[Zope-dev] Windows Binaries for 2.8b1

2005-04-25 Thread Christian Theune
Hi,

and again, I got to complain about building Zope on Windows. This time
it's the 2.8 branch again with the 2.8b1 release.

It looks like the WinBuilders aren't taken care for at all. The ZClass
tests didn't got into the procedure of getting packaged so I had to copy
those files manually for running the tests. Then the doctest module
doesn't comply with platform independent handling of path names using
'variable.split(/)' and relatives.

The now running tests fail pretty much in various places (Catalog,
ZODB, ...)

I'm not able to do any work on this as I'm lacking time. I took the job
of building the releases as long as it's pressing the do it now button
and running the tests seeing them pass. I did not take the job of
cleaning up Zope for Windows. The WinBuilders are a really annoying
thing, I'm glad they went away for Zope3.

To notice: Zope 2.8a1 has not been available as Windows release and
neither will be 2.8b1. You really want to blindly go forward for an RC
not having a single external user running any 2.8 release at all?

I'm pretty annoyed right now.

Cheers,
Christian

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fax +49 3496 30 99 118 - zope and plone consulting and development


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[Zope-dev] Re: Windows Binaries for 2.8b1

2005-04-25 Thread Florian Schulze
On Mon, 25 Apr 2005 10:54:23 +0200, Christian Theune [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Hi,
and again, I got to complain about building Zope on Windows. This time
it's the 2.8 branch again with the 2.8b1 release.
It looks like the WinBuilders aren't taken care for at all. The ZClass
tests didn't got into the procedure of getting packaged so I had to copy
those files manually for running the tests. Then the doctest module
doesn't comply with platform independent handling of path names using
'variable.split(/)' and relatives.
The now running tests fail pretty much in various places (Catalog,
ZODB, ...)
I'm not able to do any work on this as I'm lacking time. I took the job
of building the releases as long as it's pressing the do it now button
and running the tests seeing them pass. I did not take the job of
cleaning up Zope for Windows. The WinBuilders are a really annoying
thing, I'm glad they went away for Zope3.
To notice: Zope 2.8a1 has not been available as Windows release and
neither will be 2.8b1. You really want to blindly go forward for an RC
not having a single external user running any 2.8 release at all?
I'm pretty annoyed right now.
Cheers,
Christian
I wanted to look a bit into this, but quickly ran into problems. I checked 
out WinBuilders and Zope 2.8. I was easily able to use inst/configure.py 
and nmake to compile and install Zope. But how do I generate the Zope.tgz 
needed for WinBuilders? Will WinBuilders work with InnoSetup 5.0.8?

Regards,
Florian Schulze
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Re: [Zope-dev] Re: Windows Binaries for 2.8b1

2005-04-25 Thread Christian Theune
Am Montag, den 25.04.2005, 12:21 +0200 schrieb Florian Schulze:
 I wanted to look a bit into this, but quickly ran into problems. I checked 
 out WinBuilders and Zope 2.8. I was easily able to use inst/configure.py 
 and nmake to compile and install Zope. But how do I generate the Zope.tgz 

A tar-packed source checkout is ok.

 needed for WinBuilders? Will WinBuilders work with InnoSetup 5.0.8?

Not AFAIK.

Cheers,
CHristian

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[Zope-dev] ZEO, FastCGI and Shibboleth

2005-04-25 Thread John Snowdon
Hey Zope-Dev, 

We're currently in the middle of a UK JISC funded project to evaluate
the use of Shibboleth in authenticating access to electronic learning
resources in a Medical Education environment... we use Zope and ZEO
extensively already, in providing an online learning environment,
personal diaries and progress portfolios and many other aspects of the
MB BS degree scheme here at Newcastle.

I've been looking at the ways in which others have 'shibbolized' their
Zope systems... and most (well, the only ones I can find any technical
documentation on) have used the Apache + FastCGI approach, along with
the RemoteUserFolder product. I've already had test infrastructure in
place and have tested with client side certificates in place of a
working Shibboleth server (passing the Client cert CN as the remote user
variable) and everything works rather well.

The problem I'm facing is that the vast majority of the services we
offer are hosted on multiple ZEO nodes, behind a load balancing front
end server. 
This was a completely new infrastructure put in place less than a year
ago - replacing a monolithic (and ageing!) Sun Enterprise system... Each
node is lightweight, hosting only a ZEO instance... a physically
separate Apache server is used very rarely, and mainly only for serving
static content (static content URLs are caught by the load balancer and
sent off to Apache)... this setup has given us excellent performance,
and reducing Apache to a static content serving role has simplified
things greatly... so we are reticent to change this.

The only way I can see the Apache/FastCGI/ModShibboleth and
Zope/RemoteUserFolder setup working, is if each ZEO instance has its own
Apache server sitting in front of it which is something we have
moved away from for obvious reasons.

