Re: [ZION] Liberal dems unveil...

2002-11-10 Thread Steven Montgomery
At 09:23 PM 11/9/2002, Marc wrote: in my opinion). Melchin is Progressive Conservative, which is the dynasty here, and has been since 1970 or so. Now there's an oxymoron if I ever heard one. How can one claim to be a progressive (which has socialist roots) and conservative (which ostensibly

Re: [ZION] Liberal dems unveil...

2002-11-10 Thread Marc A. Schindler
It's something the party takes a lot of ribbing for, but arose because in the Depression era, or even early for all I can remember, the Prairie-based Populist group, the Progressives, joined with the Tory, Bay Street boys, the Conservatives. Incidentally true conservatism as we understand it

Re: [ZION] Liberal dems unveil...

2002-11-10 Thread Steven Montgomery
At 10:56 AM 11/10/2002, you wrote: It's something the party takes a lot of ribbing for, but arose because in the Depression era, or even early for all I can remember, the Prairie-based Populist group, the Progressives, joined with the Tory, Bay Street boys, the Conservatives. Incidentally true

Re: [ZION] Liberal dems unveil...

2002-11-10 Thread Ronn Blankenship
At 12:26 PM 11/10/02, Steven Montgomery wrote: At 10:56 AM 11/10/2002, you wrote: It's something the party takes a lot of ribbing for, but arose because in the Depression era, or even early for all I can remember, the Prairie-based Populist group, the Progressives, joined with the Tory, Bay

RE: [ZION] Liberal dems unveil...

2002-11-10 Thread Jim Cobabe
24th Amendment The right of citizens of the United States to vote in any primary or other election for President or Vice President, for electors for President or Vice President, or for Senator or Representative in Congress, shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or any State by

Re: [ZION] Liberal dems unveil...

2002-11-10 Thread Marc A. Schindler
Hmm, I seem to recall from my 10th grade civics class that there was a stamp tax and a poll tax. The Quebec Act was only intolerable because it put a quick end to the fantasy that the rights of the Atlantic colonies extended forever westwards. Steven Montgomery wrote: At 10:56 AM 11/10/2002,

Re: [ZION] Liberal dems unveil...

2002-11-10 Thread Marc A. Schindler
I understand that. I was talking about the *British* imposing a poll tax on the colonies. I admit I'm only going from memory -- I just thought that was one of the intolerable acts. In any case, that Thatcher did this puts her in clear violation of the US constitutional principles she claims to

Re: [ZION] Liberal dems unveil...

2002-11-10 Thread John W. Redelfs
After much pondering, Marc A. Schindler favored us with: Hmm, I seem to recall from my 10th grade civics class that there was a stamp tax and a poll tax. The Quebec Act was only intolerable because it put a quick end to the fantasy that the rights of the Atlantic colonies extended forever

Re: [ZION] Liberal dems unveil...

2002-11-10 Thread Marc A. Schindler
Too true, but there really were overlapping and conflicting claims, even amongst the 13 colonies, let alone the rest of British North America (remember that there weren't just 13 colonies -- it's just that you learn about those specifically because they're later what became the USA). But I seem to

RE: [ZION] Liberal dems unveil...

2002-11-09 Thread Stephen Beecroft
-Jim- Senator Peolosi from San Francisco is being groomed to take over the top of the Dem heap in the Congress [...] It will be truly gratifying if such openly radical nuts dominate in the new Democrat organization. -John- [Steven] Choosing Senator Pelosi will ring a death knell for the

Re: [ZION] Liberal dems unveil...

2002-11-09 Thread Marc A. Schindler
Jon Spencer wrote: You sound quite a bit like McAuliffe and Daschle! Blame is a liberal vice. You'd never know that by hanging out around here :-/ Bush has total control of the Administration and Congress, but there's still bugbears under your bed, it seems. -- Marc A. Schindler Spruce

Re: [ZION] Liberal dems unveil...

2002-11-09 Thread Steven Montgomery
Who says there needs to be two major parties? I didn't read that in the 1st Presidency statement. The Democratic demise would pave the way for one of the third party movements, the Constitution party, Libertarian party, Independent American Party, etc. -- Steven Montgomery At 09:17 AM

Re: [ZION] Liberal dems unveil...

