RE: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-14 Thread Christie Mason
-Original Message- From:f Hassan Schroeder Christie Mason wrote: Yes, I've tried Flex and abandoned the effort. ... Plus, there's the maintenance issue. Simple example I always use is what if you had to change a corporate logo in every Flash file? To do that with a dynamic

Re: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-14 Thread Brett Patterson
I hope I can throw my 2 cents in. Not trying to argue, but to TRY and answer some questions. A question was asked early in this thread about what are the benefits of using Flash? There's been no answer to that question. I was hoping to learn some answers because I've been confused about why

Re: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-14 Thread James Ducker
Hi WSG, This entire argument is getting a bit much. Nothing on the web is in and of itself particularly accessible. Accessibility in HTML is a joke unless you have been taught the right practices. Flash was, is, and will continue to be, primarily, a tool for delivery of rich, interactive media.

Re: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-14 Thread Hassan Schroeder
Christie Mason wrote: CM - I wasn't talking about Flex. I was referring to Flash. I can see that I wasn't clear when I changed thoughts. And again, missing the point: Flash is a *platform* with which you can do a variety of things. It's not 1998 any more, and Flash is only about Dancing

Re: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-14 Thread Brett Patterson
THANK YOU!!! I could not agree with you more. And in the same since, I think we agree with each other. Congratulations on an argument well-played. And well-thought!!! -- Brett P. On Wed, Jan 14, 2009 at 11:05 AM, James Ducker james.duc...@gmail.comwrote: Hi WSG, This entire argument is

Re: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-14 Thread Brett Patterson
Christie, your argument is about the most ridiculous argument there is. Everything you have stated is SOLELY about you and your personal preferences. Observe: I'm not a highly visual person, I even prefer reading data to being given a graph. So what? *NONE OF THIS IS ABOUT YOU!!!* Your

Re: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-14 Thread Brett Patterson
The below was to James Ducker. -- Brett P. On Wed, Jan 14, 2009 at 11:23 AM, Brett Patterson inspiron.patters...@gmail.com wrote: THANK YOU!!! I could not agree with you more. And in the same since, I think we agree with each other. Congratulations on an argument well-played. And

Re: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-14 Thread Matt Morgan-May
On 1/14/09 5:38 AM, Christie Mason cma...@managersforum.com wrote: Plus, I'd be curious as to availability of the Flex server in remote hosts. I haven't seen any offer it, is it still so pricey(?), but I also haven't been looking for it. Flex hasn't been sold on a server basis since 1.5, which

RE: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-14 Thread Christie Mason
From: Brett Patterson (BP) BP - Okay, first this part of the answer. There are different types of ways that people learn. I suggest reading: http://www.worldwidelearn.com/education-articles/how-do-you-learn.htm CM - That's a very simplistic theory of how people learn and it's actually a

RE: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-14 Thread Christie Mason
Brett you are correct, This is a personal theory based on some personal observations. Do you use a Mac as your primary development computer? Christie Mason *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm

RE: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-14 Thread Christie Mason
-Original Message- From: Hassan Schroeder It's *integrated* with the video, graphics, sound. Let's say you're teaching bicycle mechanics, and you have a video that demonstrates replacing a cog in a cassette. As the component is disassembled, you want to show the name and details of each

Re: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-14 Thread Brett Patterson
Pardon the language, but Hell no. For a number of different reasons. Among that being, I can't work with the code as good as I can with Microsoft's and the fact that it costs too much money. Although it is proprietary, I can recode most of what I need to do (Microsoft's code). To say I disagree

Re: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-14 Thread Brett Patterson
Forgot to mention several other things, Christie. 1. If all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail, I am still laughing at that. CM - Interaction is more than clicking on a link or moving things around on a screen. Those links are easier to develop and manage with HTML, plus

RE: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-14 Thread Christie Mason
Well there goes that theory. My thoughts were something like graphically oriented people are attracted to using Macs and Flash. BCAT's attempting to make Flash accessible is good but if the content hadn't been made inaccessible in the first place, then it wouldn't be needed. Yes, Flash can be

Re: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-14 Thread Brett Patterson
And we do agree. But again, NOT THE POINT, although it may be wrong, it may need to be designed accessible in the first place, it hasn't, so don't argue the point. End it at the fact that something needs to be done and people are ignorant. BCAT is doing what people should be doing, fixing things

Re: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-14 Thread Andrew Maben
On Jan 14, 2009, at 3:22 PM, Christie Mason wrote: Well there goes that theory. My thoughts were something like graphically oriented people are attracted to using Macs and Flash. BCAT's attempting to make Flash accessible is good but if the content hadn't been made inaccessible in the

Re: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT - THREAD CLOSED

2009-01-14 Thread russ - maxdesign
THREAD CLOSED ­ GONE ON LONG ENOUGH Please do not reply to this thread any more. Thanks Russ List admin *** List Guidelines: http://webstandardsgroup.org/mail/guidelines.cfm Unsubscribe:

Re: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-13 Thread Matt Morgan-May
On 1/12/09 2:20 AM, michael.brocking...@bt.com michael.brocking...@bt.com wrote: Quote: The fact is that many educators have found that they can use Flash to teach their students effectively. I think you (and those teachers that you refer to) are mistaking an effective lesson, for effective

