Re: [Zope] [Zope-dev] Zope 4.0, maybe not such a bad idea...

2009-04-03 Thread Sascha Welter
(Thu, Apr 02, 2009 at 04:11:00PM -0400) Jim Fulton wrote/schrieb/egrapse: I don't think we need AB. Maybe just Zope and Zope Framework. As long as both use the word Zope, the confusion will continue. Why don't the Zope 3 people find a different name now, something that relates but is not the

Re: [Zope] [Zope-dev] Zope 4.0, maybe not such a bad idea...

2009-04-03 Thread Lennart Regebro
My preferred Zope-future would be: 1. The Zope Framework dependency cleanup project continues. When cleanup is deemed reasonably finished, we rename the framework Zope 4. 2. Zope 3 The Application server moves over to zope.pipeline or similar, and gets a new name, and becomes one of the

Re: [Zope] RIP Zope 2!

2009-04-03 Thread Lennart Regebro
2009/4/2 Tim Nash thedag...@gmail.com: If you really think zope 3 (or 4) can stand on it's own, just rename zope 2 to 'plone base'. That will cut down on the confusion. There are many more that uses Zope 2 besides Plone. But it is true, and also likely A Good Thing that Zope 2 doesn't get many

Re: [Zope] [Zope-dev] Zope 4.0, maybe not such a bad idea...

2009-04-03 Thread Chris Withers
Andrew Milton wrote: | Plenty of people use it without plone. You might want to crawl out of | the vacuum you live in. | | Yes, and I'm one of them, but I don't think it's fair to try and tempt | new users into it... | | I'm happy to be proven wrong by you writing lots of decent docs,

Re: [Zope] [Zope-dev] Zope 4.0, maybe not such a bad idea...

2009-04-03 Thread Chris Withers
Sascha Welter wrote: (Thu, Apr 02, 2009 at 04:11:00PM -0400) Jim Fulton wrote/schrieb/egrapse: I don't think we need AB. Maybe just Zope and Zope Framework. As long as both use the word Zope, the confusion will continue. Well, not quite, I think as long as any *one* of the bits uses the

Re: [Zope] [Zope-dev] Zope 4.0, maybe not such a bad idea...

2009-04-03 Thread Chris Withers
Andrew Milton wrote: I think making a distinction between the app servers and the framework/architecture is a good idea, it then just becomes a matter of educating our current or potential users. Indeed, I hope you'd agree that differentiating them both by nothing more than version number is

Re: [Zope] [Zope-dev] Zope 4.0, maybe not such a bad idea...

2009-04-03 Thread Chris Withers
Lennart Regebro wrote: 1. The Zope Framework dependency cleanup project continues. When cleanup is deemed reasonably finished, we rename the framework Zope 4. Oh, so Zope 4 is a run on from Zope 2? How do I upgrade from Zope 2 to Zope 3? How about from 3.5 to 4? No, Martijn as Zope Framework

Re: [Zope] znolk wizard

2009-04-03 Thread Chris Withers
Carsten Senger wrote: Times are fast moving. Interesting to see such interests in something ancient to start an excavation ;-) Znolk 0.1.9 is hidden on zope.org. http://www.zope.org/Members/zwork/Znolk_SQL_Wizard/default I think 0.2 was developed at bluedynamics and never released.

Re: [Zope] RIP Zope 2!

2009-04-03 Thread Chris Withers
Tim Nash wrote: *This* community is dead, get over it and move on. Yeah, you are right. If you really think zope 3 (or 4) can stand on it's own, zope 3 app server has a small community of users who've indicated they're not wedded to that brand continuing. the zope framework is already

Re: [Zope] [Zope-dev] Zope 4.0, maybe not such a bad idea...

2009-04-03 Thread Lennart Regebro
2009/4/3 Chris Withers ch...@simplistix.co.uk: Lennart Regebro wrote: 1. The Zope Framework dependency cleanup project continues. When cleanup is deemed reasonably finished, we rename the framework Zope 4. Oh, so Zope 4 is a run on from Zope 2? Eh... no. How do I upgrade from Zope 2 to

Re: [Zope] [Zope-dev] Zope 4.0, maybe not such a bad idea...

2009-04-03 Thread Andrew Milton
+---[ Chris Withers ]-- | Andrew Milton wrote: | | Plenty of people use it without plone. You might want to crawl out of | | the vacuum you live in. | | | | Yes, and I'm one of them, but I don't think it's fair to try and tempt | | new users into it... | | | | I'm happy

Re: [Zope] RIP Zope 2!

2009-04-03 Thread Aleksey Tsalolikhin
Hi. FYI, I have a client using Zope 2 in production. I am migrating him from Zope 2.7 on SUSE 10.1 to Zope 2.10 on CentOS 5.2. He's not using plone. He has a custom Web app. He expects to keep using Zope 2, and to continue development of our Web application. Best, Aleksey Tsalolikhin Unix

[Zope] REMINDER: Request for Collaboration - Project MuSMo

2009-04-03 Thread KwangErn Liew
Dear all, A reminder of your participation in the RFC of Project MuSMo. Please find detail information in regards to the project at http://blog.musmo.com/2009/03/19/request-for-collaboration-project-musmo/ including an attachment of the RFC. Thank you for taking your time and effort in

Re: [Zope] RIP Zope 2!

2009-04-03 Thread Jürgen Herrmann
On Fri, April 3, 2009 21:18, Aleksey Tsalolikhin wrote: Hi. FYI, I have a client using Zope 2 in production. I am migrating him from Zope 2.7 on SUSE 10.1 to Zope 2.10 on CentOS 5.2. He's not using plone. He has a custom Web app. He expects to keep using Zope 2, and to continue

Re: [Zope-dev] zope.testing.runner: protecting against rogue threads

2009-04-03 Thread Christian Theune
On Thu, 2009-04-02 at 21:17 +0200, Dieter Maurer wrote: Christian Theune wrote at 2009-4-2 13:30 +0200: if tests spawn non-daemon threads, then the test runner can get stuck. The easiest way that I see is to always --exit-with-status and to make --exist-with-status also call sys.exit() when

[Zope-dev] uuid.UUID as a rock in zope.security

2009-04-03 Thread Brian Sutherland
Hi, We're using UUIDs a lot, and it's pretty painful that they are security proxied. They're in the standard library from python 2.5 (http://docs.python.org/library/uuid.html) and are immutable according to the documentation. I think they meet all the all the requirements to be rocks. So unless

Re: [Zope-dev] z3c.pt bug

2009-04-03 Thread Malthe Borch
2009/4/3 Roger Ineichen d...@projekt01.ch: Can you run the group.txt tests in z3c.form and confirm the issue. A div tag get skipped after some nested repeat tags. (line 898, in group.txt) Running with the latest ``chameleon.core``, ``chameleon.zpt`` and ``z3c.pt``, I only get one test failure:

[Zope-dev] Dependencies on new packages should require feature releases

2009-04-03 Thread Christian Theune
Hi, (this message probably just has a reminder function) in one of my apps I had to upgrade many packages to a lot of new versions suddenly when updating zope.publisher. That was caused because zope.publisher started depending on a new (previously non-existing) package within a bugfix release

[Zope-dev] Zope Tests: 5 OK, 2 Failed, 1 Unknown

2009-04-03 Thread Zope Tests Summarizer
Summary of messages to the zope-tests list. Period Thu Apr 2 12:00:00 2009 UTC to Fri Apr 3 12:00:00 2009 UTC. There were 8 messages: 8 from Zope Tests. Test failures - Subject: FAILED (failures=1) : Zope-trunk Python-2.6.1 : Linux From: Zope Tests Date: Thu Apr 2 20:53:08 EDT

Re: [Zope-dev] Zope Source Code Repository

2009-04-03 Thread Gary Poster
On Apr 2, 2009, at 7:35 PM, Tres Seaver wrote: -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Gary Poster wrote: I'd like to report back on the progress that Bzr/Launchpad has made addressing concerns we heard since I last brought up Canonical's offer to host the code and contribute

