[Zope-Checkins] SVN: Zope/trunk/ Temporarily point the ZODB code at current 3.4 branch.

2005-04-06 Thread Tim Peters
Log message for revision 29892:
  Temporarily point the ZODB code at current 3.4 branch.
  
  That contains some of the changes from Jim's ZClasses branch.
  The other changes still need to be merged into Zope, but require
  using current ZODB code.  Pointing at the 3.4 branch allows for
  easy changing of both ZODB and Zope until all of this works.
  
  A proper tag for ZODB will be made later.
  

Changed:
  _U  Zope/trunk/lib/python/
  _U  Zope/trunk/utilities/

-=-

Property changes on: Zope/trunk/lib/python
___
Name: svn:externals
   - zope   
svn://svn.zope.org/repos/main/Zope3/tags/ZopeX3-3.0.0-Zope-2.8-a2/src/zope
BTrees svn://svn.zope.org/repos/main/ZODB/tags/3.4.0a2/src/BTrees
Persistencesvn://svn.zope.org/repos/main/ZODB/tags/3.4.0a2/src/Persistence
persistent svn://svn.zope.org/repos/main/ZODB/tags/3.4.0a2/src/persistent
ThreadedAsync  svn://svn.zope.org/repos/main/ZODB/tags/3.4.0a2/src/ThreadedAsync
transactionsvn://svn.zope.org/repos/main/ZODB/tags/3.4.0a2/src/transaction
ZEOsvn://svn.zope.org/repos/main/ZODB/tags/3.4.0a2/src/ZEO
ZODB   svn://svn.zope.org/repos/main/ZODB/tags/3.4.0a2/src/ZODB
ZopeUndo   svn://svn.zope.org/repos/main/ZODB/tags/3.4.0a2/src/ZopeUndo

   + zope   
svn://svn.zope.org/repos/main/Zope3/tags/ZopeX3-3.0.0-Zope-2.8-a2/src/zope
BTrees svn://svn.zope.org/repos/main/ZODB/branches/3.4/src/BTrees
Persistencesvn://svn.zope.org/repos/main/ZODB/branches/3.4/src/Persistence
persistent svn://svn.zope.org/repos/main/ZODB/branches/3.4/src/persistent
ThreadedAsync  svn://svn.zope.org/repos/main/ZODB/branches/3.4/src/ThreadedAsync
transactionsvn://svn.zope.org/repos/main/ZODB/branches/3.4/src/transaction
ZEOsvn://svn.zope.org/repos/main/ZODB/branches/3.4/src/ZEO
ZODB   svn://svn.zope.org/repos/main/ZODB/branches/3.4/src/ZODB
ZopeUndo   svn://svn.zope.org/repos/main/ZODB/branches/3.4/src/ZopeUndo



Property changes on: Zope/trunk/utilities
___
Name: svn:externals
   - ZODBTools  svn://svn.zope.org/repos/main/ZODB/tags/3.4.0a2/src/scripts

   + ZODBTools  svn://svn.zope.org/repos/main/ZODB/branches/3.4/src/scripts


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[Zope-dev] Re: brain.getObject and traversal

2005-04-06 Thread Andreas Jung

--On Mittwoch, 6. April 2005 10:16 Uhr +0100 Chris Withers 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


 It is really up to
Andreas whether or not to accept such a change on the 2.7 line.
Andreas, whatcha think?
Sorry, I have to catch up with this thread. I thought the problem was 
solved by
Tres new configuration option.

-aj

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[Zope-dev] Can't import objects in Zope 2.8a2

2005-04-06 Thread Santi Camps
Hi all,
I'm just trying recent Zope 2.8 a2 and I'm not able to import any .zexp 
file.   At the begin I thought that it could be caused by the zexp I was 
trying to import, but default Examples.zexp also cause the same error.   
I've tried with and without ZEO, and with and without debug mode, always 
the same result.I'm doing something wrong or this could be a bug ?

Thanks in advance
The obtained traceback is this one:
Time
2005/04/06 14:05:06.943 GMT+2
User Name (User Id)
admin (admin)
Request URL
http://localhost.localdomain:8083/manage_importObject
Exception Type
BdbQuit
Exception Value
Traceback (innermost last):
Module ZPublisher.Publish, line 113, in publish
Module ZPublisher.mapply, line 88, in mapply
Module ZPublisher.Publish, line 40, in call_object
Module OFS.ObjectManager, line 554, in manage_importObject
Module Shared.DC.Scripts.Bindings, line 311, in __call__
Module Shared.DC.Scripts.Bindings, line 348, in _bindAndExec
Module App.special_dtml, line 175, in _exec
Module DocumentTemplate.DT_Let, line 76, in render
Module DocumentTemplate.DT_In, line 703, in renderwob
Module App.PersistentExtra, line 44, in locked_in_version
Module ZODB.Connection, line 831, in modifiedInVersion
Module pdb, line 992, in set_trace
Module bdb, line 52, in trace_dispatch
Module bdb, line 80, in dispatch_return
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Re: [Zope-dev] Can't import objects in Zope 2.8a2

2005-04-06 Thread Jens Vagelpohl
On Apr 6, 2005, at 14:11, Santi Camps wrote:
Hi all,
I'm just trying recent Zope 2.8 a2 and I'm not able to import any 
.zexp file.   At the begin I thought that it could be caused by the 
zexp I was trying to import, but default Examples.zexp also cause the 
same error.   I've tried with and without ZEO, and with and without 
debug mode, always the same result.I'm doing something wrong or 
this could be a bug ?
LOL  looks like someone left a pdb.set_trace() in the 
ZODB.Connection.modifiedInVersion method...

jens
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[Zope-dev] I want Zope 2.9 to use Zope 3's security architecture.

2005-04-06 Thread Jim Fulton
I very much want Zope 2.9 to use Zope 3's security architecture.
Zope 3's security architecture is far more robust, but it is different
in some significant ways:
- It protects names not values.  This means that you protect
  how you access things, not the things themselves.
- It doesn't provide key-bases access control for mapping
  objects.  If you can get any key, you can get all keys.
  This is less powerful that Zope 2's security system, but
  this is power we haven't needed for Zope 3 and I suggest
  we don't really need it for Zope 2.
- Non-basic values passed from trusted code to untrusted code
  are security proxied and thus protected.  This means that the
  security framework has a much greater reach than in Zope 2,
  Even trusted code is subject to the security system in many
  cases.  This can be a good thing or a bad thing, depending
  on your point of view. :)
- The Zope 3 security system is much more pluggable.  This means
  that it is much easier to provide alternate security policies
  to meet special needs to or exclude unneeded features.
For more information on the security system, see:
http://svn.zope.org/Zope3/trunk/src/zope/security/untrustedinterpreter.txt?view=markup
http://svn.zope.org/Zope3/trunk/src/zope/security/README.txt?view=markup
http://svn.zope.org/Zope3/trunk/src/zope/app/securitypolicy/zopepolicy.txt?view=markup
http://www.zope.org/Wikis/DevSite/Projects/ComponentArchitecture/ProgrammerTutorial/programmers_tutorial.pdf
I see 2 main challenges:
- supporting implicit acquisition
- Backward incompatibilities:
  o No support for key-based access control
  o Trusted code will be subject to security restrictions
in cases in which it isn't now.
I think there will be a number of significant benefits, including:
- Greater security
- Less complexity
- Less risk with new Python versions
- Narrower gap between Zope 2 and Zope 3.
This will be a fairly large job.  I won't have time to work on it before this
Fall.  I could certianly use some help. :)
Are there any objections?  Suggestions? Questions?
Jim
--
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CTO  (540) 361-1714http://www.python.org
Zope Corporation http://www.zope.com   http://www.zope.org
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Re: [Zope-dev] Can't import objects in Zope 2.8a2

