Re: [Zope3-dev] Python version for Zope 3.4 ?
Jeff Shell wrote: On 9/28/06, Martijn Faassen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Jim Fulton wrote: Baiju M wrote: Hi, What is the target Python version for Zope 3.4, is it Python 2.5? That's a good question. I fear it will take a fair bit of work to get to it and, frankly for me there are higher priorities. I think we'd be okay in not supporting Python 2.5 yet for this release. Python 2.5 has just been released, and the 9 months or so will give it time to gell out, Python extensions a bit of time to catch up with the newer version, and for us to do some experimenting. Linux distributions will likely still be supporting Python 2.4 (along with 2.5) at that stage as well. Are you talking not-supporting Python 2.5 at all? Or just not wanting to require it? I'm talking about not supporting it at all. As I just posted elsethread, I do not think we should spare the development resources to make this work. It's a lots of added overhead to the process. If Zope 3 can't at least run on Python 2.5 within three months of Python 2.5's release, I don't think that looks good for us. I would hope that by being more Pythonic and free from the old ExtensionClass magic - especially in Zope 3 - that Zope could keep better pace with Python. But nine months? A year? Can I expect the developers of toolkits we use, in some cases more heavily than Zope itself, like SQLAlchemy to hold off on requiring Python 2.5 for that long? I don't know. All I know is we can't spare the resources to support both. Either we go for Python 2.5 completely or we don't at all this release cycle. I must also note that many Linux distributions also have half-year or longer packaging cycles. The new Ubuntu is surely not going to have much Python 2.5 in it. So unless a volunteer steps up to do lots of hard work between now and march next year, let's stick with Python 2.4. Otherwise let's plan it in for Zope 3.5 and Zope 2.12 I really really really hope it doesn't take that long to be able to at least run on Python 2.5: even if it has to be with some caveats or mild warnings. If it works that way without the core developers having to do any additional work, then your wish may become true. That's a far cry from official support, though. If security and restricted python / security proxies are the main issue, what about if one is running Zope sites with absolutely ZERO through the web code - no page templates, nothing - can't there be a lighter weight security implementation that wouldn't take half a year of lots of hard work? It's going to be a significant investment of work to make sure everything works with Python 2.5. Either someone credible steps up, convinces us, and does the work, and we all move over to Python 2.5. If they don't, we do it the next cycle. Regards, Martijn ___ Zope3-dev mailing list Zope3-dev@zope.org Unsub: http://mail.zope.org/mailman/options/zope3-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Zope3-dev] Python version for Zope 3.4 ?
On 9/29/06, Martijn Faassen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It's going to be a significant investment of work to make sure everything works with Python 2.5. Either someone credible steps up, convinces us, and does the work, and we all move over to Python 2.5. If they don't, we do it the next cycle. Initially I asked this question just out of curiosity, because some other Python web frameworks already started some efforts [1]. [1] http://code.djangoproject.com/ticket/2771 http://trac.turbogears.org/turbogears/wiki/python2.5 Regards, Baiju M ___ Zope3-dev mailing list Zope3-dev@zope.org Unsub: http://mail.zope.org/mailman/options/zope3-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Zope3-dev] Python version for Zope 3.4 ?
On 9/29/06, Baiju M [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 9/29/06, Martijn Faassen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It's going to be a significant investment of work to make sure everything works with Python 2.5. Either someone credible steps up, convinces us, and does the work, and we all move over to Python 2.5. If they don't, we do it the next cycle. Initially I asked this question just out of curiosity, because some other Python web frameworks already started some efforts [1]. Let me fix some simple warings in trunk like this: Warning: 'with' will become a reserved keyword in Python 2.6 I know that this not going to help us to support Python 2.5, though just a beginning. Regards, Baiju M ___ Zope3-dev mailing list Zope3-dev@zope.org Unsub: http://mail.zope.org/mailman/options/zope3-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Zope3-dev] Python version for Zope 3.4 ?
Baiju M wrote: On 9/29/06, Martijn Faassen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It's going to be a significant investment of work to make sure everything works with Python 2.5. Either someone credible steps up, convinces us, and does the work, and we all move over to Python 2.5. If they don't, we do it the next cycle. Initially I asked this question just out of curiosity, because some other Python web frameworks already started some efforts [1]. [1] http://code.djangoproject.com/ticket/2771 http://trac.turbogears.org/turbogears/wiki/python2.5 It's a good question, of course. We have a *lot* of code to carry over to Python 2.5 though. Zope 3 is probably doable with moderate effort, but since we want to keep Zope 3 and Zope 2 in synch, we also need to port over Zope 2 to Python 2.5, and that looks like it's going to be much harder. Regards, Martijn ___ Zope3-dev mailing list Zope3-dev@zope.org Unsub: http://mail.zope.org/mailman/options/zope3-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Zope3-dev] Python version for Zope 3.4 ?
Baiju M wrote: On 9/29/06, Baiju M [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 9/29/06, Martijn Faassen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It's going to be a significant investment of work to make sure everything works with Python 2.5. Either someone credible steps up, convinces us, and does the work, and we all move over to Python 2.5. If they don't, we do it the next cycle. Initially I asked this question just out of curiosity, because some other Python web frameworks already started some efforts [1]. Let me fix some simple warings in trunk like this: Warning: 'with' will become a reserved keyword in Python 2.6 I know that this not going to help us to support Python 2.5, though just a beginning. Good plan! This is easy to maintain for Python 2.4 and at least we'd be making progress. :) Regards, Martijn ___ Zope3-dev mailing list Zope3-dev@zope.org Unsub: http://mail.zope.org/mailman/options/zope3-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Zope3-dev] Python version for Zope 3.4 ?
