Hii I am facing exactly the same pblm.. We are using NFPA 30 only. but no clear cut answers Even I am not sure whether there is a need for any type of protection.But unfortunatley no AHJ requirments here. As its an open area, I presume we cant use foam sprinkler system as no containment option is there.
For sprinkler system Going by the higher side < I can settle down for ESFR Am I right? On Mon, Jul 12, 2010 at 11:22 PM, <[email protected]> wrote: > You're dealing with many different issues but overall, an open shed if > often not required to even have sprinklers. I know we like to put > sprinklers on everything but there are just times when there is no Code > direction to do so regardless of what we think should be done. So if > there's no Code, AHJ or Underwriter requirement to do so then you've got no > way to justify it and the owner isn't going to just volunteer funds to > protect something that's not required to be protected. End of story, go to > the lake and drown some worms, your work is over. > > > Craig L. Prahl, CET > Fire Protection Specialist > Mechanical Department > CH2MHILL > Lockwood Greene > 1500 International Drive > Spartanburg, SC 29304-0491 > Direct - 864.599.4102 > Fax - 864.599.8439 > [email protected] > http://www.ch2m.com > > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] [mailto: > [email protected]] On Behalf Of Todd Williams > Sent: Monday, July 12, 2010 3:13 PM > To: [email protected] > Subject: RE: Flammable Liquid storage in open sheds > > OK. The last shed structure I dealt with was next to the water where > wind could be an issue. However, a shed without walls, I would think, > have very different burn characteristics than an enclosed space. The > structure is more like a giant ceiling cloud that a room. Are you > going to get a significant flow of fresh air at floor (or fire) level > to replace the hot air escaping all sides around the roof? If this > going to increase the intensity of the burn? Haven't done any > research, but those are just questions. > > > > At 02:56 PM 7/12/2010, you wrote: > >Todd, if a drum goes up, there'd have to be a heckuva wind to not have the > >sprinklers activate- even by radiant heat. > > > >-----Original Message----- > >From: [email protected] > >[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Todd > Williams > >Sent: Monday, July 12, 2010 2:45 PM > >To: [email protected] > >Subject: RE: Flammable Liquid storage in open sheds > > > >And since the building has no walls, how is wind going to factor in? > > > > > > > >At 02:30 PM 7/12/2010, you wrote: > > >And then there's that ever elusive, non-conforming to anything, type of > > >storage container that so often pops up. Chemical storage is one of > > >the most aggravating things I have to deal with. Everyone expects > > >cookie-cutter answers. Yeah, I wish. Then there's the chase your tail > > >in a circle Code search for containment that can confuse the daylights > > >out of people. > > > > > >Craig L. Prahl, CET > > >Fire Protection Specialist > > >Mechanical Department > > >CH2MHILL > > >Lockwood Greene > > >1500 International Drive > > >Spartanburg, SC 29304-0491 > > >Direct - 864.599.4102 > > >Fax - 864.599.8439 > > >[email protected] > > >http://www.ch2m.com > > > > > > > > >-----Original Message----- > > >From: [email protected] > > >[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of George > > >Church > > >Sent: Monday, July 12, 2010 2:30 PM > > >To: [email protected] > > >Subject: RE: Flammable Liquid storage in open sheds > > > > > >and just when you think you've tracked down all the questions, you open > > >up NFPA 30 and then the phone, "relieving or non-relieving?" > > > > > >NFPA 30 has been given to us to add back the fun we used to have with > > >231C, which many of us don't get to experience as much with the > > >popularity of ESFRs. > > >I loved asking aisle widths for a spec whse, knowing the answer. > > > > > >glc > > > > > >-----Original Message----- > > >From: [email protected] > > >[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of > > >[email protected] > > >Sent: Monday, July 12, 2010 2:09 PM > > >To: [email protected] > > >Subject: RE: Flammable Liquid storage in open sheds > > > > > >There are a lot of variables that need to be known before answering a > > >question like that. > > > > > >Depending on what building or fire code applies the answers can vary, > > >also the location of the shed with respect to exposure of other > > >buildings or public ways can factor in and in a lot of cases with a > > >Class III combustible, there may not be any need whatsoever for any > > >kind of fixed fire protection. There needs to be some code research > > >performed and you need to know what the material is. You can spray all > > >the water you want on certain types of combustible liquids and > > >accomplish nothing, you may need foam or foam-water. > > > > > >Too many unknowns here. > > > > > >Craig L. Prahl, CET > > >Fire Protection Specialist > > >Mechanical Department > > >CH2MHILL > > >Lockwood Greene > > >1500 International Drive > > >Spartanburg, SC 29304-0491 > > >Direct - 864.599.4102 > > >Fax - 864.599.8439 > > >[email protected] > > >http://www.ch2m.com > > > > > >-----Original Message----- > > >From: [email protected] > > >[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of sam b > > >Sent: Monday, July 12, 2010 1:56 PM > > >To: [email protected] > > >Subject: Flammable Liquid storage in open sheds > > > > > >Hii.. > > > > > >Need some help > > > > > >Storage:in drums > > >Flammaeble liquid: Class III > > >Rack storage up to max 5 m. > > >Open shed storage with no walls (max height of shed is 7 m at eave) . > > > > > > > > >Can i know what sort of protection I need to provide(Sprinkler > > >system?). I checked NFPA 30 .but couldnt find the exact thing. > > > > > >I think chapter 15,NFPA2008 edition suits the scenario. But what sort > > >of protection and design density to consider. > > > > > >Can anyone give me a quick answer.? > > > > > >Thaanks in advance > > > > > >Regards > > >Sam > > >_______________________________________________ > > >Sprinklerforum mailing list > > >[email protected] > > >http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > > > > > >For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > > > > > >To Unsubscribe, send an email > > >to:[email protected]<to%[email protected]> > > >(Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) > > >_______________________________________________ > > >Sprinklerforum mailing list > > >[email protected] > > >http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > > > > > >For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > > > > > >To Unsubscribe, send an email > > >to:[email protected]<to%[email protected]> > > >(Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) > > > > > >_______________________________________________ > > >Sprinklerforum mailing list > > >[email protected] > > >http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > > > > > >For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > > > > > >To Unsubscribe, send an email > > >to:[email protected]<to%[email protected]> > > >(Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) > > >_______________________________________________ > > >Sprinklerforum mailing list > > >[email protected] > > >http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > > > > > >For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > > > > > >To Unsubscribe, send an email > > >to:[email protected]<to%[email protected]> > > >(Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) > > > >Todd G. Williams, PE > >Fire Protection Design/Consulting > >Stonington, CT > >860.535.2080 > >www.fpdc.com > > > >_______________________________________________ > >Sprinklerforum mailing list > >[email protected] > >http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > > > >For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > > > >To Unsubscribe, send an email > >to:[email protected]<to%[email protected]> > >(Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) > > > >_______________________________________________ > >Sprinklerforum mailing list > >[email protected] > >http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > > > >For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > > > >To Unsubscribe, send an email > >to:[email protected]<to%[email protected]> > >(Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) > > Todd G. Williams, PE > Fire Protection Design/Consulting > Stonington, CT > 860.535.2080 > www.fpdc.com > > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > > For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > > To Unsubscribe, send an email > to:[email protected]<to%[email protected]> > (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > > For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > > To Unsubscribe, send an email > to:[email protected]<to%[email protected]> > (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) > _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
