I'm going to address both messages so did not clean-up the first message.
George - as a rep on a TC I'm going to smack you with a 2x4 next time I see you. Also as a contractor why would you want to be saddled with this issue. The TC has gone to great pains to place the decision on the back of the party(s) responsible for the entire building. That being the owner AND THEIR DESIGNATED REPRESENTATIVES ie engineer of record. Bill - as much as you hate getting tasked with it, I find it hard to accept that you believe your statement that the engineer is not obligated. The same Owner Certificate says the owner will provide the design concepts necessary to perform the layout without saying the engineer is responsible for that either. The standard does not say treat for MIC just because there are microbes (since they are everywhere) and even if conditions exist that indicate an occurrence is likely, the owner (guided by their trusted representatives) can decide to do nothing but monitor. The problem is predicting when MIC will occur since it is like lung cancer where smoking (the presence of microbes) increases the chance of occurrence but doesn't mean you'll get it. Continuing the analogy, the more you smoke (the higher the concentration of microbes), the greater the probability but it doesn't mean it WILL occur. Roland On Mar 25, 2009, at 7:42 AM, George Church wrote: > I'd be cautious about assuming every job has MIC and spending (my) > money on > every job to cure it; perhaps contractually saddle the spkr guy with > the > testing and specify a couple labs and/or procedure. Make it an > allowance if > you need to, since most of us aren't going to want to test the water > before > bid day, heck its hard enough to find out what flow info is available. > > glc > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of > [email protected] > Sent: Wednesday, March 25, 2009 10:30 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: MIC Design Policy > > I'll start by saying I assume all of you know more than I do about > this > subject. > > My second foray into water quality testing is about all the farther I > want to go into this subject. Here's what I have learned: > > 1. This is an owner requirement but owners don't know they have this > responsibility. > 2. There may be one handful of labs in the country who are able to do > the testing. > 3. There is no standard protocol for performing the testing. > 4. Ed Schultz made 3 attempts to make positive changes to NFPA 13 > (ROP > 469, 470, 471) but he got 3 rejections for the '10 edition. However, > the committee did add two additional owner options just in case some > owner out there stumbles onto this requirement. > 5. There's no obligation for the engineer, designer, or contractor to > be involved in this subject whatsoever. If not notified by "the > owner", > then all the rest of us who understand the problem and its > consequences > can say "the owner" did not inform us. > 6. It's pretty clear the committee wants to keep it this way. > > I'm planning to specify a system treatment approach for every job. > Right now I'm leaning toward the Potter approach with the portable > chemical injection system. What are the pros and cons of this > approach? > > Bill Brooks > > William N. Brooks, P.E. > Brooks Fire Protection Engineering Inc. > 372 Wilett Drive > Severna Park, MD 21146 > 410-544-3620 Phone > 410-544-3032 FAX > 412-400-6528 Cell > > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > > To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] > (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) > > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > > To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] > (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) > _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
