Yes.  You have to design the QR sprinklers at 0.10 density.  So, you have to
make sure your residential sprinklers are flowing at 0.1 density because the
reference below says 0.10 over entire dwelling unit.  It could get tricky
with a picky AHJ.  You don't have the reference to use small room rule for
area of sprinkler in 13R.  So, you may have to choose the larger k factor
residential sprinklers.  We typically do a 4.9k pendent, but you may have to
go to the larger ones depending on your requirements.


Travis Mack, SET
MFP Design, LLC
3356 E Vallejo Ct
Gilbert, AZ 85298
480-505-9271
fax: 866-430-6107
email:tm...@mfpdesign.com

http://www.mfpdesign.com
https://www.facebook.com/pages/MFP-Design-LLC/92218417692
Send large files to us via: https://www.hightail.com/u/MFPDesign 
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/travismack

"The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low
price is forgotten."

-----Original Message-----
From: Sprinklerforum <sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org> On
Behalf Of Reed A. Roisum, SET
Sent: Tuesday, March 6, 2018 8:38 AM
To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org
Subject: RE: Residential Sprinklers

Thank you.  New, but related question...the owner wants to install
institutional sprinklers in the dwelling units as they are concerned with
tampering and are willing to pay a premium.  The institutional sprinklers
(Tyco RAVEN) are QR but not residential (as far as I can tell).  So, based
on the reference John provided below, we could install up to four
institutional (QR) sprinklers per dwelling unit and the rest would need to
be residential sprinklers, correct?  And, we would need to design to 0.1
gpm/sq ft.



NFPA 13R, 2013 edition

6.2 Use of Sprinklers.

6.2.1 Inside Dwelling Units.

6.2.1.1 Listed residential sprinklers shall be used unless another type is
permitted by 6.2.1.3 or 6.2.1.4.

6.2.1.2 Residential sprinklers shall not be used on systems other than wet
pipe systems unless specifically listed for use on that particular type of
system.

6.2.1.3 Listed quick-response sprinklers shall be permitted to be installed
in dwelling units meeting the definition of a compartment, as defined in
Section 3.3, where no more than four sprinklers are located in the dwelling
unit.

6.2.1.3.1 Where quick-response sprinklers, including extended coverage
quick-response sprinklers, are used, the density/area requirement shall be a
minimum of 0.1 gpm/ft2 (4.1 mm/min)over the entire dwelling unit.

6.2.1.3.2 Where extended coverage quick-response sprinklers are used, the
flow shall be sufficient to meet the listing of the sprinklers at the
spacing for which they are being used.

6.2.1.4 Quick-response sprinklers discharging a minimum of 0.1 gpm/ft2 (4.1
mm/min) shall be permitted to be used in mechanical closets.







Reed A. Roisum, SET | Karges-Faulconbridge, Inc. | Senior Fire Protection
Designer | Fargo, ND | direct: 701.552.9903 | mobile: 701.388.1352 |
KFIengineers.com<http://www.kfiengineers.com>

-----Original Message-----
From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org]
On Behalf Of John Paulsen
Sent: Tuesday, March 6, 2018 8:22 AM
To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org
Subject: RE: Residential Sprinklers



Reed:



6.2.1.3  13R, 2016



John Paulsen - SET

Crown Fire System Design

6282 Seeds Rd.

Grove City, OH 43123

P - 614-782-2438

F - 614-782-2374

C - 614-348-8206







-----Original Message-----

From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org]
On Behalf Of Fpdcdesign

Sent: Tuesday, March 6, 2018 9:14 AM

To: Sprinklerforum
<sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org<mailto:sprinklerforum@lists.firespri
nkler.org>>

Subject: Re: Residential Sprinklers









Reed,



6.7.7.1.3. (2007). Carries through in later versions (as far as I looked). I
ran I. To a similar situation recently and we had to change to 13





 Todd G Williams, PE

Fire Protection Design/Consulting

Stonington, CT

860-535-2080 (ofc)

860-553-3553 (fax)

860-608-4559 (cell)











>

> On Mar 6, 2018 at 9:08 AM,  <SET Reed A. Roisum
(mailto:raroi...@kfi-eng.com)>  wrote:

>

>

>

>  Thanks Travis. Can you please point me to where it says that?

>

>

> Reed A. Roisum, SET | Karges-Faulconbridge, Inc. | Senior Fire

> Protection Designer | Fargo, ND | direct: 701.552.9903 | mobile:

> 701.388.1352 | http://www.kfiengineers.com

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: Sprinklerforum

> [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of

> MFP Design, LLC

> Sent: Monday, March 5, 2018 5:08 PM

> To: 
> sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org<mailto:sprinklerfo...@lists.fir
> esprinkler.org>

> Subject: RE: Residential Sprinklers

>

> You can only have a maximum of 4 QR sprinklers per dwelling unit, not just
compartment. If you need more than 4 standard spray sprinklers, you can't
comply with 13R.

>

>

> Travis Mack, SET

> MFP Design, LLC

> 3356 E Vallejo Ct

> Gilbert, AZ 85298

> 480-505-9271

> fax: 866-430-6107

> email:tm...@mfpdesign.com

>

> http://www.mfpdesign.com

> https://www.facebook.com/pages/MFP-Design-LLC/92218417692

> Send large files to us via: https://www.hightail.com/u/MFPDesign

> LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/travismack

>

> "The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low
price is forgotten."

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: Sprinklerforum  
> <sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org<mailto:sprinklerforum-
> boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org>>

> On Behalf Of Art Tiroly

> Sent: Monday, March 5, 2018 4:00 PM

> To: 
> sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org<mailto:sprinklerfo...@lists.fir
> esprinkler.org>

> Subject: RE: Residential Sprinklers

>

> Using 5.6K QR heads will change the hydraulic calculations and minimum
flows allowed by residential sprinklers.

>

>

> Art Tiroly

> ATCO Fire Protection/Tiroly

> 24400 Highland Rd CLE 44143

> 216-621-8899

> 216-570-7030 cell

>

>

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: Sprinklerforum

> [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org]

> On Behalf Of Reed A. Roisum, SET

> Sent: Monday, March 05, 2018 4:47 PM

> To: 
> sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org<mailto:sprinklerfo...@lists.fir
> esprinkler.org>

> Subject: Residential Sprinklers

>

> Are residential sprinklers required for dwelling units in NFPA 13R? It
appears as though they can be QR or residential in the 2012 IBC (903.3.2).

> For some reason I had in my mind that they needed to be residential within
the dwelling unit or sleeping unit??

>

> Thanks.

>

> Reed R.

>

> Reed A. Roisum, SET | Karges-Faulconbridge, Inc. | Senior Fire

> Protection Designer | Fargo, ND | direct: 701.552.9903 | mobile:

> 701.388.1352 | http://www.kfiengineers.com

>

>

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