2002-11-09 Thread Marc A. Schindler
Indeed. This is also what seems to have happened in Turkey with the recent election, incidentally. A party with Islamist roots appears to have a much more pragmatic platform (in any case, Turkey's constitution declares the secular nature of the country, and the military have traditionally reined

Re: [ZION] Liberal dems unveil...

2002-11-09 Thread Jon Spencer
: [ZION] Liberal dems unveil... Jon Spencer wrote: You sound quite a bit like McAuliffe and Daschle! Blame is a liberal vice. You'd never know that by hanging out around here :-/ Bush has total control of the Administration and Congress, but there's still bugbears under your bed, it seems

Re: [ZION] Liberal dems unveil...

2002-11-09 Thread Marc A. Schindler
to fit either bugbears OR guilt under my bed. Jon - Original Message - From: Marc A. Schindler [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, November 09, 2002 12:24 PM Subject: Re: [ZION] Liberal dems unveil... Jon Spencer wrote: You sound quite a bit like McAuliffe

Re: [ZION] Liberal dems unveil...

2002-11-09 Thread Steven Montgomery
I'm just as concerned about one party domination as you are. One problem is that the Democratic Party has steered themselves way too far to the left. Meanwhile the Republican Party is full of RINO's (Republican in name only). What I meant to say previously was that there is no requirement that

Re: [ZION] Liberal dems unveil...

2002-11-09 Thread Marc A. Schindler
Not so far to the left that at least two well-known GAs have been active in the Utah party: Presidents Marlin K. Jensen and Faust. Pres. Jensen explained why, and what he felt he and like-minded LDS could do as a leavening contributor, in his famous interview with the Trib. Steven Montgomery

RE: [ZION] Liberal dems unveil...

2002-11-09 Thread Steven Montgomery
At 08:17 PM 11/9/2002, you wrote: Steven Montgomery wrote: --- I'm just as concerned about one party domination as you are. One problem is that the Democratic Party has steered themselves way too far to the left. --- It appears to me that partisan affiliation is largely irrelevant, at least at

Re: [ZION] Liberal dems unveil...

2002-11-09 Thread Steven Montgomery
Actually I've pondered the possibility of running as a democrat in the next State House election. The incumbent who just got reelected ran unopposed, there was no challenger from the Democratic Party. -- Steven Montgomery At 08:18 PM 11/9/2002, you wrote: Not so far to the left that at least

RE: [ZION] Liberal dems unveil...

2002-11-09 Thread Jim Cobabe
It is further obvious to me that some onlookers to the political scene lack the discernment to note that good and honest people cannot in good conscience affiliate, without serious reservations, with either of the major political groups in this country. I have every confidence that noted

Re: [ZION] Liberal dems unveil...

2002-11-08 Thread Marc A. Schindler
If I were you, I'd be more worried about what might happen if Administration policies fail. There's no Democratic Congress to blame anymore. Jim Cobabe wrote: Senator Peolosi from San Francisco is being groomed to take over the top of the Dem heap in the Congress, while many of the other rats

Re: [ZION] Liberal dems unveil...

2002-11-08 Thread Steven Montgomery
At 06:27 PM 11/8/2002, you wrote: Senator Peolosi from San Francisco is being groomed to take over the top of the Dem heap in the Congress, while many of the other rats abandon the sinking ship. Appears that she doesn't even attempt to hide her whacked-out leftist socialist feminazi idealism.

Re: [ZION] Liberal dems unveil...

2002-11-08 Thread John W. Redelfs
After much pondering, Steven Montgomery favored us with: If the Democratic party hopes to survive they would be wise to move to the center by backing Rep. Martin Frost of Texas, a moderate. Which is what I think will happen. Choosing Senator Pelosi will ring a death knell for the Democratic

Re: [ZION] Liberal dems unveil...

2002-11-08 Thread Steven Montgomery
At 07:20 PM 11/8/2002, you wrote: After much pondering, Steven Montgomery favored us with: If the Democratic party hopes to survive they would be wise to move to the center by backing Rep. Martin Frost of Texas, a moderate. Which is what I think will happen. Choosing Senator Pelosi will ring a