Re: [Zope-dev] Zope Source Code Repository

2009-04-03 Thread Jim Fulton
On Apr 2, 2009, at 6:34 PM, Marius Gedminas wrote: - the web front end is ancient and not as good as other options (Trac, WebSVN) +1 for having trac as a subversion browser. In fact, see http://zope3.pov.lt/trac The svn repository mirror used by that trac instance is updated with

Re: [Zope-dev] Zope Source Code Repository

2009-04-03 Thread Martijn Pieters
On Fri, Apr 3, 2009 at 14:41, Jim Fulton j...@zope.com wrote: Should we all just use that? It's running trac 0.10. I'd love to see trac 0.11, which has additional features that I miss every time I use a 0.10 trac instance, such as the annotate view. Also, I'd include the subversion location

Re: [Zope-dev] [Checkins] SVN: zope.annotation/trunk/setup.py Whitespace fixes

2009-04-03 Thread Fred Drake
2009/4/2 Marius Gedminas mar...@gedmin.as: looks like a mistaken assignment of a tuple to a name, while  setup(  many lines    foo=bar,  many more lines  ) looks like a function call. Agreed; the common use of spaces around the equal signs in setup.py is a holdover from Greg Ward's

Re: [Zope-dev] Zope Source Code Repository

2009-04-03 Thread Marius Gedminas
On Fri, Apr 03, 2009 at 03:04:47PM +0200, Martijn Pieters wrote: On Fri, Apr 3, 2009 at 14:41, Jim Fulton j...@zope.com wrote: Should we all just use that? (that being http://zope3.pov.lt/trac) Sure, I don't mind. It sits behind an ADSL line with puny uplink (512 Kbit/s), but I don't think

Re: [Zope-dev] Zope Source Code Repository

2009-04-03 Thread Andreas Jung
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03.04.2009 17:22 Uhr, Marius Gedminas wrote: On Fri, Apr 03, 2009 at 03:04:47PM +0200, Martijn Pieters wrote: On Fri, Apr 3, 2009 at 14:41, Jim Fulton j...@zope.com wrote: Should we all just use that? (that being http://zope3.pov.lt/trac)

Re: [Zope-dev] [ZF] Zope Source Code Repository

2009-04-03 Thread Chris Withers
Christian Theune wrote: See: http://subversion.tigris.org/svn_1.6_releasenotes.html#auth-related-improvements However, this only *allows* clients to manage their password reasonably, it doesn't force them to. Well, you can't force someone to keep their private key private either... At

[Zope-dev] Constant values defined in interfaces

2009-04-03 Thread Chris Rossi
Hello, I was wondering if the Zope collective had given any consideration to allowing constants to be defined in interfaces. To be clear, these are constant values that make up the protocol defined by the interface. Just to have a concrete example, let's say we're modeling an http response:

Re: [Zope-dev] [ZF] Zope Source Code Repository

2009-04-03 Thread Chris Withers
Tres Seaver wrote: - the web front end is ancient and not as good as other options (Trac, WebSVN) Fixing the web front-end should be a matter for the zope-web list. The zope-web list is pretty dead... So I thought I'd ask what the plans are now that the foundation owns all the Zope IP

Re: [Zope-dev] [ZF] Zope Source Code Repository

2009-04-03 Thread Chris Withers
Jens Vagelpohl wrote: On Apr 2, 2009, at 22:53 , Tres Seaver wrote: +1 to making svn-over-http read-only checkouts work. This is now working. The repository can be reached under... http://svn.zope.org/repos/main/ Jens, you're my hero :-) Remind me that I owe you beer next time I see

Re: [Zope-dev] Zope Source Code Repository

2009-04-03 Thread Chris Withers
Marius Gedminas wrote: The story may be different for Windows users (as usual). +0.5 for alternatively accepting authenticated https access (I'm not the admin, so it doesn't cost me, but I'm also not going to use it) BTW I've yet to see a firewall that blocks SSH. Am I lucky? Yup. In

Re: [Zope-dev] Zope Source Code Repository

2009-04-03 Thread Chris Withers
Andreas Jung wrote: Sure, I don't mind. It sits behind an ADSL line with puny uplink (512 Kbit/s), but I don't think that will be a problem. Nothing against your generous offer but I think that trac belongs as a central service on the central repository server. +1, although if we were to

Re: [Zope-dev] Zope 4.0, maybe not such a bad idea...

