That's the unfortunate part of the new technology end. Someone has to
blaze the 'listing/labeling' trail by paying for a standard to be
developed to have their product tested against. Then after a few years,
other companies reverse engineer it and begin to offer similar products.


They too need a standard to test against because their product is just a
bit different and likely wouldn't pass the protocols developed
originally for the 'trailblazer.' So, they might get their own standard.

Then, after a bit of time goes by, those standards are deemed obsolete
and a new "harmonized" standard is needed so that these similar products
are evaluated against the same protocols to level the field. So
everything gets "delisted" and the manufacturers have to go through the
listing process all over again. 

Or so I've "heard"......

-- Dave

-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected]
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Tom
Duross
Sent: Thursday, June 24, 2010 1:19 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: Automatic air release

Just like the fire pump couplings, huge money investments.
I didn't know you could pay them to develop a standard though, I learn
something every day here.
TD
GRS


George,

Mike's answer reminded me greatly of the first discussion I had with 
someone on the cost of a listed expansion chamber, which I thought was 
off the scale for what it actually consisted of.

The client on that project still glares at me when we meet, because he 
thought I was padding the cost of the tank, as it was so high.
-- 
PARSLEY CONSULTING
Ken Wagoner, SET


George Church wrote:
> Not perceived as advertising here, Mike- 
> nice clear and concise explanation of all the tedious and expensive
steps
> required to develop new products.
>
> There are many who look at the raw manufacturing cost of a device
without
> considering the development costs divided into the # units expected to
be
> produced.
> There are propriatory sprinkler devices that have similar "baggage"
and
the
> market then determines whether the risk taken pays off in revenue
sufficient
> to cover the investment.
>
> >From your narrative, it's a steep slop to climb, eh? Not for those
faint
of
> heart or with shallow pockets.
>
> Thanks for the explanation- more than many could imagine, i trust.
>
> George Church
>
> Reliability, listings, engineering and limited demand all factor into
the
> price.
>
> Neither UL nor FM had a standard for air vents used on fire sprinkler
mains
> and branch lines. The only standard was for fire pumps.
>
> Potter commissioned and paid UL to write a standard for vents for fire
> sprinkler mains and branchlines, UL2573. The vents that were listed
and
> approved for fire pumps do not meet the UL standard for branch line
vents.
>
> We spent over 2 years testing and researching vents until we found one
that
> would meet the requirements and then another year for the actual
approval
> process. We just received UL listing for the only vent approved for
branch
> lines. 
>
> FM still does not have a standard for this, they still only approve
for
use
> on fire pumps despite what some other company may advertise. Potter is
> trying to get FM to also create a standard for branchlines but they
have
> not.
>
> It's going to take a long time and a lot of sales to recoup our
expenses
on
> this and I am reminded of that frequently by the people above me.
>
> This is not an advertisement; I'm just answering a question.
>
> Regards,
>
> mike
>
> Mike Henke CET

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