Re: [Zope] Perl Zope
Chris Withers wrote: > > Paul Everitt wrote: > > You're absolutely right on this. Amos' post recently described the > > various things in various stages of release that should give some hope > > for the situation. These things really are an improvement. I'm > > crossing my fingers that this turns into a torrent of material that > > turns an area that is a nightmare into an area of great pride. > > What part do you see ZDP playing in this? This is a tough one to answer, one better left for Amos. At a high level, I want to make sure the ZDP has its own identity, and also that we are taking steps to make a serious difference in the documentation issue. How we can best coordinate with the ZDP is an ongoing discussion. --Paul ___ Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] Perl Zope
Paul Everitt wrote: > > Adam wrote: > > What makes me most uncomfortable about this is the opportunity > > cost. Every hour of development time integrating Perl is one > > less hour > > As I tried to mention in my "Redux" post a few moments ago, this isn't > the case. ActiveState is doing the engineering. Just a quick comment here. Paul, if DC is compensating ActiveState in this contract it is still using DC resources. Those $dollars going to ActiveState change what DC could do if it added staff or whatever. Whether or not it is a worthwhile goal is another topic. :) > > working on other parts. I can say without any reservation > > that the lack > > of documentation has done ten times as much as lack of Perl support to > > make my time with Zope difficult. > > You're absolutely right on this. Amos' post recently described the > various things in various stages of release that should give some hope > for the situation. These things really are an improvement. I'm > crossing my fingers that this turns into a torrent of material that > turns an area that is a nightmare into an area of great pride. > > At least that's the hope. :^) I look forward to seeing these improvements. :) Jimmie Houchin > --Paul > > ___ > Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope > ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** > (Related lists - > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce > http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ) ___ Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] Perl Zope
Paul Everitt wrote: > You're absolutely right on this. Amos' post recently described the > various things in various stages of release that should give some hope > for the situation. These things really are an improvement. I'm > crossing my fingers that this turns into a torrent of material that > turns an area that is a nightmare into an area of great pride. What part do you see ZDP playing in this? cheers, Chris ___ Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
RE: [Zope] Perl Zope
Adam wrote: > What makes me most uncomfortable about this is the opportunity > cost. Every hour of development time integrating Perl is one > less hour As I tried to mention in my "Redux" post a few moments ago, this isn't the case. ActiveState is doing the engineering. > working on other parts. I can say without any reservation > that the lack > of documentation has done ten times as much as lack of Perl support to > make my time with Zope difficult. You're absolutely right on this. Amos' post recently described the various things in various stages of release that should give some hope for the situation. These things really are an improvement. I'm crossing my fingers that this turns into a torrent of material that turns an area that is a nightmare into an area of great pride. At least that's the hope. :^) --Paul ___ Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] Perl Zope
[Adam Clark, on Thu, 25 May 2000] :: Hope nobody minds a newbie perspective on this. :: :: I spent the last 4 years programming (and unabashedly loving) Perl, and I :: don't think adding Perl to Zope will attract a lot more people. The large :: scope of Zope and the similarities between Python and Perl mean that I've spent :: a whole lot more time struggling with the Zope pieces than with Python. :: :: What makes me most uncomfortable about this is the opportunity :: cost. Every hour of development time integrating Perl is one less hour :: working on other parts. I can say without any reservation that the lack :: of documentation has done ten times as much as lack of Perl support to :: make my time with Zope difficult. Of course there is simply no way to measure how many people have silently left the fold after failing to make sense of Zope, but I feel comfortable surmising that the number is at least an order of magnitude greater than the number of those who have somehow stuck with Zope. Unfortunately, those lost early adopters are unlikely to ever try again. A high percentage of those giving up in frustration are probably high end professionals, simply too busy to consider learning Zope by trial and error or by studying the source code. The documentation woes have been aired on this list at length, ad infinitum, ad absurdum. Yet we remain woeful. Had the documentation been brought up to par some time ago (say around the time of the 2.0 release), then I doubt that the Zope community would now feel any need or desire to embrace the Perl (or any other) user community in order to gain support for Zope. There would be such a multitude of productive Zope users and contributors by now that the need for Perl libraries would be nonexistent. That kind of success and momentum in itself would do more than anything to attract Perl users to Zope and Python. ___ Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
[Zope] Perl Zope
Hope nobody minds a newbie perspective on this. I spent the last 4 years programming (and unabashedly loving) Perl, and I don't think adding Perl to Zope will attract a lot more people. The large scope of Zope and the similarities between Python and Perl mean that I've spent a whole lot more time struggling with the Zope pieces than with Python. What makes me most uncomfortable about this is the opportunity cost. Every hour of development time integrating Perl is one less hour working on other parts. I can say without any reservation that the lack of documentation has done ten times as much as lack of Perl support to make my time with Zope difficult. Just my $0.02 Adam ___ Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )