Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-31 Thread Jim Fulton
Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: ... - this portlet uses this style not for a *class* of portlets, but for *instances* of classes. Adapters connect interfaces, not instances. Then why not just store the style in the portlet? Again you are making the assumption that a portlet *has* a style. If

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-31 Thread Jean-Marc Orliaguet
Jim Fulton wrote: Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: ... Also this is as bad as storing browser view related attributes in a content class - otherwise we are back to the Zope2 old days, where every possible attribute was stored on the objects themselves. There are advantages in storing data on

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-30 Thread Tonico Strasser
Hi! Jean-Marc Orliaguet schrieb: Anyway, pagelets or portlets whatever they called and no matter what data they produce (structured data or raw HTML) must be pipe-able through the rendering engine, i.e. they must return some data, the more ready HTML the data is the less reusable it will be.

Re: [Z3lab] Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-30 Thread Jean-Marc Orliaguet
Tonico Strasser wrote: Hi! Jean-Marc Orliaguet schrieb: Anyway, pagelets or portlets whatever they called and no matter what data they produce (structured data or raw HTML) must be pipe-able through the rendering engine, i.e. they must return some data, the more ready HTML the data is the

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-30 Thread Jim Fulton
Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: Jim Fulton wrote: Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: basically if the slot that you're thinking about contains portlets then it's a sort of slot not a sort of portlet. Cool. So we can define new slot-like things (for example, for JSR 168-style slots) and use your

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-30 Thread Jean-Marc Orliaguet
Jim Fulton wrote: Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: Jim Fulton wrote: Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: basically if the slot that you're thinking about contains portlets then it's a sort of slot not a sort of portlet. Cool. So we can define new slot-like things (for example, for JSR 168-style

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-30 Thread Jim Fulton
Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: Jim Fulton wrote: Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: Jim Fulton wrote: Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: basically if the slot that you're thinking about contains portlets then it's a sort of slot not a sort of portlet. Cool. So we can define new slot-like things

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-30 Thread Jim Fulton
Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: Jim Fulton wrote: Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: this is more a design feature than an implementation feature. Could you explain *why* you need relations? yes, because adapters provide flexible relations between *components* (interfaces, classes), but not

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-30 Thread Jean-Marc Orliaguet
Jim Fulton wrote: Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: Jim Fulton wrote: - this portlet uses this widget I'm confused. In the doctest you pointed out: https://svn.nuxeo.org/trac/pub/file/z3lab/cpsskins/branches/jmo-perspectives/doc/portlet-rendering.txt the portlet and widget are wired up by

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-29 Thread Jim Fulton
Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: ... What problem perspectives solves? -- I think I'm ready to respond to this now. I hope, with your current thinking that this is still relevent. local portlets are currently stored in local folders in a

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-29 Thread Jim Fulton
Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: ... Concerning unification: During the sprint in Göteborg in June according to what Tres mentionned it appeared to me said that the issue was to make portlets independent of any macro mechanism, and that the they should be treated as page fragments without any

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-29 Thread Jean-Marc Orliaguet
Jim Fulton wrote: Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: ... What problem perspectives solves? -- I think I'm ready to respond to this now. I hope, with your current thinking that this is still relevent. good :-) local portlets are currently

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-29 Thread Jean-Marc Orliaguet
Jim Fulton wrote: Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: ... By using perspectives end-users can also use the portlet editor to move portlets on the canvas (as in the google news portal), By end-users, do you mean content managers? Or end-users of the content? Why do they need perspectives to do

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-29 Thread Jean-Marc Orliaguet
Jim Fulton wrote: Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: ... This is what I meant with having a unifying concept. And that sounds very unifying to me already. Perspectives, if I understand how you are describing them, and how Eclipse describes them,

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-29 Thread Jim Fulton
Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: Jim Fulton wrote: Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: ... By using perspectives end-users can also use the portlet editor to move portlets on the canvas (as in the google news portal), By end-users, do you mean content managers? Or end-users of the content? Why do

