidelines: Unsubscribe:

[WSG] 5,000th member

2007-09-25 Thread Mike Brown
Russ I just want to say, on behalf of all 5,000 members I'm sure, thanks to you and Peter for the list. It's been your vision and dedication that's kept it going and nourished, and what you've both done has been influential in ways I'm sure you don't realise. Well done! :) Mike

[WSG] Positioning a background image

2007-09-30 Thread Mike Brown
So, I want to position a background-image. It's a single px image. I want it to start on the left-hand-side of its containing div, and 120px from the top. I want it to repeat downwards. I use (showing in longhand): background-color: #fff; background-image: url(/images/content-bg.gif);

Re: [WSG] Positioning a background image

2007-09-30 Thread Mike Brown
E Michael Brandt wrote: This is not possible with current browser support of css. repeat-y means repeat upwards and downwards, not just downwards as you would like (and who wouldn't like that?). There may be a way in your page layout to use two wrappers, placing the bg in the lower one on

Re: A: [WSG] Target Lawsuit - Please Make Yourself Heard

2007-10-03 Thread Mike Brown
Chris Wilson wrote: A private company should be able to do whatever the hell they like. Suit is without merit and frivolous. What's next, suing vehicle manufacturers for not providing a braille manual? I'm all for accesability, but there is no reason it should be mandated, and lack of is in

Re: A: [WSG] Target Lawsuit - Please Make Yourself Heard

2007-10-03 Thread Mike Brown
If you are going to argue for standards and accesability, follow your own advice first. Captain table layout over here. You don't even have alt tags on your images. Hypocritical aren't ya? Taking bets as to how long before Goodwin's law's_law kicks in. I

Re: [WSG] source order

2007-10-09 Thread Mike Brown
Rick Lecoat wrote: Hi there; I'm currently laying down the markup for a site and have been pondering whether to put page content above navigation in the source. I often read that this is a good idea, and that makes perfect sense to me as long as there are skip links so that people can reach the

[WSG] [plug] Webstock - extension of early-bird registration

2007-11-22 Thread Mike Brown
Just a quick plug that early-bird registration for Webstock has been extended for a week and now closes on Friday 1 December. If you're thinking of attending, now is a good chance to register! We'd love to see you here and will make you especially welcome if you're from

Re: [WSG] BBC in Beta

2007-12-17 Thread Mike Brown
Felix Miata wrote: On 2007/12/17 15:30 (GMT) Paul McCann apparently typed: Heads up, the BBC has a new site in Beta. Thoughts/praise/comments :) snip usual font stuff /snip Overall, better, but, worse than good. Oh come on, let's not be so blinkered

Re: [WSG] standards-compliant designers

2008-01-09 Thread Mike Brown
Mark Harris wrote: 1 crap designer can turn out many, many crap sites. The damage done by Sieglal's Designing Killer Websites (1st edition - he recanted later) was huge. Back when I was starting, I bought it and used it as a bible of what not to do, but many used it as a how-to guide, and

Re: [WSG] Spolsky on IE8 flag

2008-03-17 Thread Mike Brown
Lea de Groot wrote: Joel Spolsky has published an ... interesting article I think it's a great article. And one the nails why this has created so much heat. Among many killer quotes, this to end things: You see? No right answer. As usual,

[WSG] Webstock recordings now available

2008-03-19 Thread Mike Brown Enjoy! Mike *** List Guidelines: Unsubscribe: Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: [WSG] PNG file sizes

2008-04-15 Thread Mike Brown
Rachel May wrote: I created the PNGs in Photoshop (CS3) and just wondering if there are any better tools or ways of saving the PNGs for smaller file size, while still retaining their high quality?? Best. Graphics. Optimiser. PlugIn. That I've found anyway :)

Re: [WSG] form from the 7th level of hell

2008-08-07 Thread Mike Brown
kevin mcmonagle wrote: joseph i keep my brightness at 0, and thought it matched. thanks for the tip Joseph Taylor wrote: Kevin, If I may make a recommendation, adjust the background color of your cells to match the bottom color of your background gradients so when text gets enlarged it

[WSG] [Shameless Plug] Webstock 09 launch

2008-09-09 Thread Mike Brown
A quick plug that we're really pleased to announce the launch of Webstock 09 In Wellington, New Zealand from 16-20 February. Speakers include: Russ Weakley (top of the list since this is his mailing list :) Bruce Sterling Ze Frank Jane McGonigal Adrian Holovaty Heather

[WSG] Webstock 09 recordings available

2009-06-10 Thread Mike Brown
Hi Just a quick note that all recordings from the Webstock 09 conference, and much more, are now available online at the Webstock site: Mike *** List Guidelines:

[WSG] [Conference plug] Webstock 2010

2009-10-11 Thread Mike Brown
A quick, and shameless, plug that we've just launched Webstock 2010 If you're from outside NZ and thinking of attending, drop me a line. Mike *** List Guidelines:

Re: [WSG] JavaScript courses in Sydney

2009-10-13 Thread Mike Brown
David McKinnon wrote: Hi, Can anyone recommend a good JavaScript course in Sydney? I've been teaching myself for a few years, so I have a reasonable idea how to write unobtrusive JavaScript and have mucked around with jQuery, but feel I need something practical to really consolidate my

Re: [WSG] Advanced Javascript course (Sydney)?

2010-09-18 Thread Mike Brown
On 17/09/10 4:36 PM, Jens-Uwe Korff wrote: Hi all, I am trying to find someone who can hold a one-day advanced Javascript course but have no luck. Thomas Fuchs and Amy Hoy do an online advanced Javascript class: I can recommend then as really great

[WSG] Launch of Webstock 2011

2010-09-24 Thread Mike Brown
We have just launched Webstock 2011 So if you feel like traveling to New Zealand for an awesome conference, we'd love to see you :) Mike *** List Guidelines:

[WSG] Webstock - early-bird registrations close Friday

2010-12-06 Thread Mike Brown
Hi everyone Yes, a shameless plug, but, if you're interested in attending Webstock: and I do hope you may be, early-bird pricing ends this Friday. Regards Mike *** List Guidelines:

Re: [WSG] How do you cater to users with disabilities?

2011-08-26 Thread Mike Brown
On 26/08/11 5:15 PM, Jay Tanna wrote: Personally I don't go out of my way to do anything special. I design the site as it comes and if some people can't access it - tough luck. There is no point in spending any additional time or money in buying specialist tools for people who are