This is not really my area of expertise, but how about calcing to Class IV ( your best guess) and if it fails, new ball game, if it succeeds, re calc at next higher commodity level(s) until it fails. You might therefore report to AHJ and owner what commodity the system will support at what it will not. This could give the owner and the AHJ options regarding permissible inventory and higher level of protection.
C. Burton Ford C. Burton Ford Designer- NICET Certified: Fire Alarm, Special Hazards, Sprinkler Design &Sprinkler Inspections NFPA CFPS Cintas Fire Protection-D-47 Warminster, PA 18974 Phone 267-487-1000 Fax 267-487-1010 -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Todd Williams Sent: Thursday, May 13, 2010 10:01 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: Warehouse Commodity This is a guessing game. I did an existing warehouse addition where they said the products would be similar to what was there, which I determined to be Class IV. When I went to do the final walk through, there were camp stoves and propane cylinders in the racks. "Oh, the buyer got a good deal so we decided to carry them". This, to me, would be a good application for the Owner's Information Certificate. Have them declare what they are going to put in the building and design the system to that. At 09:40 AM 5/13/2010, you wrote: >Yes I know, I understand that there is a 15% >allowance for plastics in Class IV. How do you >reasonably take a varied mix like this and >assign a % to it. Especially in a case like this >where the fire marshall is prepared to tell >someone they have to spend tens of thousands on >this old building to reinstate the pump if the calcs fail badly? > >I don't think it needs to go into Group A >plastics just from visual inspection and seeing >the place, but technically, the 15% is tough to figure. > >If the calcs fail, he is going to require Stage >2, FPE and pump repair. I just don't want to >miss it by a mile on the front end. > >Thanks again, > >Greg McGahan > >Living Water Fire Protection >(850) 937.1850 | Fax (850) 937.1852 | Cell (850) 554.3231 > > >-----Original Message----- >From: [email protected] >[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of George Church >Sent: Thursday, May 13, 2010 8:42 AM >To: [email protected] >Subject: RE: Warehouse Commodity > >Plastic packaging can introduce expanded plastic..... > >-----Original Message----- >From: [email protected] >[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Matt Grise >Sent: Thursday, May 13, 2010 9:30 AM >To: '[email protected]' >Subject: RE: Warehouse Commodity > >I would watch for (I saw this in a hardware warehouse): they would >occasionally receive shipments of plastic trashcans, sleds and things like >that even though it was not their typical product. > >Matt Grisé PE*, LEED AP >Sales Engineer >Alliance Fire Protection >*Licensed in KS & MO > >913.888.0647 ph >913.888.0618 f >913.927.0222 cell >www. AFPsprink.com > >-----Original Message----- >From: [email protected] >[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Greg McGahan >Sent: Thursday, May 13, 2010 8:23 AM >To: [email protected] >Subject: Warehouse Commodity > >The AHJ has asked us to run some quick calcs on the scenario below to >satisfy his curiosity, any help is appreciated! > > > >1) Existing building - 50 yrs old. Originally had a pump and tank >and some time in the past pump and tank were abandoned and tied into >public water. > >2) Was built for who knows what and is now a warehouse for a chain >retail store for damaged items and Lawn and Garden Equipment. > >3) Wet System - no calc plate - Looks like some type of schedule >system that varies somewhat. Some lines are 1.25, 1.5, 2 and some are >1.5, 2,2,2,2 etc. > >4) Storing on wood pallets on open racks Unencapsulated a varied >mixture of the following items to a max of 15' high: about 10' clear to >roof deck > >a. Weedeaters in boxes > >b. Lawnmowers > >c. Metal toolboxes > >d. Small electric hand tools > >e. Some appliances > >f. Some appliance repair parts > > > >There is not really any predominant type of item, or even 2 or 3 types. >It's weird and complicated. > > > >The difficulty is that for the AHJ's purposes right now, there is no >Engineer involved and will be only if the calcs fail miserably. > > > >Does Class IV seem reasonable? > > > >Greg McGahan > >Operations Manager > > > >Living Water Fire Protection > >1160 McKenzie Road > >P.O. Box 877 > >Cantonment, Florida 32533 > >(850) 937.1850 | Fax (850) 937.1852 | Cell (850) 554.3231 > >[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > > > >_______________________________________________ >Sprinklerforum mailing list >[email protected] >http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > >For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > >To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] >(Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) >_______________________________________________ >Sprinklerforum mailing list >[email protected] >http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > >For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > >To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] >(Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) > >_______________________________________________ >Sprinklerforum mailing list >[email protected] >http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > >For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > >To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] >(Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) >_______________________________________________ >Sprinklerforum mailing list >[email protected] >http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > >For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > >To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] >(Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) Todd G. 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