Hi,
Bernhard - you've made a good case for having annotator functionality
within MediaWiki. What you haven't really made a good case for is being
able to query that annotation info using SMW, which is the relevant thing
here.
David - if you want to talk about the general stuff, you should probably
start a separate thread for it. :)
-Yaron
On Tue, Dec 17, 2013 at 11:13 AM, Krabina Bernhard <krab...@kdz.or.at>wrote:
> hmm. short answer:
>
> As WikiMediaLabs is doing this:
> http://annotator.wmflabs.org/wiki/Lorem_ipsum it is probably going to be
> available in MW installations. Therfore it makes sense to have some
> semantification of it (and yes, general semantification is an interesting
> topic, the special semantic properties go in this right direction)
>
> long anwer:
> Sometimes I have the feeling that SMW users and devs still have the
> semantic encyclopedia in mind. My use cases are far more off this track.
> SMW has it's clear strenghts, but for some features, others put up very
> quick and sometimes very nice features. e.g.
> http://annotateit.org/
> http://etherpad.org/
>
> There are many use cases for this and of cource, then the easiest solution
> is to use these pieces of software. But if you look at this page
> https://github.com/okfn/annotator/wiki you can see a lot of plugins
> already available for systems like Drupal. As great as wikis are in general
> for many many use cases, for some things there are simpler solutions. to
> have these possibilities integrated in the SMW ecosystems seems a worthwile
> effort.
>
> concrete use case i was thinking of: a city releasing agenda items,
> protocols, decisions, regulacitons etc. of municipal council meetings on a
> wiki. the general public should not be able to edit these, but annotate
> them (and rate them).
>
> regards,
> Bernhard
>
>
> ----- Ursprüngliche Mail -----
> >
> > Hi Yaron!
> >
> >
> > I'm in favor in semantifying everything but here I'd agree with you -
> > I don't yet see the usecase where it would be useful to have
> > semantified inline comments. Or any comments and discussions, for
> > that matter.
> >
> >
> > -----
> > Yury Katkov, WikiVote
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Tue, Dec 17, 2013 at 6:28 PM, Yaron Koren < ya...@wikiworks.com >
> > wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > Hi Bernhard,
> >
> >
> > This seems like a case of the "when you have a hammer, everything
> > looks like a nail" principle. :) If the extension used - whether
> > it's Annotator or anything else - is keeping annotation information,
> > it's presumably using one or more of its own database tables to do
> > that. And so the most logical place to put tools to query and
> > display that information would be in that extension itself, not via
> > SMW. You could make the case for a "Semantic Annotator" extension
> > that stores the text directly via SMW, but I don't see the benefit
> > in that. The use cases you present are all (not surprisingly)
> > self-contained - there's nothing like "show, in a table, all
> > annotations for pages about cars from before 1950". So I don't see
> > much "synergy" in being able to query everything together.
> >
> >
> > This starts to get into the larger question of whether SMW should be
> > able to query any wiki-related data - the so-called
> > "semantification" concept - but I would think if we're going to have
> > that discussion, we should have that larger discussion, and not tie
> > it to this particular feature.
> >
> >
> > -Yaron
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Tue, Dec 17, 2013 at 8:25 AM, Krabina Bernhard < krab...@kdz.or.at
> > > wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Great, I didn't know about MashaJS. Is there a test wiki around. In
> > the discussion there is a hint that it does not work with
> > HeaderTabs...
> >
> >
> > > Which use cases do you have in mind that involved queryable inline
> > > comments?
> >
> > There can be reasons, where
> >
> > a) I want to have an overview of remarks that users made and the talk
> > page and/or version history is too cumbersome, because you have to
> > switch around all the time. If you want to ask users for comments on
> > a text, a regular wiki is not very usable. annotations are great
> > here.
> > b) users don't want to/dare to/should not edit the text itself, but
> > still should have to possibility to add/enhance/comment on the text
> >
> > It would be great to have features like:
> > * show only annotations of user X on the page
> > * show the text with annotations of users X and Y, but not from Z
> > * show the users with most annotations
> > ...
> >
> > regards,
> > Bernhard
> >
> >
> > ----- Ursprüngliche Mail -----
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > >
> > > Hi Bernhard!
> > > Nice extension, reminds me of MashaJS:
> > > http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:MashaJS
> > >
> > >
> > > Which use cases do you have in mind that involved queryable inline
> > > comments?
> > >
> > >
> > > -----
> > > Yury Katkov, WikiVote
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Tue, Dec 17, 2013 at 11:55 AM, Krabina Bernhard <
> > > krab...@kdz.or.at > wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > Dear all,
> > >
> > > I just want to draw your attention to an interesting feature
> > > currently missing in MW/SMW: the ability to easily annotate a
> > > (wiki)
> > > document. There are lots of usecases for this and there are some
> > > first results. The interesting thing of course would be to make
> > > annotations semantic and therfore queryable!
> > >
> > > If anyone is interested, please look here:
> > > http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:Annotator
> > >
> > > (I'm not in any way involved in this, I just stumbled across it and
> > > thought it's very interesting).
> > >
> > > -Bernhard
> > >
> > >
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