2005-04-06 Thread Andreas Jung

--On Mittwoch, 6. April 2005 14:22 Uhr +0200 Jens Vagelpohl 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

On Apr 6, 2005, at 14:11, Santi Camps wrote:
Hi all,
I'm just trying recent Zope 2.8 a2 and I'm not able to import any
.zexp file.   At the begin I thought that it could be caused by the
zexp I was trying to import, but default Examples.zexp also cause the
same error.   I've tried with and without ZEO, and with and without
debug mode, always the same result.I'm doing something wrong or
this could be a bug ?
LOL  looks like someone left a pdb.set_trace() in the
ZODB.Connection.modifiedInVersion method...
There was something with a pdb.set_trace() in ZODB code (on some Zope list
lately).
-aj

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Re: [Zope-dev] Can't import objects in Zope 2.8a2

2005-04-06 Thread Jens Vagelpohl
On Apr 6, 2005, at 15:00, Tim Peters wrote:
LOL  looks like someone left a pdb.set_trace() in the
ZODB.Connection.modifiedInVersion method...
Yup, that got checked in by mistake during the recent ZODB sprint at 
PyCon.

It's repaired on Zope trunk / ZODB 3.4a2, so try the trunk instead.
Another thing it proves is that Zope's test suite is somewhat lacking 
wink.
So I was clicking through svn.zope.org trying to find the ZODB code in 
question but couldn't, simply because I did not know what tag/branch 
the version stitched into Zope 2.8a2 is. How can you tell from looking 
at the Zope code on http://svn.zope.org which ZODB branch/tag is 
stitched in during checkout?

jens
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[Zope-dev] Re: brain.getObject and traversal

2005-04-06 Thread Tres Seaver
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Andreas Jung wrote:
 
 
 --On Mittwoch, 6. April 2005 10:16 Uhr +0100 Chris Withers
 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 

  It is really up to
 Andreas whether or not to accept such a change on the 2.7 line.


 Andreas, whatcha think?
 
 
 Sorry, I have to catch up with this thread. I thought the problem was
 solved by
 Tres new configuration option.

Chris wants to backport it to 2.7 x;  I'm opposed.  Your call.


Tres.
- --
===
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Zope Corporation  Zope Dealers   http://www.zope.com
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[Zope-dev] Re: brain.getObject and traversal

2005-04-06 Thread Andreas Jung

--On Mittwoch, 6. April 2005 9:32 Uhr -0400 Tres Seaver [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

Chris wants to backport it to 2.7 x;  I'm opposed.  Your call.
If it does not change the default behaviour we have in 2.7.5... why not...
Andreas


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[Zope-dev] Re: Can't import objects in Zope 2.8a2

2005-04-06 Thread Tres Seaver
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Jens Vagelpohl wrote:
 
 On Apr 6, 2005, at 15:00, Tim Peters wrote:
 
 LOL  looks like someone left a pdb.set_trace() in the
 ZODB.Connection.modifiedInVersion method...


 Yup, that got checked in by mistake during the recent ZODB sprint at
 PyCon.

 It's repaired on Zope trunk / ZODB 3.4a2, so try the trunk instead.

 Another thing it proves is that Zope's test suite is somewhat lacking
 wink.
 
 
 So I was clicking through svn.zope.org trying to find the ZODB code in
 question but couldn't, simply because I did not know what tag/branch the
 version stitched into Zope 2.8a2 is. How can you tell from looking at
 the Zope code on http://svn.zope.org which ZODB branch/tag is stitched
 in during checkout?

viewcvs doesn't seem to give access to the DAV properties of the
folders.  The name of the property is 'svn:externals', which contains a
list of name-URL mappings.


Tres.
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Re: [Zope-dev] opinion: speeding up large PUT uploads

2005-04-06 Thread Florent Guillaume
Chris McDonough  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 On Wed, 2005-04-06 at 00:45, Pavel Zaitsev wrote:
  If you look above I had problems with zope creating temp files, as I am 
  using Mac OS X and Webdav to Zope
  mounted on the same machine. There is some race condition on locks in 
  mach kernel, and sometimes zope
  dies, as open system call never returns. 
 
 That sounds bad.  I'm surprised you've had so much trouble with this.  I
 thought OS X was just BSD, and BSD works fine?

The webdav kernel drivers are known to have quite a number of problems
in Mac OS X 10.3 (don't know about upcoming Tiger).

Florent

-- 
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+33 1 40 33 71 59   http://nuxeo.com   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: [Zope-dev] Can't import objects in Zope 2.8a2

2005-04-06 Thread Tim Peters
[Jens Vagelpohl]
 So I was clicking through svn.zope.org trying to find the ZODB code in
 question but couldn't, simply because I did not know what tag/branch
 the version stitched into Zope 2.8a2 is. How can you tell from looking
 at the Zope code on http://svn.zope.org which ZODB branch/tag is
 stitched in during checkout?

Never tried before, and don't think you can.  From the root of a Zope
checkout, you can do:

svn proplist -v utilities lib/python
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Re: [Zope-dev] Can't import objects in Zope 2.8a2

2005-04-06 Thread Jens Vagelpohl
On Apr 6, 2005, at 17:50, Tim Peters wrote:
[Jens Vagelpohl]
So I was clicking through svn.zope.org trying to find the ZODB code in
question but couldn't, simply because I did not know what tag/branch
the version stitched into Zope 2.8a2 is. How can you tell from looking
at the Zope code on http://svn.zope.org which ZODB branch/tag is
stitched in during checkout?
Never tried before, and don't think you can.  From the root of a Zope
checkout, you can do:
svn proplist -v utilities lib/python
Well, I was trying to *avoid* making a checkout to see that detail, 
that's all...

jens
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Re: [Zope-dev] I want Zope 2.9 to use Zope 3's security architecture.

2005-04-06 Thread Paul Winkler
On Wed, Apr 06, 2005 at 08:33:39AM -0400, Jim Fulton wrote:
 
 I very much want Zope 2.9 to use Zope 3's security architecture.
 Zope 3's security architecture is far more robust, but it is different
 in some significant ways:
(snip)

Will this all be under the hood?
i.e. will Products have to be rewritten for 2.9?

i.e. will I still write:

security.declareProtected(SomePermission, 'foo')
def foo(self):
...

 I see 2 main challenges:
 
 - supporting implicit acquisition
 
 - Backward incompatibilities:
 
   o No support for key-based access control

Don't know what that is.

-- 

Paul Winkler
http://www.slinkp.com
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Re: [Zope-dev] I want Zope 2.9 to use Zope 3's security architecture.

2005-04-06 Thread Jim Fulton
Paul Winkler wrote:
On Wed, Apr 06, 2005 at 08:33:39AM -0400, Jim Fulton wrote:
I very much want Zope 2.9 to use Zope 3's security architecture.
Zope 3's security architecture is far more robust, but it is different
in some significant ways:
(snip)
Will this all be under the hood?
i.e. will Products have to be rewritten for 2.9?
I don't know.  I expect that most products would not
have to be rewritten.  I expect that *some* proucts
would.  (e.g. products that depend on key-based access
control.)
i.e. will I still write:
security.declareProtected(SomePermission, 'foo')
def foo(self):
...
That will work, and I don't see a need to deprecate it.
Eventually, though, I expect products to migrate to
ZCML-based security declarations.
...
 o No support for key-based access control

Don't know what that is.
It was/is possible to control access to mapping items
based on item values (e.g. key values).
Jim
--
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CTO  (540) 361-1714http://www.python.org
Zope Corporation http://www.zope.com   http://www.zope.org
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Re: [Zope-dev] I want Zope 2.9 to use Zope 3's security architecture.

