Ron beat me to it – this is NOT your problem.   I’m assuming it’s an existing 
structure or a lightweight metal frame if new?  From a responsible charge 
perspective, I think you have to perform your due diligence and consider every 
reasonable option regarding type and spacing of hangers, then put that out 
there for the structural engineer of record to process.  The obvious way to 
attach a greater load to a structure with such limited point load capacity is 
to attach at multiple points.

What type of framing is this?


Steve Leyton

From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:[email protected]] On 
Behalf Of Ron Greenman via Sprinklerforum
Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2020 9:41 AM
To: [email protected]
Cc: Ron Greenman <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: Structural Load

And remember the building does not belong to you and it is NOT your 
responsibility to come up with a solution. The owner, via his representatives 
(the GC, the structural engineer, and ultimately, the architect) is responsible 
for building a code-compliant building that includes supporting any live or 
dead loads, including the sprinkler system. And I'm guessing that in California 
insufficient point loading for hanging would the least of your concerns 
regarding structure.



Ron Greenman

[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>

253.576.9700

The Universe is monstrously indifferent to the presence of man. -Werner Herzog, 
screenwriter, film director, author, actor and opera director (1942-)


On Wed, Jun 3, 2020 at 9:26 AM John Denhardt via Sprinklerforum 
<[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>>
 wrote:
I agree with Ken. I have been down this road before.  The structure needs to 
support the piping plus 250 pounds at the point of hanging.  If the structure 
can handle this load, then the structure has an issue.

Thanks,
John

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On Wed, Jun 3, 2020 at 12:18 PM Parsley Consulting via Sprinklerforum 
<[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>>
 wrote:
Jerry,

Although I'm slightly unclear over what you're being told I would make sure 
that whoever is providing that information to you has read 9.2.1.3.1 of the '16 
edition of -13:
9.2.1.3.1 Sprinkler piping shall be substantially supported from the building 
structure, which must support the added load of the water-filled pipe plus a 
minimum of 250 lb (115 kg) applied at the point of hanging, except where 
permitted by 9.2.1.1.2, 9.2.1.3.3, and 9.2.1.4.1
9.2.1.1.2 deals with toggle hangers supporting pipe 1½" and smaller, 9.2.1.3.3 
covers flexible hose fittings, and 9.2.1.4.1 covers branch hangers into a metal 
deck.

It's pretty clear that the structure has to be able to support at least the 
load noted in 9.2.1.3.1.

As I am a principal member of the hanging and bracing committee, please see the 
disclaimer below.

sincerely,
Ken Wagoner, SET
Parsley Consulting
350 West 9th Avenue, Suite 206
Escondido, California 92025
Phone 760-745-6181
Visit the website<http://www.parsleyconsulting.com/>

IMPORTANT NOTICE: This correspondence is not a Formal Interpretation issued 
pursuant to NFPA Regulations. Any opinion expressed is the personal opinion of 
the author and does not necessarily represent the official position of the NFPA 
or its Technical Committees. In addition, this correspondence is neither 
intended, nor should it be relied upon, to provide professional consultation or 
services

It should be noted that the above is my opinion as a member of the NFPA 
Automatic Sprinkler System Hanging and Bracing Committee in accordance with the 
NFPA Regulations Governing Committee Projects and should therefore not be 
considered, nor relied upon, as the official position of the NFPA or its 
Committees


On 06/03/2020 8:25 AM, Jerry Van Kolken via Sprinklerforum wrote:
I have a building where they are telling me the structural point loading on the 
framing less than 250lbs. (140lbs)

Advice?

Jerry Van Kolken
Millennium Fire Protection Corp.
2950 San Luis Rey Rd.
Oceanside, CA 92058
(760) 722-2722 FX 722-2730



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