Baiju M wrote: Hi, What is the target Python version for Zope 3.4, is it Python 2.5? That would be loverly for both 3.4 and 2.11 :-D Chris -- Simplistix - Content Management, Zope Python Consulting - http://www.simplistix.co.uk ___ Zope3-dev mailing list Zope3-dev@zope.org Unsub: http://mail.zope.org/mailman/options/zope3-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Zope3-dev] Python version for Zope 3.4 ?
Baiju M wrote: Hi, What is the target Python version for Zope 3.4, is it Python 2.5? That's a good question. I fear it will take a fair bit of work to get to it and, frankly for me there are higher priorities. Jim -- Jim Fulton mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Python Powered! CTO (540) 361-1714http://www.python.org Zope Corporation http://www.zope.com http://www.zope.org ___ Zope3-dev mailing list Zope3-dev@zope.org Unsub: http://mail.zope.org/mailman/options/zope3-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Zope3-dev] Python version for Zope 3.4 ?
Chris Withers wrote: Baiju M wrote: Hi, What is the target Python version for Zope 3.4, is it Python 2.5? That would be loverly for both 3.4 and 2.11 :-D I think it will require a huge effort to get Zope 2 working with Python 2.5. Either: - We need to change Zope 2 to use Zope 3's security system, or - the RestrictedPython package will need to be reengineered to work with the substantially changed Python compiler and many new language features. I suspect that even Zope 3's security system will need a fair bit of work: - We need to rework or replace the small bit of RestrictedPython we use, and - If new Python type slots have been added, we'll need to reflect them in zope.proxy. Jim -- Jim Fulton mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Python Powered! CTO (540) 361-1714http://www.python.org Zope Corporation http://www.zope.com http://www.zope.org ___ Zope3-dev mailing list Zope3-dev@zope.org Unsub: http://mail.zope.org/mailman/options/zope3-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Zope3-dev] Python version for Zope 3.4 ?
Jim Fulton wrote: Baiju M wrote: Hi, What is the target Python version for Zope 3.4, is it Python 2.5? That's a good question. I fear it will take a fair bit of work to get to it and, frankly for me there are higher priorities. I think we'd be okay in not supporting Python 2.5 yet for this release. Python 2.5 has just been released, and the 9 months or so will give it time to gell out, Python extensions a bit of time to catch up with the newer version, and for us to do some experimenting. Linux distributions will likely still be supporting Python 2.4 (along with 2.5) at that stage as well. So unless a volunteer steps up to do lots of hard work between now and march next year, let's stick with Python 2.4. Otherwise let's plan it in for Zope 3.5 and Zope 2.12 Regards, Martijn ___ Zope3-dev mailing list Zope3-dev@zope.org Unsub: http://mail.zope.org/mailman/options/zope3-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: Re: [Zope3-dev] Python version for Zope 3.4 ?
On 9/28/06, Martijn Faassen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Jim Fulton wrote: Baiju M wrote: Hi, What is the target Python version for Zope 3.4, is it Python 2.5? That's a good question. I fear it will take a fair bit of work to get to it and, frankly for me there are higher priorities. I think we'd be okay in not supporting Python 2.5 yet for this release. Python 2.5 has just been released, and the 9 months or so will give it time to gell out, Python extensions a bit of time to catch up with the newer version, and for us to do some experimenting. Linux distributions will likely still be supporting Python 2.4 (along with 2.5) at that stage as well. Are you talking not-supporting Python 2.5 at all? Or just not wanting to require it? If Zope 3 can't at least run on Python 2.5 within three months of Python 2.5's release, I don't think that looks good for us. I would hope that by being more Pythonic and free from the old ExtensionClass magic - especially in Zope 3 - that Zope could keep better pace with Python. But nine months? A year? Can I expect the developers of toolkits we use, in some cases more heavily than Zope itself, like SQLAlchemy to hold off on requiring Python 2.5 for that long? So unless a volunteer steps up to do lots of hard work between now and march next year, let's stick with Python 2.4. Otherwise let's plan it in for Zope 3.5 and Zope 2.12 I really really really hope it doesn't take that long to be able to at least run on Python 2.5: even if it has to be with some caveats or mild warnings. If security and restricted python / security proxies are the main issue, what about if one is running Zope sites with absolutely ZERO through the web code - no page templates, nothing - can't there be a lighter weight security implementation that wouldn't take half a year of lots of hard work? -- Jeff Shell ___ Zope3-dev mailing list Zope3-dev@zope.org Unsub: http://mail.zope.org/mailman/options/zope3-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
[Zope3-dev] Python version for Zope 3.4 ?
Hi, What is the target Python version for Zope 3.4, is it Python 2.5? Regards, Baiju M ___ Zope3-dev mailing list Zope3-dev@zope.org Unsub: http://mail.zope.org/mailman/options/zope3-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
Re: [Zope3-dev] Python version for Zope 3.4 ?
Morning, Baiju M wrote: Hi, What is the target Python version for Zope 3.4, is it Python 2.5? Right now it's still Python 2.4, as Zope 3.4 is scheduled for next year, we should consider using Python 2.5 though. Christian -- gocept gmbh co. kg - forsterstraße 29 - 06112 halle/saale - germany www.gocept.com - [EMAIL PROTECTED] - phone +49 345 122 9889 7 - fax +49 345 122 9889 1 - zope and plone consulting and development signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ Zope3-dev mailing list Zope3-dev@zope.org Unsub: http://mail.zope.org/mailman/options/zope3-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com