2005-04-06 Thread Paul Winkler
On Wed, Apr 06, 2005 at 12:49:19PM -0400, Jim Fulton wrote:
  o No support for key-based access control
 
 
 Don't know what that is.
 
 It was/is possible to control access to mapping items
 based on item values (e.g. key values).

OK... I've never used this AFAIK.
Anybody know if it's a widely used feature?

-- 

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http://www.slinkp.com
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Re: [Zope-dev] I want Zope 2.9 to use Zope 3's security architecture.

2005-04-06 Thread Sidnei da Silva
On Wed, Apr 06, 2005 at 12:49:19PM -0400, Jim Fulton wrote:
| i.e. will I still write:
| 
| security.declareProtected(SomePermission, 'foo')
| def foo(self):
| ...
| 
| That will work, and I don't see a need to deprecate it.
| Eventually, though, I expect products to migrate to
| ZCML-based security declarations.

BTW, Five already allows ZCML-based security declarations, to the
extent supported by Zope 2. You can't protect assigning to instance
attributes by a permission until we move to Zope 3 security
implementation.

| It was/is possible to control access to mapping items
| based on item values (e.g. key values).

Is this related in any way to having a dictionary or callable in
__allow_access_to_unprotected_subobjects__?

I ask because we just started abusing this one *wink*.

-- 
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jumpy we are the knights who say INT! SHORT! and 
UNSINNNED LONGG!
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Re: [Zope-dev] Five within Zope 2.8 - really cool !

2005-04-06 Thread Martijn Faassen
Andreas Jung wrote:
I just would like to thank everyone working on the Five integration
with Zope 2.8. It's really easy and fun to work with views, view
classes, adapters and interfaces in a Zope 2 environment. I've always
tried to get around Zope 3 somehow but now I am at the point where I
am really convinced and healed :-) It was a good decision to ship
Five now instead in Zope 2.9 or so. I am sure Five will make Z2
application design a lot more  straight forward and
cleaner...thanks...great work.
Thanks on behalf of the Five developers and integrators! That's very 
nice to hear, especially coming from you!

Regards,
Martijn
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[Zope-dev] Zope 2.7.6 release schedule

2005-04-06 Thread Andreas Jung
The schedule for the next Zope release is a follows:
2.7.6 b1: April 13th
2.7.6 RC1: April 20th
2.7.6 final: April 27th
Although 2.7.5 had been relased lately, yesterdays hotfix and another bug 
justify a new release this month.

Andreas


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Re: [Zope-dev] I want Zope 2.9 to use Zope 3's security architecture.

2005-04-06 Thread Dieter Maurer
Jim Fulton wrote at 2005-4-6 08:33 -0400:

I very much want Zope 2.9 to use Zope 3's security architecture.
Zope 3's security architecture is far more robust, but it is different
in some significant ways:

Even small modifications to the security machinery tend to 
end up in lots of problems.

The latest prominent example: the changes introduced with
Zope 2.7.3: It took two releases (until 2.7.5) and
more than 6 months (at least in my memory) before everything
worked again as it should...

Hopefully, such a major change will not require 4, 5, 6
minor releases and years for stabilazation...

-- 
Dieter
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Re: [Zope-dev] I want Zope 2.9 to use Zope 3's security architecture.

2005-04-06 Thread Jim Fulton
Dieter Maurer wrote:
Jim Fulton wrote at 2005-4-6 08:33 -0400:
I very much want Zope 2.9 to use Zope 3's security architecture.
Zope 3's security architecture is far more robust, but it is different
in some significant ways:

Even small modifications to the security machinery tend to 
end up in lots of problems.

The latest prominent example: the changes introduced with
Zope 2.7.3: It took two releases (until 2.7.5) and
more than 6 months (at least in my memory) before everything
worked again as it should...
Hopefully, such a major change will not require 4, 5, 6
minor releases and years for stabilazation...
Hopefully not.  It depends on whether people choose to
test their application during the beta cycle or during
the release cycle.
This will be a *big* change.  Possibly, this will be
bigger than the change from 2.7 to 2.8.  I do think it
will provide significant benefits that justify the pain.
Of course, when we try it, we may find it is too painful
and we'll have to reconsider.
Jim
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[Zope-dev] SiteRoot and VHM

2005-04-06 Thread Florent Guillaume
After spending an hour helping someone debug a site that had an hidden 
SiteRoot somewhere that prevented a virtual host monster from working, 
it was suggested to me that if there's a virtual host monster, it 
should take precedence (and deactivates) any further SiteRoot. I think 
it's a good idea.

Should I create a patch ?
Florent
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Re: [Zope-dev] I want Zope 2.9 to use Zope 3's security architecture.

2005-04-06 Thread Richard Jones
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

On Thu, 7 Apr 2005 02:49 am, Jim Fulton wrote:
 Paul Winkler wrote:
  i.e. will I still write:
 
  security.declareProtected(SomePermission, 'foo')
  def foo(self):
  ...

 That will work, and I don't see a need to deprecate it.
 Eventually, though, I expect products to migrate to
 ZCML-based security declarations.

Is this a general trend for Zope 2? I'd rather see Zope 2 kinda avoid ZCML if 
possible. It's just one of those personal preference things, I suppose, but I 
know I'm not the only one who isn't that enamored of the ZCML approach. I 
actually like having the declarations all in the python code like it is in 
Zope 2.

I'd like to see the declarative style that Zope 2 move to using decorators. I 
was sitting in a presentation at PyCon talking about MetaClasses, and I 
finally *got* them. I realised that the security declarations in Zope 2 are a 
perfect fit for metaclasses and decorators. If only I had the time to 
actually implement this dream ;)

Note that this all comes from the perspective of someone whose only exposure 
to Zope 3 has been through two sprints. I've not actually tried to develop 
any sort of application using it. My day job is very firmly fixed in Zope 2, 
and isn't likely to change for a long time. So I'm definitely speaking from 
ignorance of real-world application development in Zope 3.


 Richard
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Re: [Zope-dev] I want Zope 2.9 to use Zope 3's security architecture.

2005-04-06 Thread Andreas Jung

--On Mittwoch, 6. April 2005 21:59 Uhr +0200 Dieter Maurer 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Jim Fulton wrote at 2005-4-6 08:33 -0400:
I very much want Zope 2.9 to use Zope 3's security architecture.
Zope 3's security architecture is far more robust, but it is different
in some significant ways:
Even small modifications to the security machinery tend to
end up in lots of problems.
The latest prominent example: the changes introduced with
Zope 2.7.3: It took two releases (until 2.7.5) and
more than 6 months (at least in my memory) before everything
worked again as it should...
I don't know exactly to which changes do you refer. Either little
people that this problem or people did not use these releases or
people did not test enough or people did not contribute enough
to fix this bug in time *wink*.
-aj

pgpU4uTM9RZcM.pgp
Description: PGP signature
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Re: [Zope] Problem with Z Psycopg

2005-04-06 Thread Lutz Steinborn
Hi,

try to ask frederico [EMAIL PROTECTED] the maintainer zpsycopg/da
directly.
We use postgresql 8.0.1 and psycopg 1.1.18 with out
this problems.

best regards

Lutz


On Mon, 4 Apr 2005 15:15:17 -0700
Jason Leach [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 I'm having a problem with Z Psycopg.  From time to time (quite
 often) it looses the connection with the database and I get:
Site Error
An error was encountered while publishing this resource.
Error Type: OperationalError
Error Value: no connection to the server
 
 Then I have to login then close and open the connection.  It
 then works for a while before bailing again.
 