Has anyone any thoughts about how to go about shibboleth enabling a
whole host of ZEO instances... without each one having an Apache server
sitting in front of it? Or is there an alternative method out there that
perhaps is not widely known?

I know Zope4EDU is enabled, out of the box, but the licensing costs are
simply not affordable for the number of hosts (6 discrete hosts), sites
(at least half a dozen) and cpu's (12/14+) that we would be using...

Regards

-John

 John Snowdon - IT Support Specialist
-==-
 School of Medical Education Development 
 Faculty of Medical Sciences Computing
 University of Newcastle
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[Zope-dev] Re: [Zope-Coders] BTreeFolder2 for Zope 2.8?

2005-04-25 Thread Florent Guillaume
Andreas Jung  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Any objections to move BTreeFolder2 into the Zope core for Zope 2.8?
 BTF is widely used in  the Zope, CMF  Plone world and it would not hurt
 to ship it with Zope.

+1!

Florent

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[Zope-dev] Re: [Zope-Coders] BTreeFolder2 for Zope 2.8?

2005-04-25 Thread Andreas Jung

--On Montag, 25. April 2005 15:13 Uhr +0200 Florent Guillaume 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Andreas Jung  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Any objections to move BTreeFolder2 into the Zope core for Zope 2.8?
BTF is widely used in  the Zope, CMF  Plone world and it would not hurt
to ship it with Zope.
+1!
Done :)
-aj


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[Zope-dev] Data manager interface -- tpc_begin and other changes

2005-04-25 Thread Jim Fulton
This is for people who've implemented ZODB data managers.  Data managers
are components that manage persistent data under transaction control,
We've recently tried to clean up and document the data-manager
interfaces.  In addition, over the weekend, I implemented savepoints
and was able to simplify the interfaces quite a bit.  See IDataManager
and ISavePointDatamanager in:
  http://svn.zope.org/ZODB/trunk/src/transaction/interfaces.py?view=markup
In particular, note that:
- The subtransaction APIs have disappeared fro data managers, and
- tpc_begin no longer takes a second subtransaction argument.
I *could* try to provide support for data managers with tpc_begin
taking 2 arguments, but I'm guessing that I don't need to.  I'm guessing
that no one has written data managers that require a second argument.
If this is not true and you have a data manager that requires a second
argument that I need to support, please let me know.
Jim
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Re: [Zope-dev] RAMcache and container vs. context

2005-04-25 Thread Leonardo Rochael Almeida
Sorry for comming late into the fray :-)

Em Qui, 2005-04-21 às 19:46 -0400, Paul Winkler escreveu:
 On Fri, Apr 22, 2005 at 12:27:18AM +0200, Stefan H. Holek wrote:
  Note that aq_parent() gives you the URL parent, not the container. I 
  see no way around that as the return value of a script may well depend 
  on its context.
 
 Yes, it may, agreed. Thanks much for pointing out the relevant
 code, at least now I understand what's happening.
 
 But I still would like to argue against this behavior:
 There *is* an easy alternative, and that's to put one or more
 of the many location-related request variables into the
 cache manager's configuration.

This alternative won't help you when:

  * the pythonscript is sensitive to the context AND

  * it is called w/ 2 or more different contexts on the same request

An artificial example I can come up w/ from the top of my head: 
Suppose you have a folder w/ an index_html that displays information
about it's subfolders that is calculated by an expensive script and you
want to cache the results of this script, you'd go:

ul
 li tal:repeat=subfolder python: here.objectValues('Folder')
  Folder span tal:content=subfolder/title_or_id contains
  span tal:content=subfolder/expensively_calculate_shruberries
  shruberries.
 /li
/ul

Then you'd go and RAMCache expensively_calculate_shruberries

But if we implement the change you're suggesting, then this page would
list the same number of shruberries of the first subfolder for all of
them.

-1 from me

 For a related annoyance, see:
 http://www.zope.org/Collectors/CMF/343

This annoyance is indeed related, but the proper fix is for
FSPythonScript to have a ZCacheable_manage page that takes into account
the fact that it's usually part of a portal_skins setup and deal with
it. Alternativelly, portal_skins should provide the functionality of
expiring RAMCached subitems.

-- 
Leonardo Rochael Almeida [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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[Zope-dev] Re: 2.8.0b1 issues with plone 2.0.5

2005-04-25 Thread Christian Heimes
Tim Hicks wrote:
Apologies if this is already known about...
I just installed 2.8.0b1 (using python 2.3.5), fired it up, then tried to
add a 'plone site' (2.0.5).  The plone site actually did get added, but
here's what I got as well:
For the notes:
Latest versions of Plone 2.1 and CMF 1.4 are mostly working with Zope 
2.8. There are some issues due some changes in the ZCatalog api.