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-29 Thread Jim Fulton
Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: Jim Fulton wrote: Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: ... This is what I meant with having a unifying concept. And that sounds very unifying to me already. Perspectives, if I understand how you are describing them, and how Eclipse describes them,

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-29 Thread Jean-Marc Orliaguet
Jim Fulton wrote: Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: Yes, I think that Rob mentionned that there was such a use case where you had customers who wanted to control the way portlets were disposed on the screen on an individual basis. This gets to a terminology problem. JSR 168 defines portlets

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-29 Thread Jim Fulton
Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: Jim Fulton wrote: Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: Yes, I think that Rob mentionned that there was such a use case where you had customers who wanted to control the way portlets were disposed on the screen on an individual basis. This gets to a terminology problem.

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-29 Thread Jim Fulton
Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: Jim Fulton wrote: ... - They introduce a need for some complex infrastructure. what do you mean by complex? have you seen the prototype? for a user it does not seem too complex: - choose a perspective - add portlets to it - assign the perspective to some

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-29 Thread Jim Fulton
Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: Hi! Somehow related to the discussion on optimizing catalog queries, I have been thinking about how to best implement local portlets in cpsskins in terms of scalability, performance and functionality. The implementation is heavily dependent on being able to

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-29 Thread Jean-Marc Orliaguet
Jim Fulton wrote: Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: Hi! Somehow related to the discussion on optimizing catalog queries, I have been thinking about how to best implement local portlets in cpsskins in terms of scalability, performance and functionality. The implementation is heavily dependent on

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-29 Thread Jean-Marc Orliaguet
Jim Fulton wrote: Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: Jim Fulton wrote: ... - They introduce a need for some complex infrastructure. what do you mean by complex? have you seen the prototype? for a user it does not seem too complex: - choose a perspective - add portlets to it - assign the

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-26 Thread Jean-Marc Orliaguet
Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: a page has a template like a Zope Page Template, that would correspond to the idea of layout. it's as unfortunate as a name as the browser:page / directive that is associated to a browser view, and a page template. But the idea is the same. it is more like a browser

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-26 Thread Jim Fulton
Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: a page has a template like a Zope Page Template, that would correspond to the idea of layout. it's as unfortunate as a name as the browser:page / directive that is associated to a browser view, and a page template. But the idea is the

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-26 Thread Jim Fulton
Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: Jim Fulton wrote: Hi Jim, here are the concepts defined: It's too bad these aren't defined in a more perminent and referenceable location. - A *theme* is a visual unity, when you go from cnn.com to bbc.co.uk you see that sites are using different themes. The

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-26 Thread Jean-Marc Orliaguet
Jim Fulton wrote: Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: a page has a template like a Zope Page Template, that would correspond to the idea of layout. Sure, but It still seems that a theme page fills the same role as a template, in that it is meant to be used for many different page. Let me put

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-26 Thread Jim Fulton
Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: Jim Fulton wrote: ... Not quite, AFAICT. browser:page actually defines a page (e.g. foo.html) relative to an object type. yes, but the object type is independent of the URL too, just like a theme page says nothing about what it will be applied to... But

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-26 Thread Jim Fulton
Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: Jim Fulton wrote: ... Lets say I have a content object, say a poll. Now, I want that poll to have a number of pages: - index.html This page displays the poll question and collects input. If the user has already taken the poll, it indicates as much and

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-26 Thread Jean-Marc Orliaguet
Jim Fulton wrote: it would not be concerned with index.html / report.html / edit.html AT ALL. you would just place a Main Content Portlet in the middle of the page and let the application underneath take care of rendering the poll screens. cf

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-26 Thread Jean-Marc Orliaguet
Jim Fulton wrote: Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: yes, these would be application-specific portlets, as the ones used in a calendar application for instance showing a monthly agenda. The portlet gets access to the current view object, to the current page location (renamed from 'context_obj' to