 Does anyone know what would be causing this?
 
 Zope Version (Zope 2.7.3-0, python 2.3.4, linux2)
 Python Version 2.3.4 (#1, Oct 13 2004, 21:44:19) [GCC 2.95.4
 20011002(Debian prerelease)]
 And ZPsycopg is version 1.11
 



-- 
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 http://www.4c-wohnen.de
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Re: [Zope] Does anyone care whether we deprecate ZClasses?

2005-04-06 Thread Sascha Welter
(Tue, Apr 05, 2005 at 06:46:23PM -0400) [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote/schrieb/egrapse:
 From: Dieter Maurer [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 ZClasses feature prominently in the Zope book.
 
 Seems they are more recommended than the new development paradigm (which
 does not yet feature at all in the Zope book).

I don't know if I'm living under a rock or something, but I'm using Zope
on and off since about 2.5.1, and I've barely heard about archetypes.
So far I did not come across a simple introduction, tutorial,
or even explanation of them. Of course I haven't searched, but I guess
that is the point of Dieters remark. ZClasses, external methods and to 
some extend Python products byte you the moment you get to the Zope
documentation. 

The new stuff is that stuff I hear the buzzwords flying around, but
once I touch something of it, I'm lost pretty fast.

If something is the new and recommended way of doing things, it should
be first place in the docs. The Zope Bible has Python products before
other stuff IIRC, good. If the new stuff is so great and easy to use, 
it should also be easy to put some documentation of it in Chapter 2 or
3 of whatever the Zope Docs will be.

As for the question of depreciating ZClasses: 
I had started out with ZClasses once, got to know the limitations and am
now doing Python products. I've learned a lot using ZClasses, as one can
jumble and play around with object orientation much easier. Python
products offer a much steeper wall, there is much more that has to be
just right just to get started. So if the new stuff offers that
easy intro playground and has adequate docs, then replace ZClasses.

And btw, keep up the good work, thanks!

Sascha

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Re: [Zope] Does anyone care whether we deprecate ZClasses?

2005-04-06 Thread Jens Vagelpohl
On Apr 6, 2005, at 6:59, Andreas Jung wrote:

--On Dienstag, 5. April 2005 16:38 Uhr -0400 Jake [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

And that is probably the best arguement for keeping them around 
longer.
We should get to the point: if some people depend on ZClasses then 
they should
take over some responsibility in maintaining them in future releases. 
It can not be
that a feature regarded as obsolete (from the majority) and almost 
unmaintained and
untouched since  ages holds up further releases.
Amen. Actually, instead of maintaining them in the core the current 
users should immediately look at breaking it out of the core into a 
separate product, as suggested earlier, and maintain that product. I 
believe that would make it simpler both from a Zope maintainer 
perspective as well as from the ZClass maintainers' perspective.

jens
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Re: [Zope] Re: login page problem

2005-04-06 Thread Jens Vagelpohl
On Apr 6, 2005, at 0:52, Chris Withers wrote:
Dieter Maurer wrote:
exUserFolder has built in caching (positive and negative caches),
Dunno what that means, but SUF supports caching via standard 
RAMCacheManagers or ZSQL method caching.
negative caching means that there is a separate cache to cache failed 
user lookups for a while and return a failure immediately instead of 
re-trying the user lookup doing a (possibly expensive) user search in 
the underlying backend.It's a little bit like Squids negative_ttl, 
which is used to specify a duration for caching error responses. The 
negative cache allows the backend to recover and/or prevents backend 
overloading because otherwise every failing lookup would hit the 
backend again and again.

jens
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Re: [Zope] Set MIME type using ZPT

2005-04-06 Thread Cliff Ford
srikanth wrote:
Hi,
   I tried this one. But the html page takes the parameter as a string
but doenst 
Execute the pyhton function. I got all the functions (External methods)
all set.

The img tag I used is:
span tal:define=imagename result/filenameImg
src=loadImage?filename=imagename/span
Have a look at the generated html source. You have not said wither the 
probem is a mal-formed image tag, or the image tag failing to fetch the 
image.

Also, pay attention to Tino's comments on seurity. I only ever use a 
Serial Number, not Filename - that comes from a database.

Don't forget that image tags should have width, height and alt attributes.
Cliff
Because I am getting the filename from the resultset.
Once again thanks for all your time and patience.
Any help would be gr8.
Ta.
Srikanth.
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
Cliff Ford
Sent: Monday, April 04, 2005 11:15 PM
Cc: zope@zope.org
Subject: Re: [Zope] Set MIME type using ZPT
srikanth wrote:
Hi,
 I am using an external method to load an Image from the harddrive. 
The external method is as follows:

from email.MIMEImage import MIMEImage
##parameters=filename
def getDocument(filename):
 fname = '/mnt/'+filename;
input = open(fname,'r')
content = MIMEImage( input.read( ) )
input.close( )
return content
When I try to display the content in the webpage what I actually got 
is all raw data of the file rather the image. So how can I convert the

raw data to be dispalyed as image in the webpage. I am using ZPT to 
display the web page (image). If its dtml I could have used 
dtml-mime tag is there any equivalent to that in ZPT.

Any suggestion would be a gr8 help.

It is not clear exactly how you are using the Page Template. Typically 
the page would have an img tag that calls a python script that calls the

External Method. Remember the web browser fetches the image separately 
after the html has been received - so your img tag might look like this:
img src=getImage?filename=whatever ... and your getImage python 
script would look like this:

(type, encoding) = context.getMimeType(context.REQUEST.filename)
context.REQUEST.RESPONSE.setHeader('Content-Type', type)
context.REQUEST.RESPONSE.setHeader('Content-Disposition', 'inline;
return context.getDocumentCall(context.REQUEST.filename)
where getDocumentCall is the name of your External Method that calls the
getDocument External Method and getMimeType is another External Method 
that looks like this:

import mimetypes
def getMimeType(filename):
 return mimetypes.guess_type(filename)
and your own external method would look like this:
  ##parameters=filename
  def getDocument(filename):
fname = '/mnt/'+filename;
input = open(fname,'r')
content = input.read( )
input.close( )
return content
At the moment you seem to have skipped a step.
HTH
Cliff

Ta.
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RE: [Zope] Does anyone care whether we deprecate ZClasses?

2005-04-06 Thread Pascal Peregrina
About archetypes...

Documentation http://plone.org/documentation/archetypes

Nice presentation (in French) :
http://lsm2004.abul.org/IMG/pdf/slides_-_zope_archetypes_-_Gilles_Lenfant_.p
df
(look at the links on page 35)

Pascal

-Message d'origine-
De : [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] la part de
Sascha Welter
Envoyé : mercredi 6 avril 2005 09:44
À : zope@zope.org
Objet : Re: [Zope] Does anyone care whether we deprecate ZClasses?


(Tue, Apr 05, 2005 at 06:46:23PM -0400) [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote/schrieb/egrapse:
 From: Dieter Maurer [EMAIL PROTECTED]:
 ZClasses feature prominently in the Zope book.
 
 Seems they are more recommended than the new development paradigm (which
 does not yet feature at all in the Zope book).

I don't know if I'm living under a rock or something, but I'm using Zope
on and off since about 2.5.1, and I've barely heard about archetypes.
So far I did not come across a simple introduction, tutorial,
or even explanation of them. Of course I haven't searched, but I guess
that is the point of Dieters remark. ZClasses, external methods and to 
some extend Python products byte you the moment you get to the Zope
documentation. 

The new stuff is that stuff I hear the buzzwords flying around, but
once I touch something of it, I'm lost pretty fast.

If something is the new and recommended way of doing things, it should
be first place in the docs. The Zope Bible has Python products before
other stuff IIRC, good. If the new stuff is so great and easy to use, 
it should also be easy to put some documentation of it in Chapter 2 or
3 of whatever the Zope Docs will be.

As for the question of depreciating ZClasses: 
I had started out with ZClasses once, got to know the limitations and am
now doing Python products. I've learned a lot using ZClasses, as one can
jumble and play around with object orientation much easier. Python
products offer a much steeper wall, there is much more that has to be
just right just to get started. So if the new stuff offers that
easy intro playground and has adequate docs, then replace ZClasses.

And btw, keep up the good work, thanks!

Sascha

-- 
http://betabug.ch/blogs/ch-athens

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Re: [Zope] segregated users

2005-04-06 Thread Cliff Ford
It is possible, I have done something similar. My solution involves 
giving users a Local Role in a folder to which access is to be granted. 
I built a small utility (with ZClasses - doh) to make it easy for the 
Administrators to add users from a database.

Cliff
Tim Evans wrote:
I apologize if this issue is something that has been discussed before,
but I searched the archives to no avail.
I'm evaluating zope for a project, and I have some questions regarding
the extensibility of the user security model.
The company I work for would like to provide documents to clients via
the web, and only allow one particular client (or group of users from
the same client) access to those documents.  I don't want any user to
be able to detect the presence of any other user.  I essentially want
several sites, one for each client, with a group of administrative
users responsible for maintaining these sites and publishing content
to all of them.
What this would require is a group of administrators that can see all
sites, as well as restricted users with privileges to exactly one
site.
I'd also like to avoid having a role for each site, as that could get
ugly for almost 1000 clients.  It would also be great if we could
designate a user to administer only one site, so that they could only
publish data to one client.
I guess I want zope-level users and application-level users.  Is
this something that sane people do?
I don't really need a step-by-step, just a yes, that is possible or
a no, you're an idiot before I start digging in to try and do it.
Tim
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Re: [Zope] Re: login page problem

2005-04-06 Thread Cliff Ford
I am not sure I have much to add. I have been concerned about your 
product architecture and unusual login procedure, but that is really non 
of my business. Some of what you say below is inconsistent:

 One problem that concerns next query is that it took only one table
 for user details whereas i had one more table for district.
...
 userdetail table is linked using this district code.
From this, and what you said previously, I presume you have login 
working but for only the half of the users in one of the two User 
tables. I already suggested alternative ways of handling this.

If your folders are going to be Districts consider giving users who need 
to fill out forms in one District a Local Role in that District, and 
users who need access to many districts a Local Role in the Districts 
parent folder.

This correspondence is too long for anyone else to follow. Next time, 
may I suggest come back to the list with a new question in a new thread.

Cliff
prabuddha ray wrote:
HI Cliff,
  I was hoping another reply eagerly. hope you dint give up on me.
I've got some clarifications given below.
On Mon, 04 Apr 2005 16:08:50 +0100, Cliff Ford [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I am abstracting bits of your email below in case anyone else wants to
join in.
If you are going to use Plone I can't offer advice - I have looked at
Plone on three separate occasions, and recently read The Definitive
Guide to Plone, and have stil decided not to use it. I only say this to
make it clear that many applications are built without CMS and Plone.

I had no idea about this. i knew that zope acts as a app server and
plone is the front end tool.
In fact I'm building the store's site as a plone site in zope. As a
matter of fact i've not done much specific in plone . just built 2
tabpanes.
I configured the exUserFolder using the mysql database and as expected
it built up a seperate login system. so i believe it'll work on itself
without plone.
One problem that concerns next query is that it took only one table
for user details whereas i had one more table for district.

Two separate tables with User information is awkward! The user folders I
know of expect user information to come from one source. So you either
have to create two folders, each with its own acl_users (provided by one
of the User Folder Products), or you have to hack the User Folder
product to put in a Union select statement in place of a simple Select.
d quarters.

let me explain the login page flow. a dropdown list of districts is
available on load. on selecting a  district the page reloads and the
available users are listed in 2nd dropdown list.
after selecting the user the password is to be given. So that way i
need both the 'district' and the 'userdetail' table. actually the
district table has district code ,name and other stores related nfo.
userdetail table is linked using this district code.

You have not said whether the people in the different districts do
completely different things with different forms, or identical things
but specifying the district. If the former then it is no big deal to
create the folders manually, although it can be done programmtically.
You could set a Local Role equal to the district name and get that role
for users from the database. That way, users can only enter their own
district folder. If the latter, then you could retrieve the Username and
District from the User object for use in the forms (include the District
as a role).

users are of different level like store-in-charge, sys mgmt group,
vendors and normal users.
they are in all the districts. so depending on the user level diffrent
set of menu page are to be generated ie. users of same level in
diferent districts do same thing.
In earlier ASP version I handled this in the login page handler ASP
page and wanted to use the same logic here.
district shouldn't be the user role , 'userlevel' will act as user role here.
but the folders would be districtwise, I suppose.
honestly I'm little bogged out by the exuserFolder feature, its using
Dtml all the way and I'm sticking to ZPTs and script pythons.

Try working on the rest of your application to build up ZPT and Python
experience. As I said, managing users is tricky. Also, be aware that
Zope experts advise developers to produce file system based Products.
There are lots of simple Products that you can use and browse the code
to see how they work.
Cliff

I completely understand this. but the problem remains the same . how
do i customise these products acccording to my needs.
hope this helps you in helping me. waiting for your reply.
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Re: [Zope] Plone/Zope on Debian Sarge

2005-04-06 Thread Chris Withers
Robert (Jamie) Munro wrote:
Don't install Zope from OS packages like debian, they never get it right
and you will just end up getting confused ;-)
I don't come to this conclusion at all. 
That's 'cos you haven't run into the problems that come with using OS 
packages and the added level of maintenence they require (by the os 
package maintainers) - yet!

The only problem with the debian
package is that people on this list who don't know what is going on give
unhelpful answers.
Are you including yourself in that group? ;-) The recommendations not to 
use OS packages come from bitter experience of people who've experienced 
weird edge case errors and totally out of date software versions as a 
result of using OS packages, Debian and RedHat being prime examples...

This is the message that is printed by debian's /etc/init.d/zope2.7 when
no instances exist yet. Run mkzope2.7instance to make an instance.  As was
already mentioned, all this is explained by debconf when you install
debian on Zope. It's probably a bug worth fixing, though. It should say
No instances have been created yet.
Yes, my point exactly. If you use a standard source install, many more 
people will have seen any message you see and are likely to be able to 
help. Adding non-standard setup scripts like this means there's another 
opportunity for bugs to creep in and something else that needs to be 
maintained.

