Just out of curiosity - is there a need for a code requirement? Is someone arguing that the flush flow should not be included? What is their argument?
Matt -----Original Message----- From: Sprinklerforum <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Kevin Hall via Sprinklerforum Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2020 11:55 AM To: [email protected] Cc: Kevin Hall <[email protected]> Subject: Re: Code requiring inclusion of possible concurrent flow Section 9.3.2 was added in the 2019 edition of NFPA 13R and could apply to the demand in addition to the design sprinklers: *9.3.1 For systems with common domestic/fire mains serving more than one dwelling unit, domestic demand for the building being calculated shall be included as part of the overall system demand unless provisions are made to prevent the domestic waterflow on sprinkler system activation.* The 2019 edition of NFPA 13 has language that may also be applicable: *5.1.3.3 Where a single main less than 4 in. (100 mm) in diameter serves both fire systems and other uses, the non-fire demand shall be added to the hydraulic calculations for the fire system at the point of connection unless provisions have been made to automatically isolate the non-fire demand during a fire event.* It would be the owner's or owner's agent's (engineer of record) responsibility to make any applicable water supply adjustments per Section 4.2. Kevin Hall, P.E., MSFPE *Coordinator, Engineering and Technical Services* *American Fire Sprinkler Association* p: 214-349-5971 w: https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2ffiresprinkler.org&c=E,1,wbgTYHloiNxiWDn7-NSKarSa62rx2UW6IoPm_4deb2WA3KYBcBmqGLVP_MhWkvzwTnkMTZSi_Ww33t_lNm4Sjhb60la0g3vFbXWZNOS6fWUy&typo=1 <https://www.facebook.com/firesprinkler.org/> <https://twitter.com/afsa/status/1039528345367732224> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/american-fire-sprinkler-association-afsa-/> <https://www.instagram.com/firesprinklerorg/> *AFSA Summer Sale!* For a limited time only, AFSA is offering members up to 50% off its on-demand recorded webinars! Featuring the most sought-after thought leaders, AFSA On-Demand offers a superior learning experience with ability to earn CEU and CPD credits anytime, anywhere. Visit https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2fwww.firesprinkler.org%2fondemand&c=E,1,5LQxIcYcZko4KclCK-5cAlLTbByUKkDDYMNbLKvDMz7jZtX08fLey0c8aHCJC9fRG-zfrKfAp47HJOPdY-0PPBUWa8IlRjC9UBU4cSAbgNPkUuDcraOj&typo=1 to learn more. On Thu, Sep 10, 2020 at 12:28 PM Hinson, Ryan via Sprinklerforum < [email protected]> wrote: > We have run into a dock FW system design where multiple automatic > flushing valves are being provided on the system to prevent freezing > by automatically flowing water at temps below 40°F to the order of 300 gpm. > Though this flow should absolutely be included in the system demand > flow, I am having difficulty finding code direction requiring its > inclusion in hydraulic demands other than where NFPA 13R systems may > have to account for concurrent domestic flows. > > Any code sections come to mind? > > Ryan L. Hinson, PE*, SET** \ Burns & McDonnell Senior Fire > Protection Engineer, Fire Protection Engineering Group O 952-656-3662 > \ M 763-688-4045 \ F 952-229-2923 > [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> \ > https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=https%3a%2f%2fburnsmcd.com&c=E,1 > ,ZpBEidnKG9tOXc2OTKNbxlh80x-PILXlw8nAuFRIlnar8jKYHisGc0dqXch_1o4KV6knf > oIPDhIAhnwIL93BUiETBIn3Q4vB_9kvGjeFlC0D5lmiAZAZvftsarGu&typo=1< > https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2fwww.burnsmcd.com%2f > &c=E,1,3fUZpdbznKKM-n3MA6QF5FU7QVLPx3MGDe-ZbtXxBYLD0EsYAu5WdsVMW9WVm00 > 7FkW7kQKl1n1HTXRjjfQYpBKKnhCD_-z8u6SSBX_Qao3eR0xfv9R1PFXTgg,,&typo=1> > 8201 Norman Center Drive, Suite 500 \ Minneapolis-St. Paul, MN 55437 > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > > https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2flists.firesprinkler > .org%2flistinfo.cgi%2fsprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org&c=E,1,QLLQKJcFm > dZINEDYCz8Bc0jptph0H9zOfU4puWQ8nnYA4solenjKjRmrqw4TZxNmea2rAKiiv8lI0gW > 95tAzqJYkvZHwN1vTJJKeGmjzLEirHkA,&typo=1 > _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] https://linkprotect.cudasvc.com/url?a=http%3a%2f%2flists.firesprinkler.org%2flistinfo.cgi%2fsprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org&c=E,1,U81m2mCV1SusNS_u4crFHzd1lTv3TLTjInbi6sSSsg43uA03ON0PU-vX_yY7Y6bBMxSYSSmDMEFKzuUaa2uVesrfvej9kCq-hQ8Q3bjqzQ,,&typo=1 _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
