Huge +1 --
Best regards, Benoit TELLIER General manager of Linagora VIETNAM. Product owner for Twake-Mail product. Chairman of the Apache James project. Mail: [email protected] Tel: (0033) 6 77 26 04 58 (WhatsApp, Signal) Le oct. 6, 2026 10:43 AM, de Felix Auringer <[email protected]>Hey, > I am sure i missing something but this thing really can help with flexibility > for James i think. I do not think that flexibility is the most important thing. James is already a large project and keeping it maintainable should be a very high priority in my opinion. With postgres, there is a storage system for small deployments and with cassandra one for distributed deployments. I think this covers most use cases while still being maintainable. Best regards, Felix On 06/10/2026 10.35, Ilya Terskov wrote: > Cassandra is ACID now in 6/7 version (current master) because LWT -> Accord i > personally build it from sources (god that ant and accord build separately > make me wanna die) and even adopt it to windows (change some system calls) > and hard test it to oom killer, sigkill and other dirty stuff and it's not > lost anything. > > YouTrackDB surely interesting and company behind it already have this DB in > production (github show 0.5.0 snapshot idk its stable or not) its have FTS > Lucent integrated, full ACID, YQL,SQL,GQL (not fully), NoSQL (mosly like > MongoDB) and Graph (Gremlin+TinkerPop). I am sure i missing something but > this thing really can help with flexibility for James i think. > > About tests. After full tuning postgres-app with S3 silo if you remember have > about 350-400 msg/seconds (when it was activemq) on my DDR4 32 GB 3200Mhz, i5 > 9400, Samsung 860 evo, for postres-app even 2nd Samsung 860 evo (so james on > one and postgresql on second, windows system on third (also samsung 980 evo) > perfect i think?) but for more correct testing lets use only YouTrackDB > (embedded mode) and Postgres-APP all messages inside (blobs included). > > All tests were on the current master build from sources without special > tuning (default i mean, youtrackdb full acid mode) > > > > вт, 6 окт. 2026 г. в 14:00, Benoit TELLIER via server-dev > <[email protected] <[email protected]>>: > > Cassandra is not ACID. Please read > cassandra.apache.org/doc/stable/cassandra/architecture/guarantees.html > <cassandra.apache.org/doc/stable/cassandra/architecture/guarantees.html> > > MongoDB won't hold scale well. > > PostgreSQL is a versatile tool that shines at medium / low volumes, is an > admin standard and have options for large scale. I expect most users to go > with vanilla PG server and just be fine - the question is raised at scale > only IMO. > > For the record we made the choice of PG and not regular SQL in order to > rely on PG built in queries and datatype in order to deliver a more efficient > implem than raw SQL. > > YouTrackDB is an interesting experiment, and I'm happy to see people > exploring alternatives. However, every new backend adds a maintenance burden > for the project. Historically we have removed backends that lost their > maintainers. So adding one upstream needs more than a working implementation: > we need a community willing to maintain it over time. > > About the 400 msg/s, could you share your benchmark methodology: > hardware, James version, mail size, concurrency? Comparing against the > postgres-app on the same setup would make the numbers meaningful. As for hot > backups, PostgreSQL has mature tooling (pg_basebackup, WAL archiving / PITR), > and the blob store can sit on S3 or the file system with ts own backup > strategy. Also raw SMTP throughput is not a limiting part of most James > systems I did operate on.-- > > > Best regards, > > Benoit TELLIER > > General manager of Linagora VIETNAM. > Product owner for Twake-Mail product. > Chairman of the Apache James project. > > Mail: [email protected] <[email protected]> > Tel: (0033) 6 77 26 04 58 (WhatsApp, Signal) > > > > Le oct. 6, 2026 5:40 AM, de Ilya Terskov <[email protected] > <[email protected]>>Hi guys! :) i really think for home users and anykey > level of admins still > prefer more straight databases then Postgres (like MongoDB) and that > because there so many versions of Postgres > (YugabyteDB, TimescaleDB, Tantor, Postgres Pro and there ALOT) also as i > see NoSQL DB with ACID like Xodus or MongoDB (even YouTrackDB nosql+graf > show better and pretty easy to adopt > github.com/prosgarz35/youtrackdb-app > <github.com/prosgarz35/youtrackdb-app>) better fit for mail server > specifics. Postgres is surely good, but i personally after try Cassandra i > like it more (mb i rly like java tools?) and its shame there no way i can > use it on standalone server because of ACID (i try to hard test it and no > corruption but still...). So i feel like something like Jpa-App but > new...cause current Jpa-App can be pretty easy corrupt by oom killer, > sigkill etc. Youtrackdb seems promising by the way - i adopt all into this > Database (even mail spooler) and it show about 400 msg/sec, full ACID, > online hot backups (full and incr) with sync on blobs in filesystem. Tell > me you thoughts about it please. > > пн, 5 окт. 2026 г. в 18:34, Benoit TELLIER via server-dev < > [email protected] <[email protected]>>: > > > Hello > > > > jpa-app neing deprecated -> +1 > > > > About xodus: I see the point but I am reluctant to add yet another > family > > of storage dependency as part of the james project. > > > > I'd consider the PG dependency light enough to not be a concern even to > > self hosters. > > > > I'd recommend concentrating our efforts only to one backend instead of > > dispersing our efforts. > > > > -- > > > > > > Best regards, > > > > Benoit TELLIER > > > > General manager of Linagora VIETNAM. > > Product owner for Twake-Mail product. > > Chairman of the Apache James project. > > > > Mail: [email protected] <[email protected]> > > Tel: (0033) 6 77 26 04 58 (WhatsApp, Signal) > > > > > > > > Le oct. 5, 2026 9:26 AM, de Ilya Terskov <[email protected] > <[email protected]>>i think > > its not worth it only bacause in future if james bump java to 25+ > > there no way for xodus still be working :c sorry to wasting you > time... but > > i still try youtrackdb github.com/JetBrains/youtrackdb > <github.com/JetBrains/youtrackdb> - database > > which used now instead of xodus. > > > > пн, 5 окт. 2026 г. в 12:24, Ilya Terskov <[email protected] > <[email protected]>>: > > > > > Thanks Rene! > > > > > > here is PR POC > > > > > > github.com/apache/james-project/pull/3231 > <github.com/apache/james-project/pull/3231> > > > > > > пн, 5 окт. 2026 г. в 09:25, Rene Cordier <[email protected] > <[email protected]>>: > > > > > >> Hi Ilya, > > >> > > >> I personally don't know Xodus at all. > > >> > > >> I would say if you can propose a POC that separates well Xodus > implem > > >> into its own modules without impacting much the rest of the code > it's > > >> maybe ok having a look and discussing around it. > > >> > > >> The more we add components support to James the moire we need time > and > > >> energy to keep maintaining everything though keep in mind. > > >> > > >> Rene. > > >> > > >> On 10/4/26 22:25, Ilya Terskov wrote: > > >> > Hi there once again. > > >> > > > >> > I am little update build. I know its will adds complexity if > added to > > >> > master but i think its good option vs jpa-app which now mostly > > >> deprecated > > >> > and not more main point of development. I am personaly want hard > test > > it > > >> > and support as i can. > > >> > For now in my repo its uses in memory spooler (because activemq > -> > > >> artemis > > >> > transition time) also for simplicity i make metadata and blob in > > >> database > > >> > but xodus support and control meta in database and blob in > filesystem > > - > > >> and > > >> > with backup it sync both places and guarantee persistent - its > killer > > >> > feature dont it? > > >> > > >> > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected] > <[email protected]> > > >> For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected] > <[email protected]> > > >> > > >> > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected] > For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected] --- Gesellschaft für interkulturelles Zusammenleben gGmbH (GIZ) Felix Auringer IT Reformationsplatz 2 13597 Berlin Tel: 030/513 0100 00; Fax: 030/513 0100 09 giz.berlin; [email protected] Amtsgericht Charlottenburg HRB 200872 B Geschäftsführerin: Dr. Britta Marschke --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected] For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected]