I think it's worth installing the zope package, but not the products from
the debian packages, unless they are zope2.7 packages, but there aren't
many of those.
Yes, layering a pluggable distribution system over a plugin system seems 
somewhat bizarre...

cheers,
Chris
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Re: [Zope] Plone/Zope on Debian Sarge

2005-04-06 Thread Chris Withers
charlie derr wrote:
I (a relative zope amateur) would offer my own counter-experience.  I 
recently set up zope-coreblog and zope2.7 (using packages from debian 
sarge/testing), and it's been running with very few issues for several 
months (and I additionally was able to get ldap integration working 
using the ldapuserfolder Product)
Wait till you want to use a feature or need a bugfix from a later point 
release than the one you're currently on ;-)

cheers,
Chris
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Re: [Zope] Re: login page problem

2005-04-06 Thread Chris Withers
Jens Vagelpohl wrote:
negative caching means that there is a separate cache to cache failed 
user lookups for a while and return a failure immediately instead of 
re-trying the user lookup doing a (possibly expensive) user search in 
the underlying backend.It's a little bit like Squids negative_ttl, which 
is used to specify a duration for caching error responses. The negative 
cache allows the backend to recover and/or prevents backend 
overloading because otherwise every failing lookup would hit the backend 
again and again.
Oh right, well, again, should be fairly trivial to setup with python 
scripts and RAMCacheManagers.

cheers,
Chris
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[Zope] login system discussion

2005-04-06 Thread prabuddha ray
I'm often failing to describe problems correctly,
   kindly bear for that.

lets revise,
  In my login page I've two tables used district and userdetail.
district table ( district_code, distname,  location ...)
userdetail (username ,password, empcode ,district_code ,ulevel ...)

user to district is n:1 mapping. 
So I need to have both these tables info in the XUF.

Anyway, i'm trying cookies as advised.
tell me how do i set a request var in my python script.
i tried : 
 request.set('invalid','1') 
 return context.REQUEST.RESPONSE.redirect('index_html') // back to login page

I'm using 'invalid' hidden field to display the 'login failure' msg.

body tal:define =valtest request/form/invalid|nothing// define 

b tal:condition=valtestInvalid Password .Re Type/b//msg 

nothing is happening


I'm working hard to get it done in Zope's way plz help
-- 
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[Zope] Re: Does anyone care whether we deprecate ZClasses?

2005-04-06 Thread Tres Seaver
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Jens Vagelpohl wrote:
 
 On Apr 6, 2005, at 6:59, Andreas Jung wrote:
 


 --On Dienstag, 5. April 2005 16:38 Uhr -0400 Jake [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 wrote:

 And that is probably the best arguement for keeping them around longer.


 We should get to the point: if some people depend on ZClasses then
 they should
 take over some responsibility in maintaining them in future releases.
 It can not be
 that a feature regarded as obsolete (from the majority) and almost
 unmaintained and
 untouched since  ages holds up further releases.
 
 
 Amen. Actually, instead of maintaining them in the core the current
 users should immediately look at breaking it out of the core into a
 separate product, as suggested earlier, and maintain that product. I
 believe that would make it simpler both from a Zope maintainer
 perspective as well as from the ZClass maintainers' perspective.

Perhaps once Jim's current work lands, that might be possible.  As it
is, most of the work to make ZClasses function in Zope 2.8 has been at
the ZODB level (I think);  I doubt that anyone (except Dieter!) plans to
dive from the frying pan of ZClass implementation into the fire of ZODB
code any time soon.


Tres.
- --
===
Tres Seaver[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Zope Corporation  Zope Dealers   http://www.zope.com
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Re: [Zope] ClockServer 0.1 released

2005-04-06 Thread Florent Guillaume
Chris McDonough  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 I was creeped out by Zope scheduling products that started a separate
 thread to call methods at scheduled intervals and I got tired of setting
 up cron+wget to call Zope methods via HTTP, thus:
  
 http://plope.com/software/ClockServer
 
 It works by posing as a medusa server, and injects things that look like
 http requests into the publisher every so often.

Very nice.

I'm confused about the need for an external module for timeslice.
What's wrong with:

def timeslice(period, when=0):
return when - (when % period)

Florent

-- 
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+33 1 40 33 71 59   http://nuxeo.com   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: [Zope] Does anyone care whether we deprecate ZClasses?

2005-04-06 Thread Lennart Regebro
 I don't know if I'm living under a rock or something, but I'm using Zope
 on and off since about 2.5.1, and I've barely heard about archetypes.
 So far I did not come across a simple introduction, tutorial,
 or even explanation of them.

The new stuff mentioned on this thread is the zope 3 component
architecture. With zope 2.8 it will be possible to start using the
same ideas (although not 100% compatible).

This will definitely be the new recommended way to do development, if
not in 2.8, then in 2.9, which hopefully will have great compatibilty
with zope3.

As mentioned, it is very important that the documentation get updated
to reflect this.

-- 
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CPS Content Management http://www.cps-project.org/
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Re: [Zope] Does anyone care whether we deprecate ZClasses?

2005-04-06 Thread Ausum Studio
Is this a kafkanian situation? Are really core developers asking the
community to kick a used Zope's feature, saying it's because it's hard to
maintain it, and simultaneously to say it's code 'unmaintained and untouched
since ages'? Folks, you didn't need to ask for the aproval of people who
didn't make it with that feature. You just do it. You're the ones that
create the knots and know for sure where they are, and if you aren't in the
mood anymore just give the thing over. :)

As of your remarks, Andreas,  I understand your point. People who care
should take over. Sounds fair. Just please don't mean that we who say yes to
a Jim's question are guilty of not letting Zope to move on, because Zope is
moving to X3, not to 2.X+five, and definitely not to Archetypes, a CMF
subject.

As for ZC,  IMHO the issue should be treated as a matter of understanding
the market rather than achieving a milestone. You created stuff that works
in some way or another that people embraced. You also changed your company
name to the name of the product of yours that people embraced. And no matter
how much hype there is on new trends, you should realize that a song is just
a song until the market say it's a hit, and that X3 is that song. Shall you
start to put Zope2 into pieces before getting to know you already have a
hit?  :)


Ausum


- Original Message - 
From: Andreas Jung [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Dieter Maurer [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: zope@zope.org
Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2005 11:59 PM
Subject: Re: [Zope] Does anyone care whether we deprecate ZClasses?

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Re: [Zope] Does anyone care whether we deprecate ZClasses?

2005-04-06 Thread Andreas Jung

--On Mittwoch, 6. April 2005 12:59 Uhr -0500 Ausum Studio 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Is this a kafkanian situation? Are really core developers asking the
community to kick a used Zope's feature, saying it's because it's hard to
maintain it, and simultaneously to say it's code 'unmaintained and
untouched since ages'?
I have not seen any significant changes to ZClasses since Zope 2.4/2.5 or
so (that's when I started working for ZC and learned about Zope). Now they
broke in Zope 2.8 and kept up the release and maybe only a small number
of people have the wisdom to maintain and fix outstanding issues.

As for ZC,  IMHO the issue should be treated as a matter of understanding
the market rather than achieving a milestone. You created stuff that works
in some way or another that people embraced. You also changed your company
name to the name of the product of yours that people embraced. And no
matter how much hype there is on new trends, you should realize that a
song is just a song until the market say it's a hit, and that X3 is that
song. Shall you start to put Zope2 into pieces before getting to know you
already have a hit?  :)
I don't understand what you want to say with that but ZC also lives from 
the
community and the community lives to a certain part of the work of ZC. So
is all about giving and taking :-)

-aj

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Re: [Zope] Does anyone care whether we deprecate ZClasses?

2005-04-06 Thread Jonathan Cyr




Yoohoo,

ZClasses are not an expert technology to use, they are an introduction
to Zope... Just because I use a thing, doesn't mean I can
support/maintain a thing. I can read the list, and try to help folks
with questions that I've experienced... that's the support that can be
offered at my skill level.

If that's not enough... fine... drop ZClasses, then DTML (you know,
its next)... and all the folks in this boat with me.

ZC should decide whether the benefits of ZClasses for low-end
developers match against the hurdles to keeping it with the newer Zope
releases. If they don't see a need for this skill-level type of tool
in Zope's feature list, they will pay down the road... Growth is king,
even for Zope, who grew this platform? Growth means newbies, right?
What elements got Zope to where it is? Could ZClasses be on that
list? Why?

And seeing comments like...