2009-04-03 Thread Chris Withers
Gary Poster wrote: Within the constraints above, then, in line with your original proposal, I think we'd be fine with Zope Framework, and Zope 2. We certainly don't need Zope-3-the-tarball, if that's what you meant. Zope Framework (and maybe even ZF4) seems to have general agreement.

Re: [Zope-dev] [Fwd: [Bug 343079] [NEW] Broken distribution (2009-03-15)]

2009-04-03 Thread Chris Withers
Tres Seaver wrote: Personally, I evaluate such eggs in a sandbox, and then add them to the project-specific index once I'm sure that they work with the other software in the index: I don't use PyPI at all when building out production sites. That seems overly heavyweight for the average new

Re: [Zope-dev] Constant values defined in interfaces

2009-04-03 Thread Gary Poster
On Apr 3, 2009, at 12:35 PM, Chris Rossi wrote: Hello, Hi Chris. I was wondering if the Zope collective had given any consideration to allowing constants to be defined in interfaces. To be clear, these are constant values that make up the protocol defined by the interface. ...

Re: [Zope-dev] [Fwd: [Bug 343079] [NEW] Broken distribution (2009-03-15)]

2009-04-03 Thread Tres Seaver
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Chris Withers wrote: Tres Seaver wrote: Personally, I evaluate such eggs in a sandbox, and then add them to the project-specific index once I'm sure that they work with the other software in the index: I don't use PyPI at all when building out

Re: [Zope-dev] [ZF] Zope Source Code Repository

2009-04-03 Thread Tres Seaver
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 Chris Withers wrote: Andreas Jung wrote: *This* part needs some fixing, largely because Jim's role their is an artifact of ZC's role, now lapsed, as custodians. At a minimum, there should be a group (I suggest the zope-web regulars) who can take

Re: [Zope-dev] [ZF] Zope Source Code Repository

2009-04-03 Thread Andreas Jung
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 03.04.2009 21:02 Uhr, Tres Seaver wrote: Chris Withers wrote: Andreas Jung wrote: *This* part needs some fixing, largely because Jim's role their is an artifact of ZC's role, now lapsed, as custodians. At a minimum, there should be a group (I

Re: [Zope-dev] Zope Source Code Repository

2009-04-03 Thread Wichert Akkerman
Previously Marius Gedminas wrote: BTW I've yet to see a firewall that blocks SSH. Am I lucky? Yes. Blocking ssh is very common in larger companies in me experience. Wichert. -- Wichert Akkerman wich...@wiggy.netIt is simple to make things. http://www.wiggy.net/ It is

Re: [Zope-dev] Constant values defined in interfaces

2009-04-03 Thread Wichert Akkerman
Previously Chris Rossi wrote: I was wondering if the Zope collective had given any consideration to allowing constants to be defined in interfaces. To be clear, these are constant values that make up the protocol defined by the interface. Just to have a concrete example, let's say we're

Re: [Zope-dev] Constant values defined in interfaces

2009-04-03 Thread Gary Poster
On Apr 3, 2009, at 7:21 PM, Wichert Akkerman wrote: This looks like a poor man's enum. I'ld prefer to have a proper enum like thing. Seems a little different to me. For what it is worth, though, if you do want an enum in zope.schema, Canonical has lazr.enum:

[ZWeb] www.zope.org down?

2009-04-03 Thread Chris Withers
Hey All, Is it supposed to be down? Chris PS: I'm not longer subscribed to zope-web, please CC me in a replies... -- Simplistix - Content Management, Zope Python Consulting - http://www.simplistix.co.uk ___ Zope-web maillist -

Re: [ZWeb] www.zope.org down?

2009-04-03 Thread Andreas Jung
It's up. -aj On Fri, Apr 3, 2009 at 15:53, Chris Withers ch...@simplistix.co.uk wrote: Hey All, Is it supposed to be down? Chris PS: I'm not longer subscribed to zope-web, please CC me in a replies... -- Simplistix - Content Management, Zope Python Consulting -