the building code has very explicit definition for incidental and/or
accessory use. Some model codes also use the term Auxiliary. The
normal black and white differentiation of occupancies doesn't always
work well for assigning when a 13R is appropriate. For instance,
take identical BIG kitchen on the first floor with residential on the
second fl. If that kitchen serves only the residents then 13R is
fine but if it is part of a commercial restaurant a 13 system is
required. The requirement to provide a higher level of property
protection (for business continuity) is applicable for the restaurant
but not so much to the residential kitchen. THAT kind of philosophy
can NOT be handled by the codes (more so by choice of that code
making body I think). Complicating the issue is that the the size of
the fire area typically is not triggering sprinklers for the other
occupancies. IF there were large enough, it would be a mot question
- 13 applies.
Roland
On Feb 9, 2007, at 2:53 PM, Joe Burtell wrote:
I agree it seem incidental but unless the architect and Building
Official
agree it's just a R2, I don't see how one could do a 13R. I would
call the
building official and ask him why it's not incidental.
Joe Burtell, SET, CFPS
Burtell Fire Protection, Inc.
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.burtellfire.com
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
George Church
Sent: Friday, February 09, 2007 3:52 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: Residential?
Let's put this in perspective:
One 535 SF classroom
One 312 SF Conf room
One 160 SF Office
Two 106 SF offices
One 118 SF Laundry
That's substantially less than run of the mill hotel back of house.
Are the business offices of a hotel, not to mention their
conference rooms,
incidental to the running of a hotel? Commercial laundries, not a
7' x 17'
cubby.
glc
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Todd
Williams
- work
Sent: Friday, February 09, 2007 5:30 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Residential?
To me this sounds like a 13 system. Incidental is defined as "of a
minor, casual or subordinate nature". I'm not sure that offices and
classrooms fall under that category for an otherwise residential
occupancy since that could stand on their own. My thought is that an
incidental occupancy (such as an office or laundry room for a hotel)
is one that could not reasonably exist without the primary
(residential). I vote for mixed use, hence 13.
At 04:05 PM 2/9/2007, you wrote:
We have a project in which the majority of the building is dorm
rooms;
2nd flr (top) is all dorms, with a few more dorm rooms and a few
classrooms
and offices on the first floor. Small basement is mechanical only.
Entire building footprint is a whopping
The classrooms are for the use of the students that reside in the
dorm;
Offices for faculty that teach there.
Overall concept is suburban campus college has this building in
the city
for
students to study government and urban life. So the non-
residential areas
are incidental to the residential nature of the building.
The Architect has deemed the building A3 for the first floor, R2
on 2nd
floor. Naturally the one hour separation is at the first floor
ceiling.
If this sounds a little strange, at least it's not #13TR, elderly
housing
over tire storage:) This IS located in a locale where 13d tank/
pumps feed
3
story office buildings, with poly tanks located in restaurant
storage area,
and CPVC in OH2. Sure, that will make the judge understand ?
Anyway, would % of use and other uses being for the occupants make
this
look
#13R to any of you?
George Church
Rowe Sprinkler
_______________________________________________
Sprinklerforum mailing list
[email protected]
http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum
Todd G. Williams, PE
Fire Protection Design/Consulting
Stonington, Connecticut
860-535-2080
www.fpdc.com
_______________________________________________
Sprinklerforum mailing list
[email protected]
http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum
_______________________________________________
Sprinklerforum mailing list
[email protected]
http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum
_______________________________________________
Sprinklerforum mailing list
[email protected]
http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum
_______________________________________________
Sprinklerforum mailing list
[email protected]
http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum
