Re: [Zope] Re: Epoz and Tidy

2005-05-05 Thread Daniel Dekany
Thursday, May 5, 2005, 4:41:15 AM, Cyrille Bonnet wrote:

 As Shane pointed out, there is a tidy up in Kupu. However, in my 
 experience, it is not a very good tidy up (if I remember correctly, a 
 lot of tags are still there after the tidy up).

Maybe the key of the tidy problem is that these server side tidiers
don't date to be too Draconian, because then they would possibly damage
the content. Now if the tidy would happen right when the user pastes in
the HTML from the clipboard, then he would immediately see what's the
result, so the tidier could be much more brave in killing the frippery.
Also, then the content that was entered earlier couldn't be damaged by
the tidier (since only the just inserted content is tidied).

Anyway, are there any hope that text entered with these browser embedded
WYSIWYG editors (like Kupu) will be really pure content? I mean, the
input shouldn't even be HTML (as far as the user sees it at least), but
something like DocBook.

 AFAIK, Kupu is integrated in Plone 2.1.

 Daniel Dekany wrote:
 Friday, April 29, 2005, 7:12:30 PM, Maik Jablonski wrote:
 
 
Robert (Jamie) Munro wrote:

How do I control tidy options when using Epoz and uTidyLib? I'd like it
to output xhtml, but it is currently outputting uppercase tag names etc.

If uTidyLib or mxTidy (recommended) is installed correctly, Epoz should
output XHTML. Please check if you've installed uTidyLib with the correct
  python (same as running your Zope-Server).
 
 
 BTW, anybody has found a solution for fixing HTML copy-pasted from
 Microsoft Word (mostly 2000/XP)? Lot of users has MS Word, and the HTML
 pasted from it is a CSS killer mess. I tried mxTidy but it didn't
 improved substantially the HTML. So how do you guys do it? I have looked
 after solutions for Epoz, but didn't found any. But I don't stick to
 Epoz... if there is a solution already for Kupu (is Kupu already
 recommended over Epoz anyway?). Certainly the solution would be an Epoz
 post-tidy Python script, but I didn't found any for Word tidying.
 (However, the ideal would be if the HTML is tidied right on the client
 when it pastes it in -- thus user would really get what it sees, i.e.
 the HTML wouldn't be changed when he saves it. That effect is really
 evil.)
 
 
-mj

-- 
Best regards,
 Daniel Dekany

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Re: [Zope] Re: Epoz and Tidy

2005-05-05 Thread Daniel Dekany
Thursday, May 5, 2005, 9:10:23 AM, Duncan Booth wrote:

 Cyrille Bonnet wrote:

 Daniel Dekany wrote:
[snip]
 One of my thoughts is to provide a separate 'clean this up' button which
 would apply a more aggressive tidy-up than the one when saving. Also, I
 agree that only applying the tidy on save is bad, but there isn't a cross-
 browser way to detect a paste, and applying the cleanup on a large 
 document every time you cut/paste one word wouldn't be nice either.
[snip]

Did anybody considered using other client side technologies than
JavaScript, like using a Java Applet or Flash as the editor? Maybe they
can capture paste events and such (I don't know...), also they have much
less cross-browser problems (like they work with Opera and Safari). Yes,
they can't render HTML on the same way the browser, but after all, if we
are talking about a place where users enter pure content (I mean,
structure) then maybe it is not a that big problem. I mean, the user
sees clearly that he has made a paragraph here and ha level 1 heading
there, even if he doesn't see how will it exactly look regarding the
visual design. At least (s)he will concentrate on content rather than on
visual design. Anyway, I think that HTML is not the ideal scheme for
entering content.

-- 
Best regards,
 Daniel Dekany

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Re: [Zope] Re: Epoz and Tidy

2005-04-29 Thread Daniel Dekany
Friday, April 29, 2005, 7:12:30 PM, Maik Jablonski wrote:

 Robert (Jamie) Munro wrote:
 How do I control tidy options when using Epoz and uTidyLib? I'd like it
 to output xhtml, but it is currently outputting uppercase tag names etc.

 If uTidyLib or mxTidy (recommended) is installed correctly, Epoz should
 output XHTML. Please check if you've installed uTidyLib with the correct
   python (same as running your Zope-Server).

BTW, anybody has found a solution for fixing HTML copy-pasted from
Microsoft Word (mostly 2000/XP)? Lot of users has MS Word, and the HTML
pasted from it is a CSS killer mess. I tried mxTidy but it didn't
improved substantially the HTML. So how do you guys do it? I have looked
after solutions for Epoz, but didn't found any. But I don't stick to
Epoz... if there is a solution already for Kupu (is Kupu already
recommended over Epoz anyway?). Certainly the solution would be an Epoz
post-tidy Python script, but I didn't found any for Word tidying.
(However, the ideal would be if the HTML is tidied right on the client
when it pastes it in -- thus user would really get what it sees, i.e.
the HTML wouldn't be changed when he saves it. That effect is really
evil.)

 -mj

-- 
Best regards,
 Daniel Dekany

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Re: [Zope] Re: Epoz and Tidy

2005-04-29 Thread Shane Graber
Kupu takes care of all the M$ crap code from my experience.

Shane

On 4/29/05, Daniel Dekany [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Friday, April 29, 2005, 7:12:30 PM, Maik Jablonski wrote:
 
 BTW, anybody has found a solution for fixing HTML copy-pasted from
 Microsoft Word (mostly 2000/XP)?
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