Re: [Zope3-dev] Re: Zope 3 releases?

2007-10-10 Thread Brian Sutherland
On Mon, Oct 08, 2007 at 06:49:02PM -0400, Stephan Richter wrote: On Monday 08 October 2007 15:09, Tres Seaver wrote: Presuming agreement on the known good set (KGS) term, I would think that we have two candidates for what makes up platform releases Frozen Releases I

Re: [Zope3-dev] Re: Zope 3 releases?

2007-10-08 Thread Jim Fulton
I'm not sure that library or collection of libraries is the right term for what we want to be. I think we've been using it because it stands in sharp contrast to application, which, BTW, isn't exactly what Zope 2 is. I think these terms were useful to make some points, but neither is

Re: [Zope3-dev] Re: Zope 3 releases?

2007-10-08 Thread Stephan Richter
On Monday 08 October 2007 06:56, Martijn Faassen wrote: Because we have endless confusion between Zope 3 the ecosystem and Zope 3 the web application framework. For me it is exactly the same. Zope 3 is a Web application server. Zope 2 uses many components of the Zope 3 Web application server.

Re: [Zope3-dev] Re: Zope 3 releases?

2007-10-08 Thread Martijn Faassen
Hey, Stephan, I tried to reply to your points but I realized I was getting lost in a sea of semantics and that it wasn't useful. The Zope 3 web application server is not primarily what the Zope 3 project appears to be developing. I strongly suspect there are more users of Zope 3 technology

Re: [Zope3-dev] Re: Zope 3 releases?

2007-10-08 Thread Stephan Richter
On Monday 08 October 2007 11:06, Martijn Faassen wrote: Stephan, I tried to reply to your points but I realized I was getting lost in a sea of semantics and that it wasn't useful. I agree I'd like to see a separation between what you consider to be not only closely allied but *identical*:

Re: [Zope3-dev] Re: Zope 3 releases?

2007-10-08 Thread Stephan Richter
On Monday 08 October 2007 15:09, Tres Seaver wrote: Presuming agreement on the known good set (KGS) term, I would think that we have two candidates for what makes up platform releases Frozen Releases I started commenting this section until I saw the one below. I personally

Re: [Zope3-dev] Re: Zope 3 releases?

2007-10-07 Thread Lennart Regebro
On 10/7/07, Brandon Craig Rhodes [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: There is danger here. Many in the industry consider Linux to be an absolute disaster - because after you develop an application on one distribution, you can spend months trying to support customers who attempt to run it on other

Re: [Zope3-dev] Re: Zope 3 releases?

2007-10-07 Thread Jim Fulton
IMO, the Python standard library and batteries included is a mess. Despite being a Python contributor, I've very unmotivated to be a contributor because the time lag between contributing and deriving benefit from the contributions is too long. People had similar complaints about Zope

Re: [Zope3-dev] Re: Zope 3 releases?

2007-10-07 Thread Stephan Richter
On Sunday 07 October 2007 17:13, Martijn Faassen wrote: I'm not saying an ecosystem approach is bad, if that's what Zope 3 wants to be. I do think that such an approach needs to be supplemented by a framework approach (and I've been putting work into one way to do that). Why? I have no need

Re: [Zope3-dev] Re: Zope 3 releases?

2007-10-07 Thread Lennart Regebro
On 10/7/07, Martijn Faassen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: While I see Brandon making good points, I also agree with this: the motivation to contribute to the Python standard library is reduced because of big bang releases. I think the main reason is that you need to wait so long to see your work in