Re: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-13 Thread David Lane
On Tue, 2009-01-13 at 11:42 -0800, Matt Morgan-May wrote: If evil is all you have to say about Flash, then there's not much that can be said. It's clearly not worth taking a reasoned approach to convince you that it has merit as a classroom tool, despite the thousands of teachers and millions

RE: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-13 Thread Webb, KerryA
-Original Message- From: li...@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:li...@webstandardsgroup.org] On Behalf Of Matt Morgan-May Sent: Wednesday, 14 January 2009 6:43 AM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: Re: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT Adobe could do a better job

RE: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-13 Thread Andrew R
A question was asked early in this thread about what are the benefits of using Flash? There's been no answer to that question. I was hoping to learn some answers because I've been confused about why it's become so widely used in eLearning. I think I see several factors but I also think

Re: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-13 Thread nedlud
Having worked as both a teacher in higher ed, and in a support role for teachers in higher ed, I have to agree 100% with Andrew. Flash is the devil you know. Teachers use it so they don't have to learn something new. It amazes me how many people still get away with making flash sites, and burning

Re: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-13 Thread Hassan Schroeder
Andrew R wrote: ,... and I’m going to make some gross simplification to illustrate my point. Apparently. Flash is prominently a tool for supporting interaction with certain types of content. It does not enable a whole bunch of other activities that could (should) be included in supporting

RE: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-13 Thread Christie Mason
From: Hassan Schroeder Have you ever developed -- or even used -- an application built in Flex, or OpenLaszlo? Perfectly simple to do any of the above, with the advantage of easy integration with video and other rich content. [CM] Yes, I've tried Flex and abandoned the effort. It didn't give

Re: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-13 Thread Hassan Schroeder
Christie Mason wrote: Yes, I've tried Flex and abandoned the effort. ... Plus, there's the maintenance issue. Simple example I always use is what if you had to change a corporate logo in every Flash file? To do that with a dynamic database approach you change the file once and that's it.

RE: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-12 Thread michael.brockington
Quote: The fact is that many educators have found that they can use Flash to teach their students effectively. I think you (and those teachers that you refer to) are mistaking an effective lesson, for effective teaching.* Also, I think you mis-understand where the problem lies. Because of the

RE: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-12 Thread Christie Mason
A question was asked early in this thread about what are the benefits of using Flash? There's been no answer to that question. I was hoping to learn some answers because I've been confused about why it's become so widely used in eLearning.I think I see several factors but I also think I'm

Re: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-11 Thread Simon Pascal Klein
On 11/01/2009, at 4:08 PM, James Ducker wrote: Ultimately teachers should aim to teach the skills that are required of students entering the industry. The TAFE students I tutor in Sydney are being taught XHTML, XML, CSS table-free layouts, and so on, so not a bad start. The JavaScript

Re: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-10 Thread James Ducker
Ultimately teachers should aim to teach the skills that are required of students entering the industry. The TAFE students I tutor in Sydney are being taught XHTML, XML, CSS table-free layouts, and so on, so not a bad start. The JavaScript courses look like they could use some improvement (see

# Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-09 Thread Matt Morgan-May
Hi, Excuse me for jumping in here, especially (in this case) as a Flash partisan. But I fail to see how this kind of project can be anything other than a good thing overall. What I don't understand is why people are instantly critical of projects that are actually attempting to increase access

RE: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-09 Thread Rick Faircloth
Agreed! -Original Message- From: li...@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:li...@webstandardsgroup.org] On Behalf Of Matt Morgan-May Sent: Friday, January 09, 2009 2:50 PM To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT Hi, Excuse me for jumping

Re: # Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-09 Thread Simon Pascal Klein
On 10/01/2009, at 6:50 AM, Matt Morgan-May wrote: Hi, Excuse me for jumping in here, especially (in this case) as a Flash partisan. But I fail to see how this kind of project can be anything other than a good thing overall. What I don't understand is why people are instantly critical of

RE: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-08 Thread michael.brockington
will be planted as a result, which sequester more CO2 than mature trees. From: li...@webstandardsgroup.org [mailto:li...@webstandardsgroup.org] On Behalf Of Priti Rohra Sent: 08 January 2009 06:44 To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: Re: [WSG] Beta Testers

RE: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-08 Thread Christie Mason
@webstandardsgroup.org Subject: RE: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT I think you may have missed the point of the earlier question - What can flash bring to the learning environment that cannot be done with HTML, CSS and JavaScript? Regards, Mike PS: Please print and keep this email, as all paper

RE: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-07 Thread Christie Mason
Wouldn't it have been easier to manage and more appropriate towards being welcoming to those using assistive technologies to NOT use Flash? Yes, Flash can be MADE to be accessible but what benefits does its use offer to justify all the things that must be done to make it accessible? Why not use

Re: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT

2009-01-07 Thread Priti Rohra
planet. - Original Message - From: Christie Mason To: wsg@webstandardsgroup.org Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 7:15 PM Subject: RE: [WSG] Beta Testers Needed for BCAT Wouldn't it have been easier to manage and more appropriate towards being welcoming to those using assistive