- "Move to Zope Python Products" - you cant see the skill differences
between OOP  Zope's API vs. ZClasses

- "Use the Archetypes/CMF/Plone setup" - UML training? the CMF API and
Plone underpinnings, easy?

- "Maintain it yourself then" - Update very slick code within Zope's
flexible and aging API, with ZODB API too? Maintain it...Yeah sure,
hows this afternoon.

... just show me how under-represented that beginner and intermediate
Zope developers use this list... and then I think, perhaps there aren't
any, just me and a few others... and if that's the case, Zope's
screwed, and the horse I rode in on.

And so here's the confession... "Hello, I'm Jon... I've used Zope for 2
years, and I can't help others program high-level Python OOP
tools/platform resources in a propriety web content management server.
I only can support their efforts when the occasional mailing list
opportunities present themselves."

-Jon Cyr, Intermediate Zope Developer
[EMAIL PROTECTED]








Andreas Jung wrote:

  
--On Dienstag, 5. April 2005 16:38 Uhr -0400 Jake
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  
  
  And that is probably the best arguement for
keeping them around longer.

  
  
We should get to the point: if some people depend on ZClasses then they
should
  
take over some responsibility in maintaining them in future releases.
It can not be
  
that a "feature" regarded as obsolete (from the majority) and almost
unmaintained and
  
untouched since ages holds up further releases. I agree with Jim that
they should be
  
officially deprecated - means they could be removed in Zope 2.10. We
could leave them
  
longer if they should work in further releases without further work. If
there are serious
  
problems in further releases with ZClasses holding up a new release we
should kick them.
  
So if you depend on ZClasseslearn how they are implemented and
maintain them in the
  
future. But from the prospective of limited resource it is not
reasonable to spend much
  
time on ZClasses in the future.
  
  
  
-aj
  
  
  
  
  
  

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Re: [Zope] Product creation difficulty

2005-04-06 Thread Dieter Maurer
Pete Taylor wrote at 2005-4-5 15:09 -0400:
Does anyone have a recommendation for a Product creation guide/tutorial
they've used and made work, preferably one with examples and explanations of
_ac_permissions

The Zope Developer Guide is the relevant documentation.

-- 
Dieter
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Re: [Zope] Multiple Browser Id Managers question

2005-04-06 Thread Dieter Maurer
David H wrote at 2005-4-5 12:46 -0700:
 ...
But I find that I *can* add additional Browser Id Managers in folders 
that can acquire the original browser id manager - without deleting the 
default copy in Zope root. 
Any thought ideas on this?  Does the principal still stand, e.g. Not 
good to put a browser id manager in a place that can also acquire 
another browser id manager?

Why would you like multiple BrowserIdManagers?
A single instance is enough...

-- 
Dieter
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Re: [Zope] Re: Does anyone care whether we deprecate ZClasses?

2005-04-06 Thread Dieter Maurer
Tres Seaver wrote at 2005-4-6 09:47 -0400:
 ...
Perhaps once Jim's current work lands, that might be possible.  As it
is, most of the work to make ZClasses function in Zope 2.8 has been at
the ZODB level (I think);  I doubt that anyone (except Dieter!) plans to
dive from the frying pan of ZClass implementation into the fire of ZODB
code any time soon.

And me, too, I am *VERY* happy that Jim proposed to make ZClasses work
again with the new ExtensionClass'es (and does not abandon ZClasses
right now).

-- 
Dieter
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Re: [Zope] segregated users

2005-04-06 Thread Dieter Maurer
Tim Evans wrote at 2005-4-5 16:23 -0500:
 ...
The company I work for would like to provide documents to clients via
the web, and only allow one particular client (or group of users from
the same client) access to those documents.  I don't want any user to
be able to detect the presence of any other user.

Then you must be quite strict with the permissions you grant
to Anonymous.

You should read about Zope's security system in the Zope Book
(2.6/2.7 edition, online).

 I essentially want
several sites, one for each client, with a group of administrative
users responsible for maintaining these sites and publishing content
to all of them.

You implement each site in a Folder with its own acl_users
(a so called UserFolder). Then users defined in such a folder
can only see access methods of objects outside this folder
when such access is granted to Anonymous.

You defined your administrators in the global acl_users.


-- 
Dieter
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Re: [Zope] Re: login page problem

2005-04-06 Thread Dieter Maurer
Chris Withers wrote at 2005-4-6 10:04 +0100:
 ...
Oh right, well, again, should be fairly trivial to setup with python 
scripts and RAMCacheManagers.

When I called exUserFolder a big brother of SimpleUserFolder
I did not want to imply that you can not add all the missing
features to SimpleUserFolder through additional infrastructures.

I is just that with exUserFolder, there is a management page
where you configure the parameters for the user cache -- that's all
of it. No special Python Scripts, no association with a RAMCacheManager,
no headache with invalidation (after user object changes through the API)...

-- 
Dieter
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[Zope] how to instantiate an External Method

2005-04-06 Thread Wladmir Araujo Chapetta
How can i instantiate a external method within my Container Product? 
I've tryed to do this as following:

...
from Products.ExternalMethod import ExternalMethod

class Container(Folder):
meta_type ='Container'



def __init__(self, id, title):
self.id = id
self.title = title



index_html = DTMLFile(dtml/indexContainer, globals())
search = PythonScript(id='search')

searchService=ExternalMethod('searchService','searchService','search','search')

.

The id and title are searchService . The module and function name
are 'search'  and they are located in Extensions directory in my
Container Product.


The following error is printed:
File /home/zope/Zope2.7.4/lib/python/OFS/Application.py, line 673,
in import_product
product=__import__(pname, global_dict, global_dict, silly)
  File /home/zope/Zope2.7.4/lib/python/Products/Container/__init__.py,
line 1, in ?
import Container,ItemSimples
  File /home/zope/Zope2.7.4/lib/python/Products/Container/Container.py,
line 22, in ?
class Container(Folder):
  File /home/zope/Zope2.7.4/lib/python/Products/Container/Container.py,
line 36, in Container

searchService=ExternalMethod('searchService','searchService','search','search')
TypeError: 'module' object is not callable

How could i solve it?
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Re: [Zope] Problem with Z Psycopg

2005-04-06 Thread Barry Pederson
Jeff Gentry wrote:
 On Tue, 5 Apr 2005, Dieter Maurer wrote:
Usually, this means that the postgres server process died...
 
 I did run into something recently where the local firewall was killing the
 connection to the DB server due to a timeout, so one of the local admin
 types wrote a small zsql method that gets hit by a cronjob about once an
 hour or so.
 
 Granted the end effect is the same (zope thinks that the DB server has
 died) but in this case it was the connection itself.

Yeah, I think Jeff nailed it.  I had FreeBSD's IPFilter set to drop idle states
after an hour.  Turns out FBSD by default does TCP keepalive, but only after 2
idle hours.  I changed the net.inet.tcp.keepidle sysctl to lower it to a
half-hour, so it now gooses the firewall often enough that I haven't seen a
dropped connection since then.

Looking back at the pgsql logs, I think I've always had this problem, but just
didn't realize it until I tried a new ZPsycopgDA that lacked the auto-reconnect
feature.

Even though tweaking TCP fixed the problem, I think it'd still be good if
ZPsycopgDA was able to auto-reconnect, because you could lose connections for
other reasons - such as restarting postgres - and it'd be nice to not have to go
and restart Zope too.

(I think it's kind of funny that I didn't find out about my TCP problem until
ZPsycopgDA failed to auto-reconnect, and I wouldn't have found out so soon about
ZPsycopgDA not auto-reconnecting if I didn't have the TCP problem :)

Barry
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Re: [Zope] Does anyone care whether we deprecate ZClasses?

2005-04-06 Thread Andreas Jung

--On Mittwoch, 6. April 2005 16:06 Uhr -0400 Jonathan Cyr [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

Yoohoo,
ZClasses are not an expert technology to use, they are an introduction to
Zope... Just because I use a thing, doesn't mean I can support/maintain a
thing.  I can read the list, and try to help folks with questions that
I've experienced... that's the support that can be offered at my skill
level.
There are better ways to learn Zope than by using ZClasses. They should no 
longer
be mentioned e.g. in the Zope Book.

If that's not enough... fine...  drop ZClasses, then DTML (you know, its
next)... and all the folks in this boat with me.
That's nonsense. Open-source is a giving and taking. Ok, you can demand 
something
*but* the resources of the people giving something to you are limited and 
restricted
by several constraints (company needs, personal time etc.). As said a bunch 
of times
earlier ZClasses help up the 2.8 release. Every software has its life-cycle 
it is sometimes
a good thing to drop old things over board *if* they tend to cause serious 
problems.
This is here the case. So my proposal was to deprecate them officially in 
2.8 with the
possibility to kick them in 2.10 or later. Read carefully (possibility). 
Means if they
do not hurt in 2.10 or 2.11 then could stay but ZClasses could be removed 
if major
resources would be necessary to fix them.

ZC should decide whether the benefits of ZClasses for low-end developers
match against the hurdles to keeping it with the newer Zope releases.  If
they don't see a need for this skill-level type of tool in Zope's feature
list, they will pay down the road... Growth is king, even for Zope, who
grew this platform?  Growth means newbies, right?  What elements got Zope
to where it is?  Could ZClasses be on that list?  Why?
And seeing comments like...
- Move to Zope Python Products - you cant see the skill differences
between OOP  Zope's API vs. ZClasses
- Use the Archetypes/CMF/Plone setup - UML training? the CMF API and
Plone underpinnings, easy?
If you are a somewhat clever (I assume you are) than you should be able
to adopt these technologies with a resonable amout of time. Using AT
as an example is easy and *more* straight forward than using ZClasses
where you can run against the wall very easily. From the programmers 
experiences
these frameworks are the future and definitely not ZClasses.

- Maintain it yourself then - Update very slick code within Zope's
flexible and aging API, with ZODB API too?  Maintain it...Yeah sure, hows
this afternoon.
See aboveif you have a need or interest in keep ZClasses you could pay 
Jim
some USD to fix ZClasses for you. I don't see it as a responsibility to 
provide
backward-compatibility for all and everything for ages. It would be nice to 
have
that *but* our resources are limited - they are especially limited because 
I see
little interest of the community helping out in Zope areas where work must 
be done.
Means the active people in the Zope community have/try to do help out in 
many fields
restricting their time from serious Zope work.

-aj


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[Zope] login system discussion

2005-04-06 Thread prabuddha ray
I'm often failing to describe problems correctly,
   kindly bear for that.

lets revise,
  In my login page I've two tables used district and userdetail.
district table ( district_code, distname,  location ...)
userdetail (username ,password, empcode ,district_code ,ulevel ...)

user to district is n:1 mapping. 
So I need to have both these tables info in the XUF.

Anyway, i'm trying cookies as advised.
tell me how do i set a request var in my python script.
i tried : 
 request.set('invalid','1') 
 return context.REQUEST.RESPONSE.redirect('index_html') // back to login page

I'm using 'invalid' hidden field to display the 'login failure' msg.

body tal:define =valtest request/form/invalid|nothing// define 

b tal:condition=valtestInvalid Password .Re Type/b//msg 

nothing is happening


I'm working hard to get it done in Zope's way plz help

-- 
Share the vision of difference with ME
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Re: [Zope] Does anyone care whether we deprecate ZClasses?

2005-04-06 Thread Dieter Maurer
Jonathan Cyr wrote at 2005-4-6 16:06 -0400:
... just show me how under-represented that beginner and intermediate 
Zope developers use this list... and then I think, perhaps there aren't 
any, just me and a few others... and if that's the case, Zope's screwed, 
and the horse I rode in on.

Do not worry too much!

Jim proposed to keep ZClasses alive until (at least) Zope 2.10.
And he asks whether there is enough interest to keep them longer...

If the Zope 2 releases progress in the same speed seen recently,
then Zope 2.10 will come in 4 to 6 years. That's a lot of time.
Of course, it is planned that future release cycles are much shorter
(one release every 6 months) but I do not yet buy that this will
indeed happen. Almost all releases were planned much earlier
than they happened.


And, we can keep ZClasses alive, at least until the next major
Persistency shakeup (after Jim made them working again for
the current Persistency shakeup) -- even when they are no longer
in the core.


In fact, I have had ten times more problems with Archetypes (which
I use now) than with ZClasses (which I used formerly).
It is true (and sad) that there are no unit tests for ZClasses
but ZClasses just broke twice in the past across releases
and the community quickly found
workarounds. These fixes were found much faster than those
for the security problems which were introduced from time to
time into Zope through security shakeups -- despite the fact
that there are unit tests for the security subsystem.


Thus, the right approach (in my view) is that all users
of ZClasses tell Jim, that ZClasses are used and interesting.
ZClasses may nevertheless get deprecated but probably kept
longer then Zope 2.10 unless they cause major problems.


For new projects, you should investigate the new options.
Product development will get much simpler with Zope3 technology
(and its schemas and views). Currently, there is no TTW
(Through The Web) development in Zope3 land, but that is planned.
In about 2 to 4 years, we may have new ZClass like
functionality implemented with Zope3 technology.
And I am quite confident that the old ZClasses will live til
then...


And so here's the confession... Hello, I'm Jon... I've used Zope for 2 
years, and I can't help others program high-level Python OOP 
tools/platform resources in a propriety web content management server.  
I only can support their efforts when the occasional mailing list 
opportunities present themselves.

That's fine. Continue with this support!


Do not worry too much about ZClasses. They will stay
for a significant time because Jim plans to take the next
major hurdle (thank you, Jim!).
After that, probably only small changes will
be necessary -- as in the past. We, the ZClass users, can
manage these minor changes -- as we did in the past.

-- 
Dieter
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[Zope] Does anyone care whether we deprecate Your Favourite Part of Zope

2005-04-06 Thread Andrew Milton
I think people on this list need to realize that eventually, the direction of
any significantly large Open Source project is hijacked by the relatively
small number of people actually doing the work.

The reasons for this are many-fold, but, normally come down to a lack of
communication between the developers and the users, which is realized in a
lack of understanding by the developers of what the users want.

This for the most part isn't generally a problem, until, the developers start
to do things for the user's own good, like remove features that are
kludgey, or a hack, or insert some other reason, which generally means
either noone wants to work on it, or some other change caused it to break, and
noone wants to fix it.

Now to the credit of the Zope guys, they actually poll the users to find out,
rather than just announce the demise of something. However, in general once 
you add a feature, you can be guaranteed, that somewhere, someone is using 
it, so removing it will always cause a problem. So there will always be an
uproar when you poll.

You're never going to be able to reduce the feature set between point
releases without upsetting some group of people. So why don't we stop all this
nonsense now, and just agree, that you're never going to do that d8) You have
Zope 3 to remove all the stuff you hate d8)

In my opinion if you change something, it's your responsibility to fix the
resulting breakage. That's part of your responsibiliity to the rest of the
community (i.e. the [mostly non-paying] customers). If you don't think you
have this responsibility to us, then you should work on your own version of
Zope, where you're not impacting anyone else.

For the record, I hate ZClasses... d8)

-- 
Andrew Milton
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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