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-26 Thread Jim Fulton
Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: Jim Fulton wrote: Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: yes, these would be application-specific portlets, as the ones used in a calendar application for instance showing a monthly agenda. The portlet gets access to the current view object, to the current page location

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-26 Thread Jim Fulton
Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: Jim Fulton wrote: it would not be concerned with index.html / report.html / edit.html AT ALL. you would just place a Main Content Portlet in the middle of the page and let the application underneath take care of rendering the poll screens. cf

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-26 Thread Jean-Marc Orliaguet
Jim Fulton wrote: Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: Jim Fulton wrote: Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: yes, these would be application-specific portlets, as the ones used in a calendar application for instance showing a monthly agenda. The portlet gets access to the current view object, to the

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-26 Thread Jim Fulton
Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: Jim Fulton wrote: Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: Jim Fulton wrote: Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: yes, these would be application-specific portlets, as the ones used in a calendar application for instance showing a monthly agenda. The portlet gets access to the

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-26 Thread Jean-Marc Orliaguet
Jim Fulton wrote: Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: in that case, using a portlet to display the poll results might not be the best solution, Right, but then what if, when displaying the poll results, I wanted to use some other portlet. Perhaps I have a portlet that lists the top 10 polls

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-26 Thread Jim Fulton
Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: Jim Fulton wrote: Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: in that case, using a portlet to display the poll results might not be the best solution, Right, but then what if, when displaying the poll results, I wanted to use some other portlet. Perhaps I have a portlet

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-26 Thread Jean-Marc Orliaguet
Jim Fulton wrote: Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: Jim Fulton wrote: Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: in that case, using a portlet to display the poll results might not be the best solution, Right, but then what if, when displaying the poll results, I wanted to use some other portlet.

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-25 Thread Jean-Marc Orliaguet
Michel Pelletier wrote: On Thu, 2005-08-25 at 04:10 +0200, Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: You would need a quadruple store in that case (see the previous mail) - rdflib.Graph is actually a quadruple store. Many users still say TripleStore because that was the old class name, but most RDF

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-25 Thread Jean-Marc Orliaguet
Hi! concerning perspectives, what would be the use cases? I talked with Eric, we came up with: activity-driven perspectives: --- - browsing perspective (going through folders, finding documents, ..) - dashboard perspective (tasks list, documents to

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-24 Thread Gary Poster
On Aug 24, 2005, at 2:24 PM, Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: Hi! Somehow related to the discussion on optimizing catalog queries, I have been thinking about how to best implement local portlets in cpsskins in terms of scalability, performance and functionality. The implementation is

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-24 Thread Michel Pelletier
On Wed, 2005-08-24 at 15:28 -0400, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Message: 5 Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 20:24:30 +0200 From: Jean-Marc Orliaguet [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives It is built on the notion of Perspective (see the link) and on the idea of

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-24 Thread Jean-Marc Orliaguet
Gary Poster wrote: On Aug 24, 2005, at 2:24 PM, Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: Hi! Somehow related to the discussion on optimizing catalog queries, I have been thinking about how to best implement local portlets in cpsskins in terms of scalability, performance and functionality. The

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-24 Thread Jean-Marc Orliaguet
Michel Pelletier wrote: On Wed, 2005-08-24 at 15:28 -0400, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Message: 5 Date: Wed, 24 Aug 2005 20:24:30 +0200 From: Jean-Marc Orliaguet [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives It is built on the notion of Perspective

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-24 Thread Michel Pelletier
On Thu, 2005-08-25 at 04:10 +0200, Jean-Marc Orliaguet wrote: You would need a quadruple store in that case (see the previous mail) - rdflib.Graph is actually a quadruple store. Many users still say TripleStore because that was the old class name, but most RDF systems, rdflib included, have

Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives

2005-08-24 Thread Michel Pelletier
On Wed, 2005-08-24 at 22:25 -0400, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Subject: Re: [Zope3-dev] [DRAFT] local portlets and perspectives JM It is built on the notion of Perspective (see the link) and on the idea of querying the catalog using triadic relations instead of joining sets of query results