Christian
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Re: [Zope-dev] Re: 2.8.0b1 issues with plone 2.0.5

2005-04-25 Thread Jens Vagelpohl
On Apr 25, 2005, at 20:46, Christian Heimes wrote:
Tim Hicks wrote:
Apologies if this is already known about...
I just installed 2.8.0b1 (using python 2.3.5), fired it up, then 
tried to
add a 'plone site' (2.0.5).  The plone site actually did get added, 
but
here's what I got as well:
For the notes:
Latest versions of Plone 2.1 and CMF 1.4 are mostly working with Zope 
2.8. There are some issues due some changes in the ZCatalog api.
Christian, could you comment on this issue and let me know what the 
status is:

http://www.zope.org/Collectors/CMF/321
Thanks!
jens
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Re: [Zope-dev] RAMcache and container vs. context

2005-04-25 Thread Paul Winkler
On Mon, Apr 25, 2005 at 03:19:42PM -0300, Leonardo Rochael Almeida wrote:
 Sorry for comming late into the fray :-)
(snip)
 This alternative won't help you when:
 
   * the pythonscript is sensitive to the context AND
 
   * it is called w/ 2 or more different contexts on the same request
 
 An artificial example I can come up w/ from the top of my head: 
 Suppose you have a folder w/ an index_html that displays information
 about it's subfolders that is calculated by an expensive script and you
 want to cache the results of this script, you'd go:
 
 ul
  li tal:repeat=subfolder python: here.objectValues('Folder')
   Folder span tal:content=subfolder/title_or_id contains
   span tal:content=subfolder/expensively_calculate_shruberries
   shruberries.
  /li
 /ul
 
 Then you'd go and RAMCache expensively_calculate_shruberries
 
 But if we implement the change you're suggesting, then this page would
 list the same number of shruberries of the first subfolder for all of
 them.
 
 -1 from me

OK, and now that you've said all that, -1 from me as well;
I think the idiom you describe is very common.

That's why I like to discuss things on the list before filing
collector items :-)

I kinda wish the RAMCache manager allowed other things than
REQUEST variables for differentiation. Arbitrary TALES expressions
would be nice. Then we could get rid of this hard-coded gunk and
get the same effect by having context/getPhysicalPath as one
of the expressions.

But of course then you'd have the opportunity to kill your
cache performance by making the expressions too expensive.
Ah well, TANSTAAFL and all that. I'll probably just drop the idea.

  For a related annoyance, see:
  http://www.zope.org/Collectors/CMF/343
 
 This annoyance is indeed related, but the proper fix is for
 FSPythonScript to have a ZCacheable_manage page that takes into account
 the fact that it's usually part of a portal_skins setup and deal with
 it. Alternativelly, portal_skins should provide the functionality of
 expiring RAMCached subitems.

Of those, I'd prefer the latter approach. Added this as a comment
to #343.

Thanks for the valuable input!
 
-- 

Paul Winkler
http://www.slinkp.com
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Re: [Zope-dev] Windows Binaries for 2.8b1

2005-04-25 Thread Tim Peters
[Christian Theune]
 and again, I got to complain about building Zope on Windows.
 This time it's the 2.8 branch again with the 2.8b1 release.

 It looks like the WinBuilders aren't taken care for at all.

AFAIK, nobody looks at WinBuilders between releases.  It's
traditionally been the job of whoever builds the Windows installer to
sort out whatever troubles WinBuilders has gotten into since the last
release.  Certainly most Linux contributors aren't even aware of
WinBuilder's existence.

 The ZClass tests didn't got into the procedure of getting packaged
 so I had to copy those files manually for running the tests. Then
 the doctest module doesn't comply with platform independent
 handling of path names using 'variable.split(/)' and relatives.
 
 The now running tests fail pretty much in various places (Catalog,
 ZODB, ...)

What exactly do you do to run tests?  This is exactly what I do:

svn up
python setup.py build_ext -i
python test.py -vv --all

The same two tests have been failing on Windows that way since last
October, but all other tests pass.

BTW, I don't have a guess about what your doctest complaint is. 
Since, e.g., all the doctest-based tests _do_ pass from a checkout,
hard to guess what you're saying there.  It's documented that, e.g.,
relative paths passed to DocFileSuite must use '/' as the path
separator, and AFAIK all the code that's checked in does do that.  I
don't know of any other piece of doctest that cares about path
separators.

 I'm not able to do any work on this as I'm lacking time. I took the
 job of building the releases as long as it's pressing the do it now
 button

Or in the case of WinBuilders, a few dozen buttons, shell scripts,
makefiles, and tricks building on 1.6 gigabytes of Cygwin code wink.

 and running the tests seeing them pass. I did not take the job of
 cleaning up Zope for Windows. The WinBuilders are a really
 annoying thing, I'm glad they went away for Zope3.

Came with costs too, though.  For example, Zope3 on Windows doesn't
include Python, doesn't include the Python Windows extensions, and
comes with no support for running as a Windows service.  You might
think that people who value that stuff would contribute something
toward making it happen, but in project after project in the Open
Source world it's difficult to attract Windows contributors.

 To notice: Zope 2.8a1 has not been available as Windows release
 and neither will be 2.8b1. You really want to blindly go forward for
 an RC not having a single external user running any 2.8 release
 at all?

I suspect it's worse than just that.  When the two tests in collector
1728 started failing last October on Windows, I noted at the time that
FYI, on WinXP, Zope 2.8 appears to use localhost no matter what
ip-address is set to in zope.conf.  No reason to suspect that got
better, since the two failing tests that inspired that little
investigation are still failing.

 I'm pretty annoyed right now.
 
 Cheers,

I just liked the contrast in those two lines wink.
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Re: [Zope-dev] Windows Binaries for 2.8b1

2005-04-25 Thread Tim Peters
LOL -- the attempt to send my last msg to Christian from my gmail
account got blocked:

This is an automatically generated Delivery Status Notification

Delivery to the following recipient failed permanently:

[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Technical details of permanent failure:
PERM_FAILURE: SMTP Error (state 9): 553 5.3.0 Spam blocked see:
http://spamcop.net/bl.shtml?64.233.184.203

- Original message -

Received: by 10.54.47.20 with SMTP id u20mr2106929wru;
   Mon, 25 Apr 2005 13:37:01 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by 10.54.46.75 with HTTP; Mon, 25 Apr 2005 13:37:01 -0700 (PDT)
Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Mon, 25 Apr 2005 16:37:01 -0400
From: Tim Peters [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: Tim Peters [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Christian Theune [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [Zope-dev] Windows Binaries for 2.8b1
Cc: zope-dev@zope.org

  - Message truncated -

You should really be using SpamBayes 0.9 wink.
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[Zope-dev] Raw-input control for input widgets

2005-04-25 Thread Jim Fulton
I'd like to have more control over input widgets.  I'd like to
have a way to get, set, and clear their raw input.  The main use case
for this is to be able to store unprocessed raw inputs:
- in wizards or multi-page forms
- to allow a user to leave a task and return to it later
A secondary use case is to allow inputs to be cleared so that
user inputs aren't displayed after a form is redisplayed after
acting on previous inputs.
I believe we discussed this a couple of years ago, but nothing
was ever done.
Thoughts?  Unfortunately, I don't think we can do anything
for this before 3.2.
Jim
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[Zope-dev] Re: Raw-input control for input widgets

2005-04-25 Thread Jim Fulton
Sorry, wrong list, although, with Zope 2.8, including Zope 3,
I suppose it applies.
Hm, I suppose we should be thinking about folding Zope 3
development discussion back into zope-dev.
Jim
Jim Fulton wrote:
I'd like to have more control over input widgets.  I'd like to
have a way to get, set, and clear their raw input.  The main use case
for this is to be able to store unprocessed raw inputs:
- in wizards or multi-page forms
- to allow a user to leave a task and return to it later
A secondary use case is to allow inputs to be cleared so that
user inputs aren't displayed after a form is redisplayed after
acting on previous inputs.
I believe we discussed this a couple of years ago, but nothing
was ever done.
Thoughts?  Unfortunately, I don't think we can do anything
for this before 3.2.
Jim

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Re: [Zope-dev] Re: Raw-input control for input widgets

2005-04-25 Thread Stephan Richter
On Monday 25 April 2005 17:56, Jim Fulton wrote:
 Hm, I suppose we should be thinking about folding Zope 3
 development discussion back into zope-dev.

Please let's not do this. There is 95% mail traffic on Zope-Dev I am not 
interested in, but 95% on Zope3-Dev that is of value to me. I think it would 
be premature to merge the lists again.

Regards,
Stephan
-- 
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CBU Physics  Chemistry (B.S.) / Tufts Physics (Ph.D. student)
Web2k - Web Software Design, Development and Training
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Re: [Zope-dev] Windows Binaries for 2.8b1

2005-04-25 Thread Florent Guillaume
Tim Peters  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 LOL -- the attempt to send my last msg to Christian from my gmail
 account got blocked:
 
 This is an automatically generated Delivery Status Notification
 
 Delivery to the following recipient failed permanently:
 
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 
 Technical details of permanent failure:
 PERM_FAILURE: SMTP Error (state 9): 553 5.3.0 Spam blocked see:
 http://spamcop.net/bl.shtml?64.233.184.203

Yeah this goes to show that you have to be extremely careful in choosing
your RBL sources... And that spamcop is definitely not a good one.

Florent

-- 
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+33 1 40 33 71 59   http://nuxeo.com   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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