No one 'perceives' you as a grumpy old guy Steve...we all know you're one...
Cary Webber CFPS Director, Technical Services Reliable Automatic Sprinkler Co., Inc. 1470 Smith Grove Road, Liberty, SC 29657 Tel: 864-843-5161 -----Original Message----- From: Sprinklerforum <sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org> On Behalf Of Steve Leyton via Sprinklerforum Sent: Thursday, April 1, 2021 4:30 PM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Cc: Steve Leyton <st...@protectiondesign.com> Subject: RE: Head or Not? CAUTION: This email originated from outside of the organization. Do not click links or open attachments unless you can confirm the sender and know the content is safe. At the risk of being perceived as a grumpy old guy, I must nonetheless point out that per the NFPA Manual of Style and definitions found in NFPA 13, there is no such thing as a Sprinkler Head. They are "sprinklers". The term head is only officially used in the context of measuring pressure and its definition (with permutations) can be found in NFPA 20 but it's not in the 13s. The correct subject heading for this thread should be "Sprinkler or Not?" Yeah, yeah, I know... going back under my rock now but GC is giving me a high five. SML -----Original Message----- From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Mike Morey via Sprinklerforum Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2021 6:52 AM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Cc: Mike Morey <mmo...@shambaugh.com> Subject: RE: Head or Not? If the soffit is 3' wide then none of the obstructions against the wall allowances apply, you would have to either meet the requirements of table 8.6.5.1.2 or add a head under it. The counter top either has floor under it, or has cabinets under it, in the case of cabinets while you don't protect inside them, you still have to have coverage to the wall behind per 8.5.3.2.3. Mike Morey CFPS 3229 . NICET S.E.T. 123677 Project Manager . Fire Protection Group Shambaugