Bruce thanks for sharing. This was an interesting story and I appreciate the extra details.
Ben On Thu, Jun 4, 2020 at 1:10 PM BRUCE VERHEI via Sprinklerforum < [email protected]> wrote: > I’ve seen what about 50 of these stored, on side in a non-sprinklered > building can do, after fire. Furniture store, just opened up for day. Units > behind a partial height storeroom wall. Old CMU, timber truss auto sales > bldg from 1920’s. About 120’ x 100’. At first whiff of smoke the evacuated. > In moments could see flame and dark smoke above partition to ceiling. Owner > made call to Fire from pvt office on opposite side of building. When he got > off phone he had to climb out window. Not even as big as normal bathroom > window. He must have been fairly slim. HQ fire station half a block away. > They went out door, kitty corner then wrong way on one way street, did a > unique to me reverse hose lay.* Two lanes, with parking spots on both > sides, not heavily occupied at 0830. Roomate-FF got light moderate 2nd > degree burns on lt. shoulder- partial back as he hunched across street > with 2 1/2” waiting for water. > > For years you could see where the tar burned out out the asphalt on side > of road crown towards fire building. > > I know wire glass seems to have gone out of style. In this intense fire > several small panes in building across 10’ alley crazed and held. > > Roomate missed several weeks before cleared for work. > > Olympia Fire got one mattress and borrowed a video camera. The guy holds a > burning tissue until it burns to fingers, turns, and says it didn’t light. > Behind him you can see 4”, then 12”, the full height flame. They wrecked > their office wall clock they’d set up in field of view, but saved the > camera. Expensive back then. Changed minds of those who thought a full > Gerry can of gasoline must have been poured in window off alley. > > As you have gathered over the years I am a big spk’s believer. Am rather > proud of having reviewed or field inspected install of ca 1m heads. Maybe > with today’s high k-factor hds. Old 1/2” hds at 16-18’ AFF? I’m skeptical > fire outcome would have been much different. > > Still can hear Oly Fire Asst/Ch saying Temporarily Solidified, Highly > Volatile Petrochemicals when describing the foam mattress they’d burned. > > Best. > > Bruce Verhei > > * Not spk’s. Firefighters might find of historical interest. 4 & 5” single > jacket hose with working pressures that would be useful to fire haven’t > always been available. Olympia Fire had a hose load common in Seattle > Fire’s sphere of influence. Two by 2 1/2” beds, about 600’ each. One bed of > 3 1/2”, 600’, 3 1/2” x 2 1/2” x 2 1/2” x 2 1/2” distributor (Half Hanson), > with 2 x 2 1/2” 50’ leads. Carry 2 x 2 1/2 x 100’ slot loads with nozzles. > We had same configuration on a Seattle spec Kenworth. Oly had American > LaFrance. > > Oly Fire stopped at one corner of building, laid a 2 1/2” from reverse > bed, to cover one corner and alley exposure, forward to mid-store, 3 1/2 > and portable monitor, forward to next corner, fwd 2 1/2” with nozzle. > Enough working line for FF to advance past bldg to cover far corner and > alley at other corner of bldg. End up with monitor into front of building. > 2 1/2”’s covering opposite exposuresand into building at opposite corners > of building off different streets at this large, corner building. Engine > reversed out to hydrant so > ‘Oly Fire didn’t burn the paint and plastic off Engine O-12. The single > company hose evolution impressed me. 40 years later I think it still does. > > With 2 x 2 1/2” lines at about and 2” solid bore master stream right > from start roof still burned off. Exposure businesses all closed for day, > but back open Monday. > > Moral of story. Go with biggest line you are going to use as your first > line, always. > > Later engines supplied two trucks’ master streams as heavy car deck roof > burned through. > > bv > > On June 4, 2020 at 11:20 AM John Denhardt via Sprinklerforum < > [email protected]> wrote: > > As others have already stated, exposed expanded, Group A, Table > A.20.4.5.1. Depending on the storage height, Table 4.3.1.7.1 might be > applicable. > > References are to the 2019 edition of NFPA 13. > > Thanks, > John > > John August Denhardt, PE > *Vice President, Engineering and Technical Services* > > *American Fire Sprinkler Association* > m: p: 301-343-1457 > 214-349-5965 ext 121 > w: firesprinkler.org > <https://www.facebook.com/firesprinkler.org/> > <https://twitter.com/afsa/status/1039528345367732224> > <https://www.linkedin.com/company/american-fire-sprinkler-association-afsa-/> > <https://www.instagram.com/firesprinklerorg/> > > *HelpAFSA “Sound the Alarm” about sprinklers!* > > AFSA’s charitable partner the American Red Cross is educating millions > through its Home Fire Preparedness Campaign. Help us support the inclusion > of fire sprinklers in their messaging. Donate today! > <https://www.redcross.org/donate/cm/afsa-pub.html/> > > > On Thu, Jun 4, 2020 at 10:07 AM Kyle.Montgomery via Sprinklerforum < > [email protected]> wrote: > > Todd: I wonder how the compressed foam mattresses behave when the box > burns away? > > > > FM Global Engineer: … (comes to startling realization) … Mother of God… > > > > > > This had me chuckling. You’ve piqued my curiosity. Maybe we should start a > ‘Go Fund Me’ for full scale fire testing of compressed foam mattresses. > > > > -Kyle M > > > > *From:* Sprinklerforum <[email protected]> *On > Behalf Of *Fpdcdesign via Sprinklerforum > *Sent:* Thursday, June 4, 2020 6:44 AM > *To:* Sprinklerforum <[email protected]> > *Cc:* Fpdcdesign <[email protected]>; Matt Grise <[email protected]> > *Subject:* [EXTERNAL] Re: mattress storage > > > > I am actually working on a foam mattress manufacturer right now. Expanded > Group A plastic. You would have to check if they are exposed or in > cardboard boxes. Some mattresses are compressed and put into boxes. I’m not > sure how a compressed foam mattress would behave in a fire situation when > the box burns away. Ceiling height plays a big role in design requirements. > > > Todd G Williams, PE > > Fire Protection Design/Consulting > > Stonington, CT > > 860-535-2080 (ofc) > > 860-554-7054 (fax) > > 860-608-4559 (cell) > > > > > > > On Jun 4, 2020 at 9:33 AM, <Matt Grise via Sprinklerforum > <[email protected]>> wrote: > > Group A (not 1) > > > > Matt > > > > > > *From:* Sprinklerforum <[email protected]> *On > Behalf Of *Matt Grise via Sprinklerforum > *Sent:* Thursday, June 04, 2020 8:32 AM > *To:* [email protected] > *Cc:* Matt Grise <[email protected]> > *Subject:* RE: mattress storage > > > > Usually exposed, expanded group 1 plastic. NFPA 13 and FM have some > protection criteria. > > > > Matt > > > > *From:* Sprinklerforum <[email protected]> *On > Behalf Of *Trillium Fire Sprinkler Design Inc. via Sprinklerforum > *Sent:* Thursday, June 04, 2020 8:00 AM > *To:* [email protected] > *Cc:* Trillium Fire Sprinkler Design Inc. <[email protected]> > *Subject:* mattress storage > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I need opinions on mattress storage warehouse in furniture store. I have a > furniture store with a 8000sqft storage area with mattresses stacked on the > floor to a maximum height of 12 feet. > > > > Mostly foam mattresses. > > > > Any idea where I would start to look for the design criteria? > > > > Any guidance would be appreciated. > > > > > > Troy > > _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing > list [email protected] > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org > > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org > > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org > > > > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org > -- Benjamin Young
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