Re: [Zope] Zope 2.13.26 and Product ExternalEditor

[Giampiero Benvenuti]

Hi Michael,

you are totally right! Thanks for your answer.
Is what I have done now and everything looks good.
Thanks again.

By the way, is there somewhere a stable release of zope4.x?

Bests,

Giampiero

> On 14 Mar 2017, at 07:52 15, Michael Howitz  wrote:
> 
> Am 13.03.2017 um 14:44 schrieb Giampiero Benvenuti 
> :
>> Hello everybody,
>> 
>> I would like very badly to upgrade to 2.13.26.
>> The installation of zope is working just fine.
>> The problem appear when I install the product ExternalEditor (ver. 2.0.2).
> 
> Hi!
> 
> Try version 1.1.3 of Products.ExternalEditor as version 2.x was updated to 
> Zope 4.x which no longer has icons in the ZMI.
> 
> 
> --
> Mit freundlichen Grüßen
> Michael Howitz
> 

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[Zope] Zope 2.13.26 and Product ExternalEditor

[Giampiero Benvenuti]

Hello everybody,

I would like very badly to upgrade to 2.13.26.
The installation of zope is working just fine.
The problem appear when I install the product ExternalEditor (ver. 2.0.2).
After installing it and restarting zope, all the icons of the products in ZMI 
disappear… I can see just the pencil icon of the External Editor. 

Do you  have a clue about it? I don’t no why.
Any way to fix it?

Thanks so much,

Giampiero
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[Zope-dev] Undo product stops working with recent Zope (StorageTransactionError)

[lists]

Hi,

I have a product that patches Zope so that the Undo
screen also accepts a date and time for when to roll
back to (on pypi as Products.Undoer).

It used to work, but with the most recent versions of
Zope this error appears if the Undo by date is used
more than once:

2012-01-24 13:45:32 ERROR Zope.SiteErrorLog 1327409132.230.397033237621
http://localhost:8080/Plone/undo_changes_by_date
Traceback (innermost last):
  Module ZPublisher.Publish, line 134, in publish
  Module Zope2.App.startup, line 301, in commit
  Module transaction._manager, line 89, in commit
  Module transaction._transaction, line 329, in commit
  Module transaction._transaction, line 441, in _commitResources
  Module ZODB.DB, line 990, in tpc_begin
  Module ZEO.ClientStorage, line 1116, in tpc_begin
StorageTransactionError: Duplicate tpc_begin calls for same transaction

The code looks like this:

def undo_changes_by_date(self, date=None, REQUEST=None):
Undoes changes made to the database after a given date;  if
a date is not specified, all changes are undone.
if date is None:
date = float(0)
elif type(date) == types.StringType:
date = float(DateTime(date))
else:
date = float(date)
transactions = self._p_jar.db().undoLog(0, 2**32)
undo=self._p_jar.db().undo
count = 0
for transaction in transactions:
if transaction['time'] = date:
undo(transaction['id'])
count += 1
if REQUEST:
return MessageDialog(
title='Result of undoing transactions',
message=em%s/em transactions were undone % count,
action='./manage_UndoForm'
)
return count

Any ideas?  Do I need to do a tpc_begin myself?

-Morten

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Re: [Zope-dev] Undo product stops working with recent Zope (StorageTransactionError)

[Hanno Schlichting]

On Tue, Jan 24, 2012 at 2:14 PM,  li...@nidelven-it.no wrote:
 It used to work, but with the most recent versions of
 Zope this error appears if the Undo by date is used
 more than once:

The undo API has changed with ZODB 3.10. As noted in the changelog:

The API for undoing multiple transactions has changed. To undo
multiple transactions in a single transaction, pass a list of
transaction identifiers to a database's undoMultiple method. Calling a
database's undo method multiple times in the same transaction now
raises an exception.

Your code calls undo multiple times, and needs to be changed accordingly.

Hanno
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Re: [Zope-dev] Undo product stops working with recent Zope (StorageTransactionError)

[lists]

On Tue, 24 Jan 2012 14:50:44 +0100, Hanno Schlichting
ha...@hannosch.eu wrote:
 On Tue, Jan 24, 2012 at 2:14 PM,  li...@nidelven-it.no wrote:
 It used to work, but with the most recent versions of
 Zope this error appears if the Undo by date is used
 more than once:
 
 The undo API has changed with ZODB 3.10. As noted in the changelog:
 
 The API for undoing multiple transactions has changed. To undo
 multiple transactions in a single transaction, pass a list of
 transaction identifiers to a database's undoMultiple method. Calling a
 database's undo method multiple times in the same transaction now
 raises an exception.
 
 Your code calls undo multiple times, and needs to be changed accordingly.

Aha.  OK, thanks! :)

Regards,

Morten
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[Zope-Checkins] SVN: Zope/trunk/ Changed product install so it won't write persistent changes only to abort them. Instead we don't make any database changes in the first place.

[Hanno Schlichting]

Log message for revision 113926:
  Changed product install so it won't write persistent changes only to abort 
them. Instead we don't make any database changes in the first place.
  

Changed:
  U   Zope/trunk/doc/CHANGES.rst
  U   Zope/trunk/src/App/FactoryDispatcher.py
  U   Zope/trunk/src/App/Product.py
  U   Zope/trunk/src/App/ProductContext.py
  U   Zope/trunk/src/OFS/Application.py

-=-
Modified: Zope/trunk/doc/CHANGES.rst
===
--- Zope/trunk/doc/CHANGES.rst  2010-06-27 11:44:28 UTC (rev 113925)
+++ Zope/trunk/doc/CHANGES.rst  2010-06-27 12:44:22 UTC (rev 113926)
@@ -18,6 +18,11 @@
 Features Added
 ++
 
+- Changed product install so it won't write persistent changes only to abort
+  them. Instead we don't make any database changes in the first place.
+
+- Disabled persistent product installation in the default test configuration.
+
 - Directly extend and use the Zope Toolkit KGS release 1.0dev-r113891 from
   http://download.zope.org/zopetoolkit/index/.
 

Modified: Zope/trunk/src/App/FactoryDispatcher.py
===
--- Zope/trunk/src/App/FactoryDispatcher.py 2010-06-27 11:44:28 UTC (rev 
113925)
+++ Zope/trunk/src/App/FactoryDispatcher.py 2010-06-27 12:44:22 UTC (rev 
113926)
@@ -23,7 +23,9 @@
 from Acquisition import Acquired
 from Acquisition import aq_base
 from Acquisition import Implicit
+from ExtensionClass import Base
 
+
 def _product_packages():
 Returns all product packages including the regularly defined
 zope2 packages and those without the Products namespace package.
@@ -41,7 +43,7 @@
 return packages
 
 
-class Product(object):
+class Product(Base):
 Model a non-persistent product wrapper.
 
 

Modified: Zope/trunk/src/App/Product.py
===
--- Zope/trunk/src/App/Product.py   2010-06-27 11:44:28 UTC (rev 113925)
+++ Zope/trunk/src/App/Product.py   2010-06-27 12:44:22 UTC (rev 113926)
@@ -36,8 +36,6 @@
 
 import os
 
-import transaction
-
 from AccessControl.class_init import InitializeClass
 from AccessControl.owner import UnownableOwner
 from AccessControl.SecurityInfo import ClassSecurityInfo
@@ -204,13 +202,16 @@
 
 
 def initializeProduct(productp, name, home, app):
-# Initialize a levered product
+# Initialize a persistent product
+assert doInstall()
+
 import Globals  # to set data
-products = app.Control_Panel.Products
 fver = ''
 
-if hasattr(productp, '__import_error__'): ie=productp.__import_error__
-else: ie=None
+if hasattr(productp, '__import_error__'):
+ie = productp.__import_error__
+else:
+ie = None
 
 # Retrieve version number from any suitable version.txt
 for fname in ('version.txt', 'VERSION.txt', 'VERSION.TXT'):
@@ -223,32 +224,33 @@
 except IOError:
 continue
 
-old=None
+old = None
+products = app.Control_Panel.Products
 try:
-if ihasattr(products,name):
+if ihasattr(products, name):
 old=getattr(products, name)
 if ihasattr(old,'version') and old.version==fver:
 if hasattr(old, 'import_error_') and \
old.import_error_==ie:
 # Version hasn't changed. Don't reinitialize.
 return old
-except: pass
+except:
+pass
 
 f = fver and ( (%s) % fver)
-product=Product(name, 'Installed product %s%s' % (name,f))
+product=Product(name, 'Installed product %s%s' % (name, f))
 
 if old is not None:
 app._manage_remove_product_meta_type(product)
 products._delObject(name)
 for id, v in old.objectItems():
-try: product._setObject(id, v)
-except: pass
+try:
+product._setObject(id, v)
+except:
+pass
 
 products._setObject(name, product)
-product.icon='p_/InstalledProduct_icon'
-product.version=fver
-product.home=home
-product.thisIsAnInstalledProduct=1
+product.home = home
 
 if ie:
 product.import_error_=ie
@@ -277,12 +279,9 @@
 {'label':'Refresh', 'action':'manage_refresh',
  'help': ('OFSP','Product_Refresh.stx')},)
 
-if not doInstall():
-transaction.abort()
-return product
-
 return product
 
+
 def ihasattr(o, name):
 return hasattr(o, name) and o.__dict__.has_key(name)
 

Modified: Zope/trunk/src/App/ProductContext.py
===
--- Zope/trunk/src/App/ProductContext.py2010-06-27 11:44:28 UTC (rev 
113925)
+++ Zope/trunk/src/App/ProductContext.py2010-06-27 12:44:22 UTC (rev 
113926)
@@ -24,7 +24,6 @@
 from AccessControl.PermissionRole import PermissionRole
 from App.Common import package_home
 from App.ImageFile import ImageFile
-from App.Product

[Zope-Checkins] SVN: Zope/trunk/ The persistent product registry is not required for starting Zope anymore. `enable-product-installation` can be set to off if you don't rely on the functionality provi

[Hanno Schlichting]

Log message for revision 94966:
  The persistent product registry is not required for starting Zope anymore. 
`enable-product-installation` can be set to off if you don't rely on the 
functionality provided by the registry.
  

Changed:
  U   Zope/trunk/doc/CHANGES.txt
  U   Zope/trunk/lib/python/App/FactoryDispatcher.py

-=-
Modified: Zope/trunk/doc/CHANGES.txt
===
--- Zope/trunk/doc/CHANGES.txt  2009-01-23 18:51:41 UTC (rev 94965)
+++ Zope/trunk/doc/CHANGES.txt  2009-01-23 19:49:23 UTC (rev 94966)
@@ -9,6 +9,10 @@
 
 Restructuring
 
+  - The persistent product registry is not required for starting Zope
+anymore. `enable-product-installation` can be set to off if you don't
+rely on the functionality provided by the registry.
+
   - ZClasses have been deprecated for two major releases. They have been
 removed in this version of Zope.
 

Modified: Zope/trunk/lib/python/App/FactoryDispatcher.py
===
--- Zope/trunk/lib/python/App/FactoryDispatcher.py  2009-01-23 18:51:41 UTC 
(rev 94965)
+++ Zope/trunk/lib/python/App/FactoryDispatcher.py  2009-01-23 19:49:23 UTC 
(rev 94966)
@@ -40,6 +40,38 @@
 
 return packages
 
+
+class Product(object):
+Model a non-persistent product wrapper.
+
+
+security = ClassSecurityInfo()
+
+meta_type='Product'
+icon='p_/Product_icon'
+version=''
+configurable_objects_=()
+import_error_=None
+thisIsAnInstalledProduct = True
+title = 'This is a non-persistent product wrapper.'
+
+def __init__(self, id):
+self.id=id
+
+security.declarePublic('Destination')
+def Destination(self):
+Return the destination for factory output
+return self
+
+def getProductHelp(self):
+Returns the ProductHelp object associated with the Product.
+
+from HelpSys.HelpSys import ProductHelp
+return ProductHelp('Help', self.id).__of__(self)
+
+InitializeClass(Product)
+
+
 class ProductDispatcher(Implicit):
  
 # Allow access to factory dispatchers
@@ -49,14 +81,19 @@
 return self.__bobo_traverse__(None, name)
 
 def __bobo_traverse__(self, REQUEST, name):
-product=self.aq_acquire('_getProducts')()._product(name)
-
 # Try to get a custom dispatcher from a Python product
 dispatcher_class=getattr(
 _product_packages().get(name, None),
 '__FactoryDispatcher__',
 FactoryDispatcher)
 
+productfolder = self.aq_acquire('_getProducts')()
+try:
+product = productfolder._product(name)
+except AttributeError:
+# If we do not have a persistent product entry, return 
+product = Product(name)
+
 dispatcher=dispatcher_class(product, self.aq_parent, REQUEST)
 return dispatcher.__of__(self)
 

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[Zope-dev] Re: Product version number redundancy with version.txt and setup.py

[Alexander Limi]

On Mon, 07 Jul 2008 13:44:43 -0700, Wichert Akkerman [EMAIL PROTECTED]  
wrote:



Previously Hanno Schlichting wrote:

Tim Hicks wrote:
Am I right in thinking that there is a duplication of information in
having an eggified product's version number stored in setup.py and
version.txt?

Having your setup.py read its version from version.txt is easy, if you
don't want to update two places.

I think the more interesting question is, why we need a persistent
registry of installed products and any information about them at all
anymore?


ZClasses


Speaking of which, are there plans to rip out ZClasses from Zope 2.12?  
It's about time!


--
Alexander Limi · http://limi.net

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[Zope-dev] Re: Product version number redundancy with version.txt and setup.py

[Hanno Schlichting]

Tim Hicks wrote:
Am I right in thinking that there is a duplication of information in 
having an eggified product's version number stored in setup.py and 
version.txt?


Having your setup.py read its version from version.txt is easy, if you 
don't want to update two places.


I think the more interesting question is, why we need a persistent 
registry of installed products and any information about them at all 
anymore?


Having the product registry persistent causes quite some trouble when 
moving Data.fs across servers and doesn't seem to add much to any benefit.


For what kind of use-case do people use that registry nowadays, since we 
got rid of persistent products?


Hanno

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Re: [Zope-dev] Re: Product version number redundancy with version.txt and setup.py

[Wichert Akkerman]

Previously Hanno Schlichting wrote:
 Tim Hicks wrote:
 Am I right in thinking that there is a duplication of information in 
 having an eggified product's version number stored in setup.py and 
 version.txt?
 
 Having your setup.py read its version from version.txt is easy, if you 
 don't want to update two places.
 
 I think the more interesting question is, why we need a persistent 
 registry of installed products and any information about them at all 
 anymore?

ZClasses

Wichert.

-- 
Wichert Akkerman [EMAIL PROTECTED]It is simple to make things.
http://www.wiggy.net/   It is hard to make things simple.
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[Zope] PHParser/PHPGateway product error: cannot open the destination file

[Dennis Allison]

This is in reference to the PHParser/PHPGateway product, Version 1.1.5.

The PHParser/PHPGateway systgem looks to be a very useful product.  I want
to use it to bridge to a PHP implemented subsystem rather than either
translate the subsystem or run the subsystem as a separate package with
all the problems of handing off authentication, etc.

The latest version I could find is PHParser/Gateway 1.1.15.  I am using 
Zope 2.9.X under Linux with Python 2.4.  The Linux version is x86_64 
version of Centos 4.X, which is an RPM clone of RedHat.  I am using the 
system provided version of php, which I believe is the correct CGI enabled 
version, and have reviewed the php.ini for it, but have made no changes as 
changes did not seem to be necessary. 

I can execute independent PHP scripts using PHParser, but I have not been 
able to make PHPGateway work.  I set the document root directory, 
/opt/phpgate, in the create dialog.  There is an index.php file in the 
/opt/phpgate which, when executed, produces Hello World.  When I view 
the PHPGateway object, I get the diagnostic:

PHPGateway cannot open the destination file.

The print trace (commented out in the product) produces:

PHPGATEWAY: self.__realname__ set to manage_interfaces
PHPGATEWAY: self.__realname__ set to manage_interfaces
PHPGATEWAY: docroot /opt/phpgate
PHPGATEWAY: pathsegs value: ['manage_interfaces']
PHPGATEWAY: Opening PHP script: /opt/phpgate/manage_interfaces
PHPGATEWAY: Requested for /draPlay/phpgate
PHPGATEWAY: Printing error page for: /opt/phpgate/manage_interfaces

Several other people have reported a similar problem with PHPGateway, but
I have been unable to find anyone reporting a fix.  Any pointers or
suggestions would be appreciated.

 

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Re: [Zope] Upgrading a Product from Zope 2.7 to Zope 2.10

[Peter Bengtsson]

I'm not an expert at these kind of things but 3 tips:

* Don't bother with trying to run off the old Data.fs until you get
your product working in the new Zope.

* Inspect your code and what kind of objects (and most likely more
importantly) and attributes you're attaching to classes that are
persistent. I've forgotten my case now but I remember that I had a
problem when I was trying to set an attribute that turned out to be a
uncalled class method of another class.

* Get familiar with this: 'import pdb; pdb.set_trace()'

On 19/03/2008, Mark Hellewell [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Hello,

  I'm in the middle of trying to upgrade a Product written for Zope 2.7
  so that it runs on Zope 2.10!

  The product appears in the newer ZMI's list of available products but
  whenever I try to add an object of the products type through the ZMI I
  get the following error in the event.log and nothing is added to the
  site:

  Traceback (innermost last):
Module ZPublisher.Publish, line 125, in publish
Module Zope2.App.startup, line 238, in commit
Module transaction._manager, line 96, in commit
Module transaction._transaction, line 395, in commit
Module transaction._transaction, line 495, in _commitResources
Module ZODB.Connection, line 502, in commit
Module ZODB.Connection, line 1046, in savepoint
Module ZODB.Connection, line 555, in _commit
Module ZODB.Connection, line 582, in _store_objects
Module ZODB.serialize, line 407, in serialize
  TypeError: Can't pickle objects in acquisition wrappers.

  additionally, if I take a Data.fs from my Zope 2.7 instance and try
  running with it in place on a 2.10 instance the various objects of the
  product already created simply don't show up (no broken icon, nothing)

  Running Zope 2.10.5 and Python 2.4.4 and the Product in question was
  written using CMF 1.4.2 (but now upgraded to CMF 1.6.4, I've made
  several changes already to accomodate this upgrade)

  I'd be grateful for any insight anyone might have or any hints at what
  to do next!

  Thanks,
  Mark
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-- 
Peter Bengtsson,
work www.fry-it.com
home www.peterbe.com
hobby www.issuetrackerproduct.com
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Re: [Zope] Upgrading a Product from Zope 2.7 to Zope 2.10

[Dieter Maurer]

Mark Hellewell wrote at 2008-3-19 15:57 +1100:
I'm in the middle of trying to upgrade a Product written for Zope 2.7  
so that it runs on Zope 2.10!

The product appears in the newer ZMI's list of available products but  
whenever I try to add an object of the products type through the ZMI I  
get the following error in the event.log and nothing is added to the  
site:

Traceback (innermost last):
   Module ZPublisher.Publish, line 125, in publish
   Module Zope2.App.startup, line 238, in commit
   Module transaction._manager, line 96, in commit
   Module transaction._transaction, line 395, in commit
   Module transaction._transaction, line 495, in _commitResources
   Module ZODB.Connection, line 502, in commit
   Module ZODB.Connection, line 1046, in savepoint
   Module ZODB.Connection, line 555, in _commit
   Module ZODB.Connection, line 582, in _store_objects
   Module ZODB.serialize, line 407, in serialize
TypeError: Can't pickle objects in acquisition wrappers.

Try to reproduce this problem in an interactive Python session
(bin/zopectl debug under *nix). Use pdb.pm() to analyse the
post mortem traceback. Look at the object that causes the problem.
If you are lucky, the object gives you hints where the error
has been introduced.


-- 
Dieter
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[Zope] Upgrading a Product from Zope 2.7 to Zope 2.10

[Mark Hellewell]

Hello,

I'm in the middle of trying to upgrade a Product written for Zope 2.7  
so that it runs on Zope 2.10!


The product appears in the newer ZMI's list of available products but  
whenever I try to add an object of the products type through the ZMI I  
get the following error in the event.log and nothing is added to the  
site:


Traceback (innermost last):
  Module ZPublisher.Publish, line 125, in publish
  Module Zope2.App.startup, line 238, in commit
  Module transaction._manager, line 96, in commit
  Module transaction._transaction, line 395, in commit
  Module transaction._transaction, line 495, in _commitResources
  Module ZODB.Connection, line 502, in commit
  Module ZODB.Connection, line 1046, in savepoint
  Module ZODB.Connection, line 555, in _commit
  Module ZODB.Connection, line 582, in _store_objects
  Module ZODB.serialize, line 407, in serialize
TypeError: Can't pickle objects in acquisition wrappers.

additionally, if I take a Data.fs from my Zope 2.7 instance and try  
running with it in place on a 2.10 instance the various objects of the  
product already created simply don't show up (no broken icon, nothing)


Running Zope 2.10.5 and Python 2.4.4 and the Product in question was  
written using CMF 1.4.2 (but now upgraded to CMF 1.6.4, I've made  
several changes already to accomodate this upgrade)


I'd be grateful for any insight anyone might have or any hints at what  
to do next!


Thanks,
Mark
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Re: [Zope] Zope Calendar Product?

[Chris Withers]

Cliff Ford wrote:
events. I know this is a big, complicated field that teams work on for 
years. Do I expect too much?


In a word, yes ;-)

Either use Outlook, like the corporate world, or soem of the Google 
calendaring stuff which I have a feeling may be available for uses 
requiring privacy now.


cheers,

Chris

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[Zope] Zope Calendar Product?

[Cliff Ford]

Hello friends,

I have been away from Zope for a while. I have a Zope 2.9.3 installation 
(no CMS or Plone) for which someone has requested a Calendar 
application. From the Zope sites it is not clear whether any suitable 
product is available. Could anyone recommend something? Alternatively, 
might it be an idea to use a stand-alone Calendar application and plug 
it into an I-frame?


Cliff
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Re: [Zope] Zope Calendar Product?

[Giampiero Benvenuti]

Hi there,

I 'm using Calendar Tag. It does work fine for my needs:

http://www.zope.org/Members/teyc/CalendarTag

Ciao,


Giampiero


On Feb 22, 2008, at 6:20 AM, Cliff Ford wrote:


Hello friends,

I have been away from Zope for a while. I have a Zope 2.9.3  
installation (no CMS or Plone) for which someone has requested a  
Calendar application. From the Zope sites it is not clear whether  
any suitable product is available. Could anyone recommend something?  
Alternatively, might it be an idea to use a stand-alone Calendar  
application and plug it into an I-frame?


Cliff
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Re: [Zope] Zope Calendar Product?

[Cliff Ford]

Thank you Giampiero,

Your answer made me realise I had asked the wrong question. I am really 
looking for something to coordinate personal diaries for meetings and 
events. I know this is a big, complicated field that teams work on for 
years. Do I expect too much?


Cliff


Giampiero Benvenuti wrote:

Hi there,

I 'm using Calendar Tag. It does work fine for my needs:

http://www.zope.org/Members/teyc/CalendarTag

Ciao,


Giampiero


On Feb 22, 2008, at 6:20 AM, Cliff Ford wrote:


Hello friends,

I have been away from Zope for a while. I have a Zope 2.9.3 
installation (no CMS or Plone) for which someone has requested a 
Calendar application. From the Zope sites it is not clear whether any 
suitable product is available. Could anyone recommend something? 
Alternatively, might it be an idea to use a stand-alone Calendar 
application and plug it into an I-frame?


Cliff
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Re: [Zope] Calendar Tag Product question

[Jaroslav Lukesh]

- Original Message - 
From: Thomas Bennett [EMAIL PROTECTED]
fine.  Today, November 1, on both calendars not all events are appearing 
in

the calendar from the default view.  If you click back to October and then
back to November all of the events appear, this also sets the 
date-calendar
parameter in the URL to November 9.  I have found that if the 
date-calendar

parameter is 1,2,3, or 4 not all the events will display in the Corporate
Calendar or the calendar I wrote so I suspect the Calendar Product itself.



It looks like locales dateformat mismatch DDMM with MMDD

Take look at your system locales settings, Zope locales setting. Do you have 
at all machines the same gcc, zope and python version? etc...etc...


Regards, JL. 


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[Zope] Re: genealogy product?

[Max M]

Mihamina (R12y) Rakotomandimby skrev:

Hi,
Would you know any genealogy product for Zope?
Is zope a tool for managing a big (20 members) of genealogy oriented 
group, which has over 150,000,000 entries in the genealogy tree?


It is now managed with about 20 servers and SQL databases but Zope might 
be a solution, isn't it?



It depends a bit on what kind of data is in the genealogy product.

If it is 150,000,000 of very similar data objects, it might be better 
stored in a relational database.


It would probably be relatively simple to create a small working 
product, to import some of the data and see how it pans out.


--

hilsen/regards Max M, Denmark

http://www.mxm.dk/
IT's Mad Science

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[Zope] Running zope egg-packaged product tests

[Sébastien Nicouleaud]

Hello,

I'm trying to run tests for an egg-packaged product, deployed in development
mode (I'm using zope 2.10.1).
I'm using the zopectl test command, with --path set to my product source
directory.

The problem is that the test runner seems to call the product initialize()
function 2 times, resulting in duplicated profile id declarations...

Is there a way to run the tests for an egg-packaged product without setting
the --path option to the source dir, in order to prevent this duplication ?

Thanks
Seb
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Re: [Zope] Zope Crashes When Product Breaks

[Jonathan]

If you have "debug-mode on" enabled in zope.conf 
try disabling it.


Jonathan


  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  To: zope@zope.org 
  Sent: Wednesday, October 11, 2006 10:52 
  AM
  Subject: [Zope] Zope Crashes When Product 
  Breaks
  I am new to using Zope. We 
  are running a Win 2003 server with Zope 2.8.8 and have installed the 
  IssueTracker Product. Everything was working fine and now I can't access 
  the Zope manager at all. It seems whenever a product breaks, the manager 
  breaks with it. I had this problem before when I tried to install the 
  cookie crumbler. When I add an instance of this product I could no 
  longer access any part of zope nor its other products. Now this may be a 
  problem with the product itself but I'm having trouble troubleshooting the 
  product problems if the whole zope interface crashes.  
  Does anyone have any ideas on how I can get 
  Zope running again?  Things I've 
  tried: restarting the Zope service from the Services app. I also checked 
  the log to make sure it was running on port 8080. I currently get a page 
  not found error when I go to this address. The last thing I did before this broke was add a couple issues to the 
  issuetracker and added a user and that was the last I was able to access the 
  Zope manager. Thanks ~Natalie
  
  

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Re: [Zope] Zope Crashes When Product Breaks

[natalie . l . doe]

Thanks. I guess I posted to soon. I
changed the port it was listening on and it is working now. It still
is a puzzle why it won't work on that port. I suspect there is some
oracle stuff that might have been trying to share that port but this time
around there was no evidence of that so it was not my first thought.

I'll try turning the debug-mode off though
when I try to reinstall the cookie-crumbler because that breaks the manager
every time.

Thanks,
~Natalie






Jonathan [EMAIL PROTECTED]

11-Oct-2006 10:57
   




To
zope@zope.org, [EMAIL PROTECTED]


cc



Subject
Re: [Zope] Zope Crashes When
Product Breaks








If you have debug-mode on enabled
in zope.conf try disabling it.


Jonathan

- Original Message - 
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: zope@zope.org

Sent: Wednesday, October 11, 2006 10:52 AM
Subject: [Zope] Zope Crashes When Product Breaks


I am new to using Zope. We are running a Win 2003 server with Zope
2.8.8 and have installed the IssueTracker Product. Everything was
working fine and now I can't access the Zope manager at all. It seems
whenever a product breaks, the manager breaks with it. I had this
problem before when I tried to install the cookie crumbler. When
I add an instance of this product I could no longer access any part of
zope nor its other products. Now this may be a problem with the product
itself but I'm having trouble troubleshooting the product problems if the
whole zope interface crashes.  

Does anyone have any ideas on how I can get Zope running again? 


Things I've tried: restarting the Zope service from the Services app. I
also checked the log to make sure it was running on port 8080. I
currently get a page not found error when I go to this address.


The last thing I did before this broke was add a couple issues to the issuetracker
and added a user and that was the last I was able to access the Zope manager.


Thanks 
~Natalie


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Re: [Zope] Zope Crashes When Product Breaks

[Paul Winkler]

On Wed, Oct 11, 2006 at 11:22:42AM -0400, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Thanks.  I guess I posted to soon.  I changed the port it was listening on 
 and it is working now.  It still is a puzzle why it won't work on that 
 port.  

That often means that you have a zope process lingering that still holds
that port.  Try something like: ps -wax | grep py

-- 

Paul Winkler
http://www.slinkp.com
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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[Peter Bengtsson]

Dieter Maurer wrote:

Peter Bengtsson wrote at 2006-8-18 18:53 +0100:

...
One last odd clue, when I refresh my product (eg. MyProduct) in zope
2.9.4, actual something happens. My product is very very simple and
it's one main class has a method called index_html() that looks like
this:


from DateTime import DateTime
   def index_html(self, REQUEST, RESPONSE):
 doc str 
return str(DateTime())

It works fine. After I manually refresh the product through the
Control_Panel, I get an error in index_html() because now 'DateTime'
has become None and thus can't be called with DateTime().
Does that help you help me?


Global variables apparently becoming None is a sign
that you are using an old (pre refresh) version of a function
(index_html in your case).

  When a module is released, some Python magic arranges that
  all its variables are rebound to None.

  When the function accesses one of its globals, it then appears as None.


If you have accessed the index_html via a persistent instance,
then the resetCaches seems not to have done what we expect
(it should have caused the connection cache to be dropped and
a new instance loaded from the storage with the new class definition).

The function resetCaches() and self._resetCache() in ZODB.Connection 
hasn't changed from zope 2.8 to zope 2.9.

 the code =
global_reset_counter = 0

def resetCaches():
Causes all connection caches to be reset as connections are 
reopened.


Zope's refresh feature uses this.  When you reload Python modules,
instances of classes continue to use the old class definitions.
To use the new code immediately, the refresh feature asks ZODB to
clear caches by calling resetCaches().  When the instances are
loaded by subsequent connections, they will use the new class
definitions.

global global_reset_counter
global_reset_counter += 1

class Connection(ExportImport, object):

def _resetCache(self):
Creates a new cache, discarding the old one.

See the docstring for the resetCaches() function.

self._reset_counter = global_reset_counter
self._invalidated.clear()
cache_size = self._cache.cache_size
self._cache = cache = PickleCache(self, cache_size)






--
Peter Bengtsson,
work www.fry-it.com
home www.peterbe.com
hobby www.issuetrackerproduct.com
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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[Dieter Maurer]

Peter Bengtsson wrote at 2006-8-21 10:13 +0100:
 ... global variables turn to 'None' after refresh ...

 If you have accessed the index_html via a persistent instance,
 then the resetCaches seems not to have done what we expect
 (it should have caused the connection cache to be dropped and
 a new instance loaded from the storage with the new class definition).
 
The function resetCaches() and self._resetCache() in ZODB.Connection 
hasn't changed from zope 2.8 to zope 2.9.

Nevertheless, your index_html seems to be old.

Apparently, the old module instance was dropped (this dropping caused
the global variable to get 'None'). You should now have
a new module instance in its place in sys.modules (reflecting your
code change). If the ZODB connection cache was replaced by a new
one, then the self of your index_html is newly loaded from the storage.
This should give it the new class definition (where index_html
references the new module instance).

Something along this line appears to be wrong.
You need to investigate what it is.



-- 
Dieter
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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[Peter Bengtsson]

 What happens when you try to refresh a product?

Nothing. No errors, no refresh.

Then you should look in the SVN repository how the refresh code
changed.

   In Zope 2.8, refresh moves all modules starting with
   Products.product_to_be_refreshed out of sys.modules
   (and into a safe place) and then reimports the product.

   If there is an exception, the saved modules are restored.
   Otherwise, the ZODB is told to discard the connection cache
   when the connection is opened for the next time.

With this code, no errors, no refresh is impossible
(you get either an error or a refesh).

No really. My last comment was a big ambiguous.
The Refresh tab of the Control_Panel is does say Product refreshed.
(2006-08-18 18:33)
But it actually fails. It gets more complicated...



Of course, someone may have turned the refresh into a noop.
Then, you can try to reinstate the former code and see what
happens.


I've now done a lot of searching and diffs on the difference between
some zope286 and some zope294 code.
The modules I've looked at are:
ZODB.Connection.resetCaches() - no difference
ZODB.Connection - BIG difference (but is it applicable?)
OFS.Application - instead of zLOG-logger, tiny difference in raise
App.RefreshFuncs - instead of zLOG-logger

I've also compared the difference between python2.3 and python2.4's
__import__ builtin function and I can't see any difference.

On that note, I started my zope286 with python2.4 but refreshing was
still possible so zope2.9 requiring python2.4 does not seem to be the
reason.

I'm quite stuck right now. I haven't yet really dug into how
sys.modules work. The Zope code doesn't seem to have changed inside
the function import_product() of OFS.Application.

One last odd clue, when I refresh my product (eg. MyProduct) in zope
2.9.4, actual something happens. My product is very very simple and
it's one main class has a method called index_html() that looks like
this:


from DateTime import DateTime
   def index_html(self, REQUEST, RESPONSE):
 doc str 
return str(DateTime())

It works fine. After I manually refresh the product through the
Control_Panel, I get an error in index_html() because now 'DateTime'
has become None and thus can't be called with DateTime().
Does that help you help me?



--
Peter Bengtsson,
work www.fry-it.com
home www.peterbe.com
hobby www.issuetrackerproduct.com
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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[Dieter Maurer]

Peter Bengtsson wrote at 2006-8-18 18:53 +0100:
 ...
One last odd clue, when I refresh my product (eg. MyProduct) in zope
2.9.4, actual something happens. My product is very very simple and
it's one main class has a method called index_html() that looks like
this:


from DateTime import DateTime
def index_html(self, REQUEST, RESPONSE):
  doc str 
 return str(DateTime())

It works fine. After I manually refresh the product through the
Control_Panel, I get an error in index_html() because now 'DateTime'
has become None and thus can't be called with DateTime().
Does that help you help me?

Global variables apparently becoming None is a sign
that you are using an old (pre refresh) version of a function
(index_html in your case).

  When a module is released, some Python magic arranges that
  all its variables are rebound to None.

  When the function accesses one of its globals, it then appears as None.


If you have accessed the index_html via a persistent instance,
then the resetCaches seems not to have done what we expect
(it should have caused the connection cache to be dropped and
a new instance loaded from the storage with the new class definition).



-- 
Dieter
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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[Peter Bengtsson]

Dieter Maurer wrote:

James Davies wrote at 2006-8-7 21:47 +1000:

I've been attempting to develop products with Zope 2.9, and am finding
it increasingly difficult and slow to do so as Product refreshing no longer
works.


What happens when you try to refresh a product?


Nothing. No errors, no refresh.


Does it happen only when the product uses Five?
I've only tried refreshing a non-Five product in Zope 2.9 and it doesn't 
work.

Or can even products not using Five not be refreshed?

Yes.

A side note...
I've followed this thread in the mailinglist and it seems that people 
get sidetracked into maintaining the session state and/or restarting 
zope via zeo clients.
What REALLY concerns me is development. Not production. If I had to 
restart Zope every time I make a change I want to test I'd loose several 
hours worth of valuable work time every week. Plus every time you have 
to wait for Zope to restart there's a silent moment of waiting which can 
be distracting so that you loose the flow. Very unproductive.



--
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work www.fry-it.com
home www.peterbe.com
hobby www.issuetrackerproduct.com
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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[Jonathan]

- Original Message - 
From: Peter Bengtsson [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: Dieter Maurer [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Cc: zope@zope.org
Sent: Wednesday, August 16, 2006 5:47 AM
Subject: Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing





Dieter Maurer wrote:

James Davies wrote at 2006-8-7 21:47 +1000:

I've been attempting to develop products with Zope 2.9, and am finding
it increasingly difficult and slow to do so as Product refreshing no 
longer

works.


What happens when you try to refresh a product?


Nothing. No errors, no refresh.


Does it happen only when the product uses Five?
I've only tried refreshing a non-Five product in Zope 2.9 and it doesn't 
work.

Or can even products not using Five not be refreshed?

Yes.

A side note...
I've followed this thread in the mailinglist and it seems that people get 
sidetracked into maintaining the session state and/or restarting zope via 
zeo clients.
What REALLY concerns me is development. Not production. If I had to 
restart Zope every time I make a change I want to test I'd loose several 
hours worth of valuable work time every week. Plus every time you have to 
wait for Zope to restart there's a silent moment of waiting which can be 
distracting so that you loose the flow. Very unproductive.


I am developing under zope 2.9.2 and have adopted a slightly different 
approach which minimizes the impact of the 'broken refresh':  I only use 
Products for class definitions, all other code goes into external methods 
(which are automatically 'refreshed' if you have debug turned on).  There 
are no delays in development using this approach (the code/test cycle is 
immediate), but whether or not you can use this methodology depends on your 
overall design approach.



Jonathan



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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[Dieter Maurer]

Peter Bengtsson wrote at 2006-8-16 10:47 +0100:
Dieter Maurer wrote:
 James Davies wrote at 2006-8-7 21:47 +1000:
 I've been attempting to develop products with Zope 2.9, and am finding
 it increasingly difficult and slow to do so as Product refreshing no longer
 works.
 
 What happens when you try to refresh a product?
 
Nothing. No errors, no refresh.

Then you should look in the SVN repository how the refresh code
changed.

   In Zope 2.8, refresh moves all modules starting with
   Products.product_to_be_refreshed out of sys.modules
   (and into a safe place) and then reimports the product.

   If there is an exception, the saved modules are restored.
   Otherwise, the ZODB is told to discard the connection cache
   when the connection is opened for the next time.

With this code, no errors, no refresh is impossible
(you get either an error or a refesh).

Of course, someone may have turned the refresh into a noop.
Then, you can try to reinstate the former code and see what
happens.



-- 
Dieter
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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[Lennart Regebro]

On 8/7/06, Dieter Maurer [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

For this to work, we almost sure need to tell Five that the product
was refreshed such that Five can reprocess the *.zcml files for the
product.


Yeah, and we don't, and ZCML isn't designed for reprocessing, so I'm
not at all sure it's easy (but it may be).

I haven't looked deeply into this, I try to be testdriven, and then
refresh is not a problem. :)

--
Lennart Regebro, Nuxeo http://www.nuxeo.com/
CPS Content Management http://www.cps-project.org/
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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[Lennart Regebro]

On 8/8/06, James Davies [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

People pay large sums of money for us to host there critical business
infrastructure. If we have to restart zope for any reason, people get apache
proxy errors and lose session data.


Well, right the session data would be annoying.
But still, most companies do accept that you schedule upgrades, and I
still would like to know what kind of business can't accept a
one-minute scheduled outage from time to time. I sure never have met
one.

--
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CPS Content Management http://www.cps-project.org/
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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[Chris McDonough]

FWIW, the session data problem can be solved with the use of a ZODB
session data container that is not stored in RAM  (e.g. an SDC that is
not /temp_folder/session_data), or a reimplentation of a session manager
that uses a relational database or the filesystem.

The proxy error issue should be solved by using multiple Zope servers
and a load balancer which allows you to remove each from the service
pool before restarting it.

- C

On Tue, 2006-08-08 at 12:24 +0200, Lennart Regebro wrote:
 On 8/8/06, James Davies [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  People pay large sums of money for us to host there critical business
  infrastructure. If we have to restart zope for any reason, people get apache
  proxy errors and lose session data.
 
 Well, right the session data would be annoying.
 But still, most companies do accept that you schedule upgrades, and I
 still would like to know what kind of business can't accept a
 one-minute scheduled outage from time to time. I sure never have met
 one.
 

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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[James Davies]

On 8/7/06, Andreas Jung [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
You might blame Plone for shipping for three tons of frameworks?Incidently, I've just added some print statements to trace the Zope startup, and Five is by far the slowest product to load, taking about 3 seconds. Running up is PlacelessTranslationService at around 
1.5 seconds (And much less if I kill all .po files). -James.
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[Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[James Davies]

Hi. I've been attempting to develop products with Zope 2.9, and am
finding it increasingly difficult and slow to do so as Product
refreshing no longer works.

Google shows up a few results from mailing lists with somewhat negative
responses (The gist I'm getting is that no-one 'in the know' wants to
worry about fixing it, as they don't see a real need for it).

However, as a zope restart seems to take a good 5-10 seconds on my high
end workstation (AthlonX2 4800+) with all the essentiall products
installed (Plone, archetypes etc, plus my application), it's starting
to become a major problem.

as an example, I spent about three hours today debugging a problem, 90%
of which was wasted waiting for zope restarts after making small
changes and adding trace print statements. If I was able to refresh the
product I would likely have taken less than half an hour. 

Another major issue I've discovered is Zope hosting. We reguarly deploy
custom sites on shared zope environments, and having to restart an
entire server just to update one product severely breaks our uptime
guarentee.

I'm afraid we are going to have no choice but to either drop back to
Zope 2.8, or ditch Zope entirely- something I'd prefer not to have to
do with our large codebase. 

I'm hoping I can garner some support to get the zope developers to fix
the problem. Failing that, ANY information pointing me in the right
direction would be helpful, as I'm more than happy to fix it
myself and submit a patch. 

If anyone else is finding this a problem, please reply in this thread. :-) 

Thanks in advance.

 James. 
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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[Andreas Jung]

--On 7. August 2006 21:47:37 +1000 James Davies [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:



Hi. I've been attempting to develop products with Zope 2.9, and am finding
it increasingly difficult and slow to do so as Product refreshing no
longer
works.

Google shows up a few results from mailing lists with somewhat negative
responses (The gist I'm getting is that no-one 'in the know' wants to
worry
about fixing it, as they don't see a real need for it).


Refreshing was always a hack and never something I would call a feature.
It was always a hack for *development* purposes but not for production.



However, as a zope restart seems to take a good 5-10 seconds on my high
end
workstation (AthlonX2 4800+) with all the essentiall products installed
(Plone, archetypes etc, plus my application), it's starting to become a
major problem.


You might blame Plone for shipping for three tons of frameworks?



as an example, I spent about three hours today debugging a problem, 90% of
which was wasted waiting for zope restarts after making small changes and
adding trace print statements. If I was able to refresh the product I
would
likely have taken less than half an hour.


I understand and fully agree with you but things are as they are. Even 
worserRefresh does not work Five...




Another major issue I've discovered is Zope hosting. We reguarly deploy
custom sites on shared zope environments, and having to restart an entire
server just to update one product severely breaks our uptime guarentee.


Refresh only works in debug-mode. You want to tell us that you are running 
a production site in debug-mode?




I'm afraid we are going to have no choice but to either drop back to Zope
2.8, or ditch Zope entirely- something I'd prefer not to have to do with
our
large codebase.





I'm hoping I can garner some support to get the zope developers to fix the
problem. Failing that, ANY information pointing me in the right direction
would be helpful, as I'm more than happy to fix it myself and submit a
patch.


Dieter Maurer wrote a RefreshTool product lately (not sure if this would 
solve your problem and not sure if he released it).


I doubt that the Refresh situation will change in the near future.

-aj



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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[Reinoud van Leeuwen]

On Mon, Aug 07, 2006 at 09:47:37PM +1000, James Davies wrote:

 Another major issue I've discovered is Zope hosting. We reguarly deploy
 custom sites on shared zope environments, and having to restart an entire
 server just to update one product severely breaks our uptime guarentee.

If you use a ZEO setup you can restart the ZEO clients one-by-one. Works 
for me without downtime...


-- 
__
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Reinoud van Leeuwen[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.xs4all.nl/~reinoud
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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[James Davies]

On 8/7/06, Andreas Jung [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Refreshing was always a hack and never something I would call a feature.It was always a hack for *development* purposes but not for production.

Yes, but it's still very handy and many people have come to rely on it.

You might blame Plone for shipping for three tons of frameworks?

I'd agree with you there- theres a little too much bloat, but theres
not much that can be done about it at this point without a major
architecture update.

I understand and fully agree with you but things are as they are. EvenworserRefresh does not work Five...

How come? Is there a major technical reason why it CANT work, or is it
something thats just broken and needs fixing. I'm happy to do the
fixing if it comes to that, I just need someone to point me in the
right direction. 

Refresh only works in debug-mode. You want to tell us that you are runninga production site in debug-mode?

No. I've never had a problem refreshing in production mode ?

Dieter Maurer wrote a RefreshTool product lately (not sure if this wouldsolve your problem and not sure if he released it).

I'll have a look- thanks. 
I doubt that the Refresh situation will change in the near future.

As above- is this a major technical problem with Zope 2.9 or Five, or just something that no-one is really bothered to fix?

Thanks, 
 James. 
 
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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[James Davies]

We have Zeo, but running a seperate instance of zope for each site is
still too much (We probably host around 50 sites at the moment, and
growing. The only economical way to do this is to put multiple sites in
one zope instance).On 8/7/06, Reinoud van Leeuwen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Mon, Aug 07, 2006 at 09:47:37PM +1000, James Davies wrote: Another major issue I've discovered is Zope hosting. We reguarly deploy custom sites on shared zope environments, and having to restart an entire
 server just to update one product severely breaks our uptime guarentee.If you use a ZEO setup you can restart the ZEO clients one-by-one. Worksfor me without downtime...--__
Nothing is as subjective as realityReinoud van Leeuwen[EMAIL PROTECTED]http://www.xs4all.nl/~reinoud
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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[Reinoud van Leeuwen]

On Mon, Aug 07, 2006 at 10:12:42PM +1000, James Davies wrote:
 We have Zeo, but running a seperate instance of zope for each site is still
 too much (We probably host around 50 sites at the moment, and growing. The
 only economical way to do this is to put multiple sites in one zope
 instance).

Still you can shutdown 1 ZEO client; update products there and start it up 
again... There will be some performance degradation but the sites stay 
up... (and I hope you've got enough ZEO clients so that bringing 1 down 
will not cause severe problems...)


-- 
__
Nothing is as subjective as reality
Reinoud van Leeuwen[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://www.xs4all.nl/~reinoud
__
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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[Andreas Jung]

--On 7. August 2006 22:08:04 +1000 James Davies [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:



On 8/7/06, Andreas Jung [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:



Refreshing was always a hack and never something I would call a feature.
It was always a hack for *development* purposes but not for production.



Yes, but it's still very handy and many people have come to rely on it.

You might blame Plone for shipping for three tons of frameworks?


I'd agree with you there- theres a little too much bloat, but theres not
much that can be done about it at this point without a major architecture
update.


As Reinoud pointed out: you might think about your architecture and use 
multiple ZEO clients + load balancing.





I understand and fully agree with you but things are as they are. Even

worserRefresh does not work Five...



How come? Is there a major technical reason why it CANT work, or is it
something thats just broken and needs fixing. I'm happy to do the fixing
if
it comes to that, I just need someone to point me in the right direction.


Refresh only works in debug-mode. You want to tell us that you are running

a production site in debug-mode?



No. I've never had a problem refreshing in production mode ?


Afaik Refresh is not available when running in debug-mode...




As above- is this a major technical problem with Zope 2.9 or Five, or just
something that no-one is really bothered to fix?


Everything is a technical problem :-) E.g. Zope 3 browser views (except 
page templates) can not be refreshed..so you have at least one Zope 3 
issue


-aj

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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[Lennart Regebro]

On 8/7/06, James Davies [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


Hi. I've been attempting to develop products with Zope 2.9, and am finding
it increasingly difficult and slow to do so as Product refreshing no longer
works.

 Google shows up a few results from mailing lists with somewhat negative
responses (The gist I'm getting is that no-one 'in the know' wants to worry
about fixing it, as they don't see a real need for it).


Yeah, too bad, but making it better is complicated, and it can never
be perfect anyway.


 Another major issue I've discovered is Zope hosting. We reguarly deploy
custom sites on shared zope environments, and having to restart an entire
server just to update one product severely breaks our uptime guarentee.


You mean you can't allow the server even to be down for the less than
a minute it takes to restart it? I would honestly be very interested
in knowing what kind of systems you run that has that sort of
requirements.

But in any case, as mentioned by others here, multiple ZEO-clients and
load balancing fixes this for most cases.


I'm hoping I can garner some support to get the zope developers to fix the
problem.


Well, I'm sure it can be improved by throwing money on the right people... ;)

--
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CPS Content Management http://www.cps-project.org/
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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[Dieter Maurer]

Andreas Jung wrote at 2006-8-7 13:56 +0200:
 ...
Refreshing was always a hack and never something I would call a feature.
It was always a hack for *development* purposes but not for production.

We are speaking about development, not about production.

 ...
Refresh does not work Five...

Do you understand why?

In my view, refreshing should work with Five.

For this to work, we almost sure need to tell Five that the product
was refreshed such that Five can reprocess the *.zcml files for the
product.

 ...
 Another major issue I've discovered is Zope hosting. We reguarly deploy
 custom sites on shared zope environments, and having to restart an entire
 server just to update one product severely breaks our uptime guarentee.

Refresh only works in debug-mode. You want to tell us that you are running 
a production site in debug-mode?

I think you err, Andreas.

Refresh always works, at least the explicit refresh (do not know
about the automatic one which I have never used).

 ...
 I'm hoping I can garner some support to get the zope developers to fix the
 problem.

I am a great fan of refresh and would try to get it fixed if we
had a need for it.

But, we decided recently, to stick with Zope 2.8.1 until Zope 2.11 is
released. This means, it may take some time that I need to get active...

Nevertheless, it may come sooner as some external developpers are
a fan of Five and want to install a newer version. As we all
expect Five to be the reason that refresh no longer works, this might
force me to look into this problem earlier than I currently think.

 ...
Dieter Maurer wrote a RefreshTool product lately (not sure if this would 
solve your problem and not sure if he released it).

The refresh tool is employer's work and therefore not released.

Furthermore, it solves a problem with dependent product refreshs
but I am not sure whether it will solve the Five problem -- maybe,
if it would be sufficient to refresh Five as well.

@James: you may try this: refresh your product, then refresh Five.
If this succeeds, then a technique similar to the RefreshTool may be
sufficient.



-- 
Dieter
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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[Andreas Jung]

--On 7. August 2006 20:30:11 +0200 Dieter Maurer [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:



Andreas Jung wrote at 2006-8-7 13:56 +0200:

...
Refreshing was always a hack and never something I would call a feature.
It was always a hack for *development* purposes but not for production.


We are speaking about development, not about production.


We're also talking about techniques to avoid downtime. So we are are also
speaking of production :-)




...
Refresh does not work Five...


Do you understand why?


No, and I did not try.



In my view, refreshing should work with Five.

For this to work, we almost sure need to tell Five that the product
was refreshed such that Five can reprocess the *.zcml files for the
product.


I think this is basically a Zope 3 issue and not a Zope 2 issue. There
were also some approaches in Z3 to make browser views somehow
refreshable but I nothing that appeared in a release so far.





...

Another major issue I've discovered is Zope hosting. We reguarly deploy
custom sites on shared zope environments, and having to restart an
entire server just to update one product severely breaks our uptime
guarentee.


Refresh only works in debug-mode. You want to tell us that you are
running  a production site in debug-mode?


I think you err, Andreas.


See my later posting.



Refresh always works, at least the explicit refresh (do not know
about the automatic one which I have never used).


...

I'm hoping I can garner some support to get the zope developers to fix
the problem.


I am a great fan of refresh and would try to get it fixed if we
had a need for it.



Nevertheless, it may come sooner as some external developpers are
a fan of Five and want to install a newer version. As we all
expect Five to be the reason that refresh no longer works, this might
force me to look into this problem earlier than I currently think.


This is basically an issue when you work with Plone. Loading the complete
boilerplate really takes ages. An instance running on a decent machine will 
start fast when  you work with CMF  friends.


-aj

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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[Dieter Maurer]

James Davies wrote at 2006-8-7 21:47 +1000:
I've been attempting to develop products with Zope 2.9, and am finding
it increasingly difficult and slow to do so as Product refreshing no longer
works.

What happens when you try to refresh a product?

Does it happen only when the product uses Five?
Or can even products not using Five not be refreshed?



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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[Dieter Maurer]

Reinoud van Leeuwen wrote at 2006-8-7 14:15 +0200:
On Mon, Aug 07, 2006 at 10:12:42PM +1000, James Davies wrote:
 We have Zeo, but running a seperate instance of zope for each site is still
 too much (We probably host around 50 sites at the moment, and growing. The
 only economical way to do this is to put multiple sites in one zope
 instance).

Still you can shutdown 1 ZEO client; update products there and start it up 
again... There will be some performance degradation but the sites stay 
up...

You need to restart all ZEO clients such that they see the new product all.

Furthermore, your session data must be stored persistently for this to
work (which is considerably less efficient that storing them in RAM).



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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[Dieter Maurer]

Andreas Jung wrote at 2006-8-7 20:43 +0200:
 ...
 Nevertheless, it may come sooner as some external developpers are
 a fan of Five and want to install a newer version. As we all
 expect Five to be the reason that refresh no longer works, this might
 force me to look into this problem earlier than I currently think.

This is basically an issue when you work with Plone. Loading the complete
boilerplate really takes ages. An instance running on a decent machine will 
start fast when  you work with CMF  friends.

We know that already AT (and CMF) cause slow startup.
Probably, Plone will make it worse but even without it, we want something
comparable to refresh.



-- 
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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[John Schinnerer]

Aloha,


Refresh always works, at least the explicit refresh (do not know
about the automatic one which I have never used).


I'm on 2.7 and yes, the explicit and *very* useful refresh tab in the 
ZMI seems to work fine in production mode also.


I do not remember fondly the old days (2.4, 2.5) of having to restart 
zope for every little product change/tweak/debug effort during 
development, or when doing a minor product upgrade to production server.


I was going to upgrade to 2.9 very soon but now may go only to 2.8.
I don't have the technical chops to work on a refresh solution in 2.9+, 
however I heartily support such efforts from those of you who also see 
it as an important issue.


cheers,
John S.


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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[Chris McDonough]

The real effort towards making a better refresh should likely be  
spent at the level of the Python interpreter.  The dynamic nature of  
Python is the thing that allows for a refresh in the first place,  
but the implementation of Python object references limits its  
usefulness.


The implementation of reload could be vastly improved by changing  
Python internally to allow for a sort of mark-and-sweep reload that  
could traverse an object graph full of references between an object  
and the modules that it is declared in.  Anything else will likely be  
too fragile to work in all cases.


On Aug 7, 2006, at 4:36 PM, John Schinnerer wrote:


Aloha,


Refresh always works, at least the explicit refresh (do not know
about the automatic one which I have never used).


I'm on 2.7 and yes, the explicit and *very* useful refresh tab in  
the ZMI seems to work fine in production mode also.


I do not remember fondly the old days (2.4, 2.5) of having to  
restart zope for every little product change/tweak/debug effort  
during development, or when doing a minor product upgrade to  
production server.


I was going to upgrade to 2.9 very soon but now may go only to 2.8.
I don't have the technical chops to work on a refresh solution in  
2.9+, however I heartily support such efforts from those of you who  
also see it as an important issue.


cheers,
John S.


--

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--
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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[John Schinnerer]

Since I never knew the refresh tab was a fragile hack, it always worked 
fine for me... :-)


Are you saying that a really good solution for this is in the hands of 
python developers, not zope developers?
In that case it seems far off, if ever, since zope is only one of many 
many applications using python.

I would settle for another fragile hack that works, I guess.
The volume of posts so far would seem to indicate that it's not a 
trivial topic...


John S.

Chris McDonough wrote:
The real effort towards making a better refresh should likely be  
spent at the level of the Python interpreter.  The dynamic nature of  
Python is the thing that allows for a refresh in the first place,  but 
the implementation of Python object references limits its  usefulness.


The implementation of reload could be vastly improved by changing  
Python internally to allow for a sort of mark-and-sweep reload that  
could traverse an object graph full of references between an object  and 
the modules that it is declared in.  Anything else will likely be  too 
fragile to work in all cases.


On Aug 7, 2006, at 4:36 PM, John Schinnerer wrote:


Aloha,


Refresh always works, at least the explicit refresh (do not know
about the automatic one which I have never used).



I'm on 2.7 and yes, the explicit and *very* useful refresh tab in  the 
ZMI seems to work fine in production mode also.


I do not remember fondly the old days (2.4, 2.5) of having to  restart 
zope for every little product change/tweak/debug effort  during 
development, or when doing a minor product upgrade to  production server.


I was going to upgrade to 2.9 very soon but now may go only to 2.8.
I don't have the technical chops to work on a refresh solution in  
2.9+, however I heartily support such efforts from those of you who  
also see it as an important issue.


cheers,
John S.


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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[Chris McDonough]

On Aug 7, 2006, at 5:57 PM, John Schinnerer wrote:

Since I never knew the refresh tab was a fragile hack, it always  
worked fine for me... :-)


Bliss!  I'm happy for you!  FWIW, you've just had it nail you now,  
whereas I'd had it nail me four years ago, and swore it off then. ;-)




Are you saying that a really good solution for this is in the  
hands of python developers, not zope developers?


Yes.

In that case it seems far off, if ever, since zope is only one of  
many many applications using python.


There are many non-Zope applications that could benefit from better  
reload support in Python including any application that could benefit  
from running continuously without restart.  Improving Python this way  
is a rising tide floats all boats sort of thing, maybe worthy of  
some sort of sprint at PyCon or something like it.



I would settle for another fragile hack that works, I guess.
The volume of posts so far would seem to indicate that it's not a  
trivial topic...


Honestly I have no idea how trivial or nontrivial fixing the current  
Refresh implementation is, and frankly (shame on me, yes, I'm  
selfish, I'm sorry) I don't care.  It doesn't hurt me because I don't  
develop using all of Plone often, so my startup times are reasonably  
acceptable.  Even if I did develop using all of Plone often, I'd  
likely try to find the root causes of the slow startup and fix them  
or fix Python rather than fixing the Zope Rrefresh implementation.
I realize that by having that position, I'm likely in the minority as  
a consumer, but unfortunately for those consumers, my position is  
likely shared by the majority of producers (core developers). ;-)


- C

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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[James Davies]

This isn't really a solution. Clients will still lose session data, which is 
unacceptable.

-James.

On Monday 07 August 2006 22:15, Reinoud van Leeuwen wrote:
 On Mon, Aug 07, 2006 at 10:12:42PM +1000, James Davies wrote:
  We have Zeo, but running a seperate instance of zope for each site is
  still too much (We probably host around 50 sites at the moment, and
  growing. The only economical way to do this is to put multiple sites in
  one zope instance).

 Still you can shutdown 1 ZEO client; update products there and start it up
 again... There will be some performance degradation but the sites stay
 up... (and I hope you've got enough ZEO clients so that bringing 1 down
 will not cause severe problems...)
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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 Product Refreshing

[James Davies]

On Tuesday 08 August 2006 01:34, you wrote:
 You mean you can't allow the server even to be down for the less than
 a minute it takes to restart it? I would honestly be very interested
 in knowing what kind of systems you run that has that sort of
 requirements.

Are you serious?

People pay large sums of money for us to host there critical business 
infrastructure. If we have to restart zope for any reason, people get apache 
proxy errors and lose session data. 

-James.
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[Zope] Refreshing zope2 product

[Peter Bengtsson]

In case you've missed this, I've written a little quick article about
how I refresh my zope products when developing product code.
http://www.fry-it.com/at/refresh-my-zope-products
I know that this might be a personal preference but consider how many
people who still use zope-restart to test changes I think this is
worth a shot.


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work www.fry-it.com
home www.peterbe.com
hobby www.issuetrackerproduct.com
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[Zope] Re: Zope product update question

[Cyrille Bonnet]

Hi guys,

thanks for your replies. It is very helpful.

Essentially, I was trusting the Quick Installer tool too much: files on 
the file system will be used, regardless if you've installed the product 
or not.


Thanks for your help.

Cyrille

Jens Vagelpohl wrote:

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1


On 20 Apr 2006, at 22:39, Cyrille Bonnet wrote:


Hi there,

I have a question regarding product update.

I have updated a product (ATContentTypes) on the file system. Upon  
restarting the server, the new version of the product appears in  red 
in the QuickInstaller (as expected).


Even though I haven't re-installed the product, some changes are  
picked up (for instance, it uses the new schemata for ATDocument).


Is this the expected behaviour?



Yes. Once the new code is on the file system it will be read in and  used.

I believe the QuickInstaller does nothing more than execute  external 
methods that have special well-known names which then  trigger 
whatever Plone magic needs to be triggered to complete the  upgrade. The 
QuickInstaller is a special Plone-only item, normal  Zope product 
installation does not use it.


jens

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Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (Darwin)

iD8DBQFESAKVRAx5nvEhZLIRArwXAJ0biLjUrcfVI3h+BVI2uBHJ1n9Z/gCgqnCw
pZ6TPGApiF5Uw5iv86fVnu8=
=nPcN
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Re: [Zope] calling a product with xmlrpc

[Dieter Maurer]

Paul Winkler wrote at 2006-4-11 20:06 -0400:
 ...
I do think it's odd he got NotFound

One gets NotFound with debug-mode off, one gets a
message describing that a docstring is missing with debug-mode on.

It was an error to switch to debug-mode off by default...


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[Zope] calling a product with xmlrpc

[Reinoud van Leeuwen]

Hi,

I have a working Pyhton script to search for users in a plone site with a 
commandline xmlrpc client. It cannot be changed into an external method 
because of the fact that it only works when running under a role with 
sufficient rights.
So I turned it into a product.

Basically I have (I have deleted some obvious code):

class Xmlrpcindex(UniqueObject, SimpleItem):
security = ClassSecurityInfo()
security.declarePublic('search')

def search (self, SearchableText):
return 'foobar'

The product is recignized as a Zope product and Plone product. It is 
installed in my Plone instance and I have made an instance in my Plone 
root (with id my_xmlrpc_instance).

So the client looks like this:

import xmlrpclib
server = xmlrpclib.Server('http://localhost/plonesite/my_xmlrpc_instance')
results = server.search('sometext')


This however generates a NotFound Exception :-(

Am I doing something elementary wrong? Should I call the search method in 
another way?

From the ZMI error log:

User Name (User Id) Anonymous User (None)
Request URL http://localhost/plonesite/my_xmlrpc_instance/search
Exception Type  NotFound
Exception Value http://localhost/plonesite/my_xmlrpc_instance/search

Traceback (innermost last):

* Module ZPublisher.Publish, line 92, in publish
* Module ZPublisher.BaseRequest, line 344, in traverse
* Module ZPublisher.HTTPResponse, line 640, in debugError



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Re: [Zope] calling a product with xmlrpc

[Paul Winkler]

On Tue, Apr 11, 2006 at 05:54:35PM +0200, Reinoud van Leeuwen wrote:
 Hi,
 
 I have a working Pyhton script to search for users in a plone site with a 
 commandline xmlrpc client. It cannot be changed into an external method 
 because of the fact that it only works when running under a role with 
 sufficient rights.
 So I turned it into a product.
 
 Basically I have (I have deleted some obvious code):
 
 class Xmlrpcindex(UniqueObject, SimpleItem):
 security = ClassSecurityInfo()
 security.declarePublic('search')
 
 def search (self, SearchableText):
   return 'foobar'
 
 The product is recignized as a Zope product and Plone product. It is 
 installed in my Plone instance and I have made an instance in my Plone 
 root (with id my_xmlrpc_instance).
 
 So the client looks like this:
 
 import xmlrpclib
 server = xmlrpclib.Server('http://localhost/plonesite/my_xmlrpc_instance')
 results = server.search('sometext')
 
 
 This however generates a NotFound Exception :-(

I'm not sure why you get NotFound, but one thing I spotted is that
anything you want to publish in zope 2 must have a docstring.

Stating the obvious: have you at least verified that the server url is
correct?  You should be able to point your browser directly at 
http://localhost/plonesite/my_xmlrpc_instance .

also, I'm not familiar with xmlrpclib.Server.
The library docs only mention xmlrpclib.ServerProxy, afaict.
Presumably that's just a typo and you are using the standard
xmlrpclib?

-- 

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Re: [Zope] calling a product with xmlrpc

[Floyd May]

Paul Winkler wrote:

On Tue, Apr 11, 2006 at 05:54:35PM +0200, Reinoud van Leeuwen wrote:

[...]
This however generates a NotFound Exception :-(


I'm not sure why you get NotFound, but one thing I spotted is that
anything you want to publish in zope 2 must have a docstring.



I've ran into situations where lack-of-docstring results in a NotFound. 
   Not saying that this is the sole culprit of the trouble, but it's 
certainly worth knowing.



--
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Senior Systems Analyst
CTLN - CareerTech Learning Network
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Re: [Zope] calling a product with xmlrpc

[Reinoud van Leeuwen]

On Tue, Apr 11, 2006 at 01:43:22PM -0500, Floyd May wrote:
 Paul Winkler wrote:
 On Tue, Apr 11, 2006 at 05:54:35PM +0200, Reinoud van Leeuwen wrote:
 [...]
 This however generates a NotFound Exception :-(
 
 I'm not sure why you get NotFound, but one thing I spotted is that
 anything you want to publish in zope 2 must have a docstring.
 
 
 I've ran into situations where lack-of-docstring results in a NotFound. 
Not saying that this is the sole culprit of the trouble, but it's 
 certainly worth knowing.

Thanks! that did it!

Is this a bug or a feature? I would expect something else in the errorlog 
(or a warning in the eventlog)

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Re: [Zope] calling a product with xmlrpc

[J Cameron Cooper]

Reinoud van Leeuwen wrote:

On Tue, Apr 11, 2006 at 01:43:22PM -0500, Floyd May wrote:


Paul Winkler wrote:


On Tue, Apr 11, 2006 at 05:54:35PM +0200, Reinoud van Leeuwen wrote:


[...]
This however generates a NotFound Exception :-(


I'm not sure why you get NotFound, but one thing I spotted is that
anything you want to publish in zope 2 must have a docstring.



I've ran into situations where lack-of-docstring results in a NotFound. 
  Not saying that this is the sole culprit of the trouble, but it's 
certainly worth knowing.



Thanks! that did it!

Is this a bug or a feature? I would expect something else in the errorlog 
(or a warning in the eventlog)


It's fundamental Zope security. Old as the hills.

I'm sure it's in the Zope book.

--jcc
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Re: [Zope] calling a product with xmlrpc

[Paul Winkler]

On Tue, Apr 11, 2006 at 04:55:18PM -0500, J Cameron Cooper wrote:
 I'm sure it's in the Zope book.

Doubt it, as the Zope book doesn't cover filesystem Product development.

But it is in the ZDG :)
http://www.zope.org/Documentation/Books/ZDG/current/ObjectPublishing.stx

I do think it's odd he got NotFound, I haven't seen that.
Maybe I'm just so used to running in debug mode that I've fixed
all these before they ever got to a production server ;-)

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[Zope] Re: Forum product

[Maik Ihde]

Hi

Updating to Zope 2.8.6 and using PloneBoard with 2.1.2, as Jens mentioned is a
solution which is quite easy to do. Another Option might be the new zForum
Release, wich can be integratet in Plone now. But it ist more complex and you
will need an additional SQL Database (MySQL/PostGres).

Kind Regards
Maik

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[Zope] Re: New Product called Zoep

[Alexander Limi]

On Tue, 07 Feb 2006 09:08:24 -0800, Jonathan Cyr  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:



Hello,

Is there any concern about naming confusion with the new VOIP browser  
extension called Zoep (from Slashdot this morning).


Mozilla Firebird became FireFox, due to naming confusion.   Should these  
folks continue with such a similar name?  Is anyone concerned?


Absolutely a legitimate problem, I think - in addition to the fact that  
the Zope trademark isn't owned by the Zope Foundation. (Look out for the  
new J2EE Zope technology once the value of the Zope brand exceeds the  
assets of Zope Corp).


As an aside, this posting in the comments on Slashdot was hilarious:


Announcing: Ploen

Ploen is an out-of-the-box ready VoIP system that is built on the powerful  
and free Zoep client-side VoIP engine. It requires minimal effort to set  
up, is deeply flexible, and provides you with a system for managing VoIP  
that is ideal for project groups, communities and intranets.


And it goes 0 - 60 mph in 5 seconds, as you can see from the Ploen site.

http://www.ploen.org



Certainly made my day :D

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[Zope] Re: New Product called Zoep

[Alexander Limi]

On Tue, 07 Feb 2006 09:55:02 -0800, Dennis Allison  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:



I think there is potential for confusion.  Both Zope Corp and
teh Zope Foundation should send cease and desist letters.


Zope Foundation does not have anything to do with the trademark,  
unfortunately. That is Zope Corporation's property, and part of their  
equities, according to them.


A summary of the situation:

http://www.zopezen.org/Members/limi/zc-communitychat

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[Zope] Re: New Product called Zoep

[Dennis Allison]

It is a legitimate concern for everyone in the Zope community regardless 
of what entity owns and controls the trademark.  

On Tue, 7 Feb 2006, Alexander Limi wrote:

 
 
 On Tue, 07 Feb 2006 09:55:02 -0800, Dennis Allison  
 allison-IUYf/[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
  I think there is potential for confusion.  Both Zope Corp and
  teh Zope Foundation should send cease and desist letters.
 
 Zope Foundation does not have anything to do with the trademark,  
 unfortunately. That is Zope Corporation's property, and part of their  
 equities, according to them.
 
 A summary of the situation:
 
 http://www.zopezen.org/Members/limi/zc-communitychat
 
 

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[Zope] Zope 2.9 and product installation

[Dennis Allison]

IssueTracker 0.6.13
Zope 2.9.0
64-bit linux

2006-01-20T09:22:49 WARNING Init Class 
Products.IssueTrackerProduct.IssueTracker.IssueTracker has a security 
declaration for nonexistent method 'index_html'
--
2006-01-20T09:22:49 WARNING Init Class 
Products.IssueTrackerProduct.IssueTracker.IssueTracker has a security 
declaration for nonexistent method 'Statistics'
--
2006-01-20T09:22:49 WARNING Init Class 
Products.IssueTrackerProduct.IssueTracker.IssueTracker has a security 
declaration for nonexistent method 'ListIssues'
--
2006-01-20T09:22:49 WARNING Init Class 
Products.IssueTrackerProduct.IssueTracker.IssueTracker has a security 
declaration for nonexistent method 'ShowIssue'
--
2006-01-20T09:22:49 WARNING Init Class 
Products.IssueTrackerProduct.IssueTracker.IssueTracker has a security 
declaration for nonexistent method 'ListIssues.csv'
--
2006-01-20T09:22:49 WARNING Init Class 
Products.IssueTrackerProduct.IssueTracker.IssueTracker has a security 
declaration for nonexistent method 'CompleteList'
--
2006-01-20T09:22:49 WARNING Init Class 
Products.IssueTrackerProduct.IssueTracker.IssueTracker has a security 
declaration for nonexistent method 'export.csv'
--
2006-01-20T09:22:49 WARNING Init Class 
Products.IssueTrackerProduct.IssueTracker.IssueTracker has a security 
declaration for nonexistent method 'manage_ManagementForm'
--
2006-01-20T09:22:49 WARNING Init Class 
Products.IssueTrackerProduct.IssueTracker.IssueTracker has a security 
declaration for nonexistent method 'manage_ManagementUpgrade'
--
2006-01-20T09:22:49 WARNING Init Class 
Products.IssueTrackerProduct.IssueTracker.IssueTracker has a security 
declaration for nonexistent method 'manage_ManagementUsers'
--
2006-01-20T09:22:49 WARNING Init Class 
Products.IssueTrackerProduct.IssueTracker.IssueTracker has a security 
declaration for nonexistent method 'manage_PropertiesStatusScores'
--
2006-01-20T09:22:49 WARNING Init Class 
Products.IssueTrackerProduct.IssueTracker.IssueTracker has a security 
declaration for nonexistent method 'manage_editIssueTrackerPropertiesForm'
--
2006-01-20T09:22:49 WARNING Init Class 
Products.IssueTrackerProduct.IssueTracker.IssueTracker has a security 
declaration for nonexistent method 'manage_ManagementNotifyables'
--
2006-01-20T09:22:49 WARNING Init Class 
Products.IssueTrackerProduct.IssueTracker.IssueTracker has a security 
declaration for nonexistent method 'manage_configureMenuForm'
--
2006-01-20T09:22:49 WARNING Init Class 
Products.IssueTrackerProduct.IssueTracker.IssueTracker has a security 
declaration for nonexistent method 'manage_POP3ManagementForm'
--
2006-01-20T09:22:49 WARNING Init Class 
Products.IssueTrackerProduct.IssueTracker.IssueTracker has a security 
declaration for nonexistent method 'ShowIssue'

Other products generate similar warnings.

Is this a problem with Zope 2.9 or an incompatibility introduced as 
Zope 2.X migrates towards Zope 3.X?   What should be done to resolve this 
class of problems.

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Re: [Zope] Zope 2.9 and product installation

[Paul Winkler]

On Fri, Jan 20, 2006 at 10:23:30AM -0800, Dennis Allison wrote:
 IssueTracker 0.6.13
 Zope 2.9.0
 64-bit linux
 
 2006-01-20T09:22:49 WARNING Init Class 
 Products.IssueTrackerProduct.IssueTracker.IssueTracker has a security 
 declaration for nonexistent method 'index_html'

(snip)

These are warnings intended to help developers fix a common
mistake: misspelling a security declaration.

They are harmless to you, the user.

It looks like IssueTracker programatically modifies
the IssueTracker class on startup to populate it with some
templates, by calling a function addTemplates2Class();
and index_html et al. get added to it at that time.

That's a little unusual, and I'm not sure what motivated it,
but certainly there could be good reasons...

Unfortunately, the security declarations have already been
evaluated by then, hence the warnings.

Presumably the IssueTracker team will test it under 2.9 at
some point and figure out how to avoid the warnings.

-- 

Paul Winkler
http://www.slinkp.com
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[Zope-dev] Re: Product installation (implicit vs. explicit)

[Rocky Burt]

Chris McDonough wrote:
 The question is this: do you think there should be an explicit 
 install step for egg packages/Products or do you think it should be 
 possible to just put eggs on your PYTHONPATH (and perhaps adjust a 
 config file with requirements)?

To be honest, the explicit'ness of an external egg install process irks
me but I cannot really give a reason why (perhaps its just because I'm
used to having Zope2 products just work).

Also, with having to install eggs, how would this work with eggs that
are actually directories (that are formed like egg zip files) and
dealing with eggs from a development standpoint.  Does this mean they
would get copied some place?  Or just that something would be registered
into the zodb registering those eggs, etc...

- Rocky


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Re: [Zope-dev] Re: Product installation (implicit vs. explicit)

[Chris McDonough]

On Dec 22, 2005, at 10:17 AM, Rocky Burt wrote:


Chris McDonough wrote:

The question is this: do you think there should be an explicit
install step for egg packages/Products or do you think it should be
possible to just put eggs on your PYTHONPATH (and perhaps adjust a
config file with requirements)?


To be honest, the explicit'ness of an external egg install process  
irks

me but I cannot really give a reason why (perhaps its just because I'm
used to having Zope2 products just work).


What do Java people expect from jar files (I ask as a Java dope)?  Do  
they have a more limited scope (no dependencies, for example?)


Also, with having to install eggs, how would this work with eggs  
that

are actually directories (that are formed like egg zip files) and
dealing with eggs from a development standpoint.  Does this mean they
would get copied some place?  Or just that something would be  
registered

into the zodb registering those eggs, etc...


I doubt anything would go into the ZODB; other than that I'm not  
sure.  Whatever got created would almost certainly be based on  
Phillip's easy_install program which is documented at http:// 
peak.telecommunity.com/DevCenter/EasyInstall .


- C


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Re: [Zope-dev] Re: Product installation (implicit vs. explicit)

[Andreas Jung]

--On 22. Dezember 2005 10:46:42 -0500 Chris McDonough [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:


What do Java people expect from jar files (I ask as a Java dope)?  Do
they have a more limited scope (no dependencies, for example?)


Jar files have no dependencies.

-aj


pgpKlIVHcdQM0.pgp
Description: PGP signature
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Re: [Zope-dev] Re: Product installation (implicit vs. explicit)

[Fred Drake]

On 12/22/05, Andreas Jung [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Jar files have no dependencies.

Well, I know you know what you mean here, but I'll elaborate since the
kids haven't started fighting yet this morning.  :-)

Jar files don't have dependency metadata.  They're pretty much
equivalent to zipped Python libraries.  Python Eggs take the next step
by adding the dependency information and other interesting bits in the
support infrastructure.  I'm sure there's a Java equivalent (or
several), but I've not heard of it.


  -Fred

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[Zope-dev] Re: Product installation (implicit vs. explicit)

[Rocky Burt]

Chris McDonough wrote:
 What do Java people expect from jar files (I ask as a Java dope)?  Do 
 they have a more limited scope (no dependencies, for example?)

Coming from a heavy java/j2ee background I can say that people in
java-land expect to place jar's on the java classpath (equivalent of
pythonpath) and they just work with regard to showing up on the classpath.

Taking this one step further, a Zope2 product egg would be closer to a
J2EE ear (Enterprise ARchive) file rather than a Java jar file.  An ear
file is basically a jar file with extra metadata stating that it follows
the appropriate conventions for j2ee deployment (basically instructions
on which parts of the ear file are for ejb management, more for web file
management, etc).

Now the best question is, do ear files get automatically configured and
installed by a j2ee server?  Answer: It depends.

This is comppletely up to the j2ee server implementation.  Orion and
JBoss for example (full j2ee implementations) have a special directory
where you can simply drop ear files and they get automatically get
picked up by the server and deployed as applications/components.

But, having said that, I know for a fact that the preferred manner to
configure an ear file with Orion is to do it explicitly in Orion's xml
configuration files.

Hopefully that sheds some light.

Regarding dependencies, no, jar/war/ear files (java's zip file types) do
not have dependency configuration although they do have the ability to
use something else if it exists (you can specify a Class-Path argument
in the manifest file).

- Rocky


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Re: [Zope-dev] Re: Product installation (implicit vs. explicit)

[Stefane Fermigier]

Fred Drake wrote:
 On 12/22/05, Andreas Jung [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
Jar files have no dependencies.
 
 
 Well, I know you know what you mean here, but I'll elaborate since the
 kids haven't started fighting yet this morning.  :-)
 
 Jar files don't have dependency metadata.  They're pretty much
 equivalent to zipped Python libraries.  Python Eggs take the next step
 by adding the dependency information and other interesting bits in the
 support infrastructure.  I'm sure there's a Java equivalent (or
 several), but I've not heard of it.

There is one, and it is a very powerful and mature.

Or so I have been told by my good friend and coworker Eric Barroca.

It's called OSGi (http://www.osgi.org/)

It is used for set top boxes applications provisionning, as well as for
assembling components in the Eclipse platform (including Eclipse RCP)
which, according to another good friend and coworker (Julien Anguenot)
shares some similarities with the Zope 3 component architecture.

http://www.research.ibm.com/journal/sj/442/gruber.pdf
http://www.eclipse.org/org/press-release/20051011osgi.htm

  S.

-- 
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Gestion de contenu web / portail collaboratif / groupware / open source!
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[Zope] Basket 0.1 (New Zope Packaging Regime Product) Released

[Chris McDonough]

Basket is a Zope 2 product which allows you to employ the Python Egg
format to deploy other Zope 2 products.  The Python Egg packaging  
format is described at http://peak.telecommunity.com/DevCenter/ 
setuptools .  The development of Basket was funded by the Goldegg  
initiative  described at http://www.goldeggstack.org .


Basket forms the basis for a suggestion of how Zope 2 Products should  
be packaged by default starting in Zope 2.10, so it's likely  
interesting for existing Product developers.


You can read about it and get it from:

http://www.plope.com/software/Basket/Basket

Have fun!

- C

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Re: [Zope-dev] RFC: product initialization cleanup and improvements

[Dieter Maurer]

yuppie wrote at 2005-10-27 14:45 +0200:
 ...
1.) 'action' key:
-

I'd like to give empty 'action' values a special meaning: The meta_type 
is not visible in the add drop down in the ZMI.

The five:registerClass directive allows to set empty 'action' values.

This would resolve http://www.zope.org/Collectors/Zope/1885 .

Filtering out meta_types with empty 'action' values is a two line change 
in main.dtml. I'd like to make that change also on the 2.8 branch to 
enable that feature for 2.8.5 with Five 1.2.

We already have the visibility key. Why do we need
another (much obscurer) way to achieve the same thing?

 ...
4.) related cleanup:


Application.install_product has some backwards compatibility code for 
products that have initialization code outside the 'initialize' method 
of their __init__.py. This is deprecated at least for 5 years. I'd like 
to add explicit deprecation warnings on the 2.8 branch and to remove 
that code for Zope 2.9.

I hate that:

  While you might have the feeling that it were deprecated,
  'ZSQLMethods' still use part of the old style initialization
  (they have an initialize but still use methods, __ac_permissions__
  and __module_aliases__).

  And I occationally recommend these old style facilities.

  Having a warning period of 5 days (post on Oct 27; code freeze Nov 1)
  seems very short.

What about removing the code for Zope 2.10?


-- 
Dieter
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Re: [Zope-dev] RFC: product initialization cleanup and improvements

[yuppie]

Hi Dieter!


Dieter Maurer wrote:

yuppie wrote at 2005-10-27 14:45 +0200:

...
1.) 'action' key:
-

I'd like to give empty 'action' values a special meaning: The meta_type 
is not visible in the add drop down in the ZMI.


The five:registerClass directive allows to set empty 'action' values.

This would resolve http://www.zope.org/Collectors/Zope/1885 .

Filtering out meta_types with empty 'action' values is a two line change 
in main.dtml. I'd like to make that change also on the 2.8 branch to 
enable that feature for 2.8.5 with Five 1.2.


We already have the visibility key. Why do we need
another (much obscurer) way to achieve the same thing?


Because it doesn't do the same thing. 'visibility' doesn't primarily 
change the visibility. It controls if the meta_type is globally 
available (visibility='Global') or only in containers that specify one 
of its interfaces (visibility=None).



...
4.) related cleanup:


Application.install_product has some backwards compatibility code for 
products that have initialization code outside the 'initialize' method 
of their __init__.py. This is deprecated at least for 5 years. I'd like 
to add explicit deprecation warnings on the 2.8 branch and to remove 
that code for Zope 2.9.


I hate that:

  While you might have the feeling that it were deprecated,
  'ZSQLMethods' still use part of the old style initialization
  (they have an initialize but still use methods, __ac_permissions__
  and __module_aliases__).


Well. I think the comments in Application.install_product are very 
clear. 'initialize' was meant to replace the old way, not to provide a 
second way.


I fixed ZGadflyDA and ZSQLMethods.


  And I occationally recommend these old style facilities.

  Having a warning period of 5 days (post on Oct 27; code freeze Nov 1)
  seems very short.

What about removing the code for Zope 2.10?


If the change breaks too many existing products I'm fine with leaving 
the code including deprecation warnings in Zope 2.9.



Cheers,

Yuppie


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Re: [Zope-dev] RFC: product initialization cleanup and improvements

[yuppie]

Dieter Maurer wrote:

yuppie wrote at 2005-10-27 14:45 +0200:

4.) related cleanup:


Application.install_product has some backwards compatibility code for 
products that have initialization code outside the 'initialize' method 
of their __init__.py. This is deprecated at least for 5 years. I'd like 
to add explicit deprecation warnings on the 2.8 branch and to remove 
that code for Zope 2.9.


I hate that:

  While you might have the feeling that it were deprecated,
  'ZSQLMethods' still use part of the old style initialization
  (they have an initialize but still use methods, __ac_permissions__
  and __module_aliases__).


__module_aliases__ are not affected by that change. They are not 
initialized by Application.install_product.


Cheers, Yuppie

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[Zope-dev] RFC: product initialization cleanup and improvements

[yuppie]

Hi!


Working on the five:registerClass directive for Five 1.2 and Zope 2.9 I 
had a closer look at the product initialization code.


I propose the following modifications for the dicts in 
Products.meta_types (set by registerClass):



1.) 'action' key:
-

I'd like to give empty 'action' values a special meaning: The meta_type 
is not visible in the add drop down in the ZMI.


The five:registerClass directive allows to set empty 'action' values.

This would resolve http://www.zope.org/Collectors/Zope/1885 .

Filtering out meta_types with empty 'action' values is a two line change 
in main.dtml. I'd like to make that change also on the 2.8 branch to 
enable that feature for 2.8.5 with Five 1.2.



2.) 'interfaces' key:
-

Does currently only contain oldstyle interfaces. The code in 
OFS.ObjectManager that uses that key works also with z3 interfaces. I'd 
like to add z3 interfaces to the value of that key. That would e.g. 
allow to set only new style interfaces on catalog index classes.



3.) 'product' key:
--

AFAICS it isn't used in Zope itself. I'd like to add a note that it 
might be removed in a future version.



4.) related cleanup:


Application.install_product has some backwards compatibility code for 
products that have initialization code outside the 'initialize' method 
of their __init__.py. This is deprecated at least for 5 years. I'd like 
to add explicit deprecation warnings on the 2.8 branch and to remove 
that code for Zope 2.9.



This isn't much work, it can all be done in time for the Zope 2.9 beta.

Any feedback is welcome. If there are no objections, I'll make the 
changes as proposed.



Cheers,

Yuppie

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[Zope] phpBB conversion to Zope/Plone discussion product?

[Reinoud van Leeuwen]

Hi,

In the process of converting old systems to our new Plone intranet, I have 
come across an old phpBB forum.

Has anyone converted a board like this to Ploneboard or another Zope or 
Plone based discussion system?
Of course there will be some differences in possibilities, but converting 
the content would be a nice step.

-- 
__
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[Zope] Uninstalling a product in a ZopeTestCase

[Marco Bizzarri]

Hi all.

I'm trying to write a ZopeTestCase where I can check if the import of a 
missing module is catch or no. I would therefore test something like this:


def testImportIsCaught(self):
import sys
oo_path = filter(lambda x: 'program' in x, sys.path)
sys.path.remove(oo_path[0])
ZopeTestCase.installProduct('PAFlow')


What I'm doing here is to remove the path where the openoffice support 
is in the system, and then I try to install the product. If the 
exception import is caught, this should not raise an exception.


The problem is that if I run all the tests, I will end with my product 
already installed, and, therefore, the test won't be run correctly.


Do anyone has any suggestion?

Regards
Marco
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Re: [Zope] Uninstalling a product in a ZopeTestCase

[Dieter Maurer]

Marco Bizzarri wrote at 2005-8-19 10:49 +0200:

You may look how the refresh Product function uninstalls
a product.

You find the code in App.RefreshFuncs.performRefresh.


-- 
Dieter
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Re: [Zope] FS based product and image replacement

[Nicholas Wieland]

 - Dieter Maurer :
 Nicholas Wieland wrote at 2005-8-12 11:45 +0200:
 The image is inside 'myproduct/images', what I've tried is to create 
 an ImageFile and use it inside the background-image directive inside
 the stylesheet, but also url(images/foo.gif) with and without the 
 absolute url.
 
 ImageFile works. You must do something wrong.
 What happens precisely?
 Exception+Traceback
 -- broken image (then access it and report exception+traceback).

Nothing, the image isn't displayed at all, so I argue that Zope doesn't
find it.

 Sometimes, images are put into the misc_ section of a product.
 You can see an example use in Products/ZGadflyDA/__init__.py.
 
Thank you.
 
  ngw
-- 
checking for life_signs in -lKenny... no
Oh my god, make (1) killed Kenny ! You, bastards !

nicholas_wieland-at-yahoo-dot-it





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[Zope] FS based product and image replacement

[Nicholas Wieland]

Hi *,
I'm trying to use image replacement in a FS product, but unfortunately I'm not able to catch the image on the FS (a simple gif).

The image is inside 'myproduct/images', what I've tried is to create an ImageFile and use it inside the background-image directive inside the stylesheet, but also url("images/foo.gif") with and without the absolute url.

How do people use image replacement in FS based products ?

TIA,
 ngw

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Re: [Zope] FS based product and image replacement

[David Pratt]

Hi Nicholas. You want to put your images, templates, script pythons etc that you want to be available in a skin folder for your product. Then you make skin folder a DirectoryView as part of your product development and install so that the DirectoryView is installed with portal skins.  Once you have a successful install, you can verify that your skin folder in the appropriate skin paths you want by using the Properties tab in portal skins tool. Your images, templates and scripts - whatever you have included in the skin are now available globally to your application. All you have to do is reference the image or object by its id to get a handle on it. As far as images, when you use an image in a zpt, you can look at the source and the full url is made.

Here is a link to a product that illustrates how to do this for ExampleFileSystemSkin product :
http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles.php?group_id=55262package_id=99640

With stylesheets, this is dtml. You can look at the zpt stylesheets in CMF in its skin folder to get the idea of how to use the portal_url or properties from a properties sheet to create your css. Generally, you would use portal_url in conjunction with the image to give you the full image path the css that is rendered.

Hope this helps.

Regards,
David


On Friday, August 12, 2005, at 06:45 AM, Nicholas Wieland wrote:

Hi *,
I'm trying to use image replacement in a FS product, but unfortunately I'm not able to catch the image on the FS (a simple gif).
 
The image is inside 'myproduct/images', what I've tried is to create an ImageFile and use it inside the background-image directive inside the stylesheet, but also url(images/foo.gif) with and without the absolute url.
 
How do people use image replacement in FS based products ?
 
TIA,
  ngw
 



image.tiff>
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On Friday, August 12, 2005, at 06:45 AM, Nicholas Wieland wrote:

Hi *,
I'm trying to use image replacement in a FS product, but unfortunately I'm not able to catch the image on the FS (a simple gif).
 
The image is inside 'myproduct/images', what I've tried is to create an ImageFile and use it inside the background-image directive inside the stylesheet, but also url(images/foo.gif) with and without the absolute url.
 
How do people use image replacement in FS based products ?
 
TIA,
  ngw
 



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Re: [Zope] FS based product and image replacement

[David Pratt]

Well I think for plain zope there is a skinned folder (or similar named) implementation to apply the same approach except no CMF overhead.  I think you could find it on zope.org or google around for it. 

Regards,
David


On Friday, August 12, 2005, at 10:13 AM, Nicholas Wieland wrote:

Sorry, but I don't and can't use CMF :)
It's plain Zope.
 
I'm not interested in skins, this is an internal app, so I just have to provide a usable UI.
Thanks for trying.
 
  ngw 

David Pratt [EMAIL PROTECTED]> ha scritto:

Hi Nicholas. You want to put your images, templates, script pythons etc
that you want to be available in a skin folder for your product. Then
you make skin folder a DirectoryView as part of your product
development and install so that the DirectoryView is installed with
portal skins. Once you have a successful install, you can verify that
your skin folder in the appropriate skin paths you want by using the
Properties tab in portal skins tool. Your images, templates and scripts
- whatever you have included in the skin are now available globally to
your application. All you have to do is reference the image or object
by its id to get a handle on it. As far as images, when you use an
image in a zpt, you can look at the source and the full url is made.

Here is a link to a product that illustrates how to do this for
ExampleFileSystemSkin product :
http://sourceforge.net/project/
showfiles.php?group_id=55262package_id=99640

With stylesheets, this is dtml. You can look at the zpt stylesheets in
CMF in its skin folder to get the idea of how to use the portal_url or
properties from a properties sheet to create your css. Generally, you
would use portal_url in conjunction with the image to give you the full
image path the css that is rendered.

Hope this helps.

Regards,
David



image.tiff>
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Re: [Zope] FS based product and image replacement

[Dieter Maurer]

Nicholas Wieland wrote at 2005-8-12 11:45 +0200:
The image is inside 'myproduct/images', what I've tried is to create an 
ImageFile and use it inside the background-image directive inside the 
stylesheet, but also url(images/foo.gif) with and without the absolute url.

ImageFile works. You must do something wrong.
What happens precisely?
Exception+Traceback
-- broken image (then access it and report exception+traceback).

Sometimes, images are put into the misc_ section of a product.
You can see an example use in Products/ZGadflyDA/__init__.py.


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DIVI'm trying to use image replacement in a FS product, but unfortunately 
I'm not able to catch the image on the FS (a simple gif)./DIV

Please post text/plain only messages -- if possible...

-- 
Dieter
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[Zope] Re: DiskBased Product question

[Haim Ashkenazi]

thanx for the replies. I'll look into these options today.

Bye

On Tue, 07 Jun 2005 19:35:23 +0300, Haim Ashkenazi wrote:

 Hi
 
 I'm looking for documentation or simple examples on how to create a disk
 based product that when I install it, it also adds some third party
 products.
 
 for example, If I select my product from the Add list, it'll create a
 folder, insert my code into it, but also insert mailhost, database
 connector, exuserfolder etc...
 
 is it even possible?
 
 one if the reasons I want to create it this way, and not just instruct the
 user to add these products and only then add mine, is because I want to
 have a few levels of folders with acl_users inside them instead of
 defining all the users in one folder and start playing with roles and
 permissions...
 
 thanx

-- 
Haim


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[Zope] Creating a Product

[Varun Parange]

hi,

i have add a new directory in my "Products" directory..

however, when i try to add the __init__.py file , it giver me an error..


Error Type: BadRequestError Value: The id "__init__" is invalid because it begins with an underscore.
how do i add this file?
regards,
varun
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Re: [Zope] Creating a Product

[Lennart Regebro]

On 6/2/05, Varun Parange [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 i have add a new directory in my Products directory.. 
   
 however, when i try to add the __init__.py file , it giver me an error.. 
   
  
 
 Error Type: BadRequest
 Error Value: The id __init__ is invalid because it begins with an
 underscore.
  
 
 how do i add this file?

The Products folder in  the control panel is not a file system
directory. The Products directory refers to the directory Products
that is created on the file system, where you created your Zope
instance when you installed Zope.

-- 
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CPS Content Management http://www.cps-project.org/
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[Zope] Re: Debugging product init with zopectl?

[Tres Seaver]

-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-
Hash: SHA1

Konrad Rokicki wrote:
 Hi all,
 I'm new to Zope, getting started with the minimal project
 (http://www.zope.org/Members/maxm/HowTo/minimal_01). For whatever
 reason, minimal doesn't work out of the box. That would be fine except
 that when I start Zope with zopectl it reports status as fine and the
 process runs, but I don't get any logs generated and I can't connect
 to the server.
 
 But, if I use runzope I can see what's wrong and the server dies immediately:
 File /var/lib/zope/zope-test/Products/minimal/__init__.py, line 8,
 in initialize
 constructors = (
 AttributeError: manage_addMinimalForm
 
 My concern isn't this error, which I fixed by importing the function
 explicitly. But why did I have to use runzope to see this? Shouldn't
 zopectl inform me that the server is completely broken?
 
 By the way, I'm using a standard Gentoo installation of Zope, and I
 haven't changed any options from defaults.
 
 Could someone please tell me if this is expected behavior? Should I be
 using runzope in a screen or something?

In production mode, Zope will start even if a product fails to import;
 you should see it complain in the logs in this case.  In debug mode, it
stops and complains.  I usually run 'bin/zopectl fg' to do the testing,
which forces debug mode on (at least in recent 2.7.x).

Tres Seaver.
-BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-
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Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org

iD8DBQFCe58G+gerLs4ltQ4RAjn1AJ9p8zcaWLN59hJRtSdAUYdw70IuGgCfdbPG
0z07UAIZAmQ7fvizSnl4pco=
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[Zope-dev] Re: Product Testing

[sureshvv]

Go to the Control Panel and click on your broken Product. You will see a
traceback.


Marshall Powers [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 I'm somewhat new to zope in general, and I've been having some trouble
 developing products. Im running 2.7 on WinXP as a windows service. My
 biggest problem is with debugging my products. Right now, the only
 feedback I get is whether or not the zope service starts successfully.
 It would really help if I could get some error message as to what part
 of my product zope choked on. Any Ideas?


 Thank You,
 Marshall

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Re: [Zope-dev] PythonLibraries Product

[seb bacon]

Tres Seaver wrote:
Evan Simpson wrote:
Seb Bacon wrote:
Could you provide a brief summary of why this is better than a
folder of python scripts?  Perhaps a use case which illustrates the
problems of the current way of doing things?

It isn't *better* than a Folder of Scripts, it's *different* :-) I
have two weak use-cases, a longstanding I'm going to write that some
day itch, and some aesthetic arguments.

Actually, the restricted case is the one which has the real win;  the
free-floating library is pretty, but not semanticaally needed.  An
added argument:  a ZPT with its own private library becomes, in effect,
a Zope3 view component;  adopting such beasts will ease migration to
Zope3.
Well, I'm completely convinced :-)  I'm not quite sure about the 
metaphor for binding a library to a template yet, though.

Could libraries be added to folders as first-class objects (you want to 
be able to share them between templates easily, no?) and bound to the 
templates using a tab on either them or the templates?  Their icons 
would be overlaid with a visual indication of if they are bound or not.

Or, could you bind them at run-time using a new tal directive?  (not 
likely to be a popular suggestion, I know)

seb

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Re: [Zope-dev] PythonLibraries Product

[Paul Winkler]

On Wed, Sep 10, 2003 at 09:50:51PM -0400, Tres Seaver wrote:
 For the filesystem representation:  what if we just have two files for
 templates with libraries:  'foo.html' and 'foo.html.py'?  Tools will
 like that better than either of the approaches which try to preserve the
 twins as a single file:

sounds fine.

 I would vote for having the bound library's names inserted into the
 'template' TALES namespace, BTW.

+1

-- 

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http://www.slinkp.com
Look! Up in the sky! It's ALPHABET METROID WINO!
(random hero from isometric.spaceninja.com)

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Re: [Zope-dev] PythonLibraries Product

[Fred L. Drake, Jr.]

Tres Seaver writes:
  Actually, the restricted case is the one which has the real win;  the
  free-floating library is pretty, but not semanticaally needed.  An
  added argument:  a ZPT with its own private library becomes, in effect,
  a Zope3 view component;  adopting such beasts will ease migration to
  Zope3.

And it keeps all the pieces easy to locate!  +1

  For the filesystem representation:  what if we just have two files for
  templates with libraries:  'foo.html' and 'foo.html.py'?  Tools will
  like that better than either of the approaches which try to preserve the
  twins as a single file:

The current Zope 3 filesystem synchronization doesn't currently
support writing multiple files for a single object; every object is
expected to be either file-like or directory-like.

There are a few ways to approach serialization of a view that contains
both a template and Python code:

- Serialize it as a directory containing two files.

- Serialize it as a file containing the template, and make the Python
  code live as an extra, which would be written to a file in the
  metadata storage area (tedious to work with, but could be an
  otherwise normal .py file).

- Change the filesystem serialization so that multiple files can be
  generated to represent a single object.  I think this would require
  a substantial amount of work.


  -Fred

-- 
Fred L. Drake, Jr.  fred at zope.com
PythonLabs at Zope Corporation

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Re: [Zope-dev] PythonLibraries Product

[Dan L. Pierson]

--On Thursday, September 11, 2003 10:08:23 -0400 Fred L. Drake, Jr. 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Tres Seaver writes:
  Actually, the restricted case is the one which has the real win;  the
  free-floating library is pretty, but not semanticaally needed.  An
  added argument:  a ZPT with its own private library becomes, in effect,
  a Zope3 view component;  adopting such beasts will ease migration to
  Zope3.
And it keeps all the pieces easy to locate!  +1
+1

There are a few ways to approach serialization of a view that contains
both a template and Python code:
- Serialize it as a directory containing two files.
IMHO, this is the obvious and probably best choice.  It's well in line with 
a sentiment
in the the Linux file system world that the way to handle multi-piece files 
is to treat them
as directories rather than introduce another layer of special mechanisms. 
The file sytem
itself can them optimize their storage as part of a general small file 
optimization strategy.
I don't think the objection to having to pack a ZPT and it's script(s) in a 
separate ZODB
folder applies anywhere near as well to file system storage.

Dan Pierson

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Re: [Zope-dev] PythonLibraries Product

[Tres Seaver]

On Wed, 2003-09-10 at 23:46, Evan Simpson wrote:
 Tres Seaver wrote:
  Actually, the restricted case is the one which has the real win;  the
  free-floating library is pretty, but not semanticaally needed.  An
  added argument:  a ZPT with its own private library becomes, in effect,
  a Zope3 view component;  adopting such beasts will ease migration to
  Zope3.
 
 Agreed.
 
  For the filesystem representation:  what if we just have two files for
  templates with libraries:  'foo.html' and 'foo.html.py'?
 
 Eh.  I think filesytem representations should handle this sort of thing 
 much more generally.  Assuming that the Zope object's ID is 'foo.html', 
 there should be a text file of that name (encoded with quote_plus, which 
 makes no difference in this case), and a directory named 'foo.html,'. 
 Inside of this directory, there would be a 'library.py' (in this 
 particular case), along with files such as 'properties' and 'proxies'.


Hmm, I'm thinking about this for the CMF.  In CMF 1.3.x, a template
which has a cache manager, or a title, puts those values in a simple
'name=value'-formatted file, with extension '.properties'.  Permission
mappings go in a separate file, with extension '.security'.  So, the
filesystem-based template 'foo_view' might have as many as three files
associated with it:

  - 'foo_view.pt'

  - 'foo_view.pt.properties'

  - 'foo_view.pt.security'

CMF 1.4 unified the two files into a single, '.ini'-formatted one:

  - 'foo_view.pt'

  - 'foo_view.pt.metadata'

It feels more natural to me just to add another file:

  - 'foo_view.pt.py'

This is especially nice for many CMF skin templates (those which contain
forms), because I can probably *remove* the separate template which
serves as the POST-target for the form!  Instead, such templates will
post *to themselves*, and use the bound library to do the validation /
updates.  In this case, we go from:

  - 'foo_edit_form.pt'

  - 'foo_edit.py'

to:

  - 'foo_edit_form.pt'

  - 'foo_edit_form.pt.py'

 
  And there is yet another argument for the bound library:  it shows how
  unnecessary, as well has how evil, that script tag hack is.
 
 Yep :-)
 
 
  Refactoring a one-off template-cum-library will be simple, too:
 
 Cool!
 
  I would vote for having the bound library's names inserted into the
  'template' TALES namespace, BTW.
 
 Tricky -- right now, that's just the template object itself.  I'd just 
 introduce a builtin 'library' variable, and probably dump the function 
 names into the global namespace as well.

+1, then.

Tres.
-- 
===
Tres Seaver[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Zope Corporation  Zope Dealers   http://www.zope.com



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Re: [Zope-dev] PythonLibraries Product

[Evan Simpson]

Tres Seaver wrote:
Hmm, I'm thinking about this for the CMF.  In CMF 1.3.x, a template
which has a cache manager, or a title, puts those values in a simple
'name=value'-formatted file, with extension '.properties'.  Permission
mappings go in a separate file, with extension '.security'.
I wish I had been more involved when these decisions were being made -- 
I dislike this scheme, because it is irregular and requires you to know 
what sort of object you're dealing with just to be able to tell which 
files go together.  If it's always file + ','-dir, external tools can 
move, rename, delete, etc safely.

Then there's the potential for name clashes.  It's unlikely, but not 
*terribly* so, that a user would create a second object named 
'foo_edit_form.pt.py'.  Using quote_plus avoids filesystem character set 
 issues, and makes the simple ',' postfix clash-proof.

Oh, well.

Cheers,

Evan

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Re: [Zope-dev] PythonLibraries Product

[Tres Seaver]

Evan Simpson wrote:

 Seb Bacon wrote:
  Could you provide a brief summary of why this is better than a
  folder of python scripts?  Perhaps a use case which illustrates the
  problems of the current way of doing things?

 It isn't *better* than a Folder of Scripts, it's *different* :-) I
 have two weak use-cases, a longstanding I'm going to write that some
 day itch, and some aesthetic arguments.

 One of the more frequently stated complaints about ZPTs is that to
 properly remove non-presentation logic and ugly little Python
 expressions from a template, you either need a pile of little Scripts,
 or a single controller Script that precalculates everything and
 passes it to the template.  I've settled, fairly happily, on the
 second solution.

 Both of these solutions suffer from the two or more objects to
 accomplish one task management problem.  I usually combine the
 objects in a dedicated Folder, which is still a bit awkward, and
 doesn't solve everything.  One drawback is that the individual
 components are all published, despite the fact that I only intend
 one of them to be web-addressable.  It would be very handy to attach
 the Scripts directly to the template, but the straightforward way of
 doing that means making the template a container, and opens a whole
 can of worms.  Instead, what if templates had a Library tab, and it
 worked with External Editor?  It would actually be easier to *just*
 write this, and not have independent Library objects, but generalizing
 this capability feels right to me

Actually, the restricted case is the one which has the real win;  the
free-floating library is pretty, but not semanticaally needed.  An
added argument:  a ZPT with its own private library becomes, in effect,
a Zope3 view component;  adopting such beasts will ease migration to
Zope3.

For the filesystem representation:  what if we just have two files for
templates with libraries:  'foo.html' and 'foo.html.py'?  Tools will
like that better than either of the approaches which try to preserve the
twins as a single file:

  - Embedding the Python code into an HTML/XML comment at the head or
foot of the template in the .pt file will not let editors help with
syntax highlighting.

  - In addition to messing up syntax highlighting, embedding the
template as a triple-quoted string literal in the .py file feels
*really* nasty (almost as nasty as Zope3's script tag).

And there is yet another argument for the bound library:  it shows how
unnecessary, as well has how evil, that script tag hack is.

Refactoring a one-off template-cum-library will be simple, too:  once
the refactored code is moved to a real module (even a persistent
module in Zope3!), the library can just contain
'from realmodule import usefulFunction', and the template won't need
to change.

I would vote for having the bound library's names inserted into the
'template' TALES namespace, BTW.

Tres.
-- 
===
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Zope Corporation  Zope Dealers   http://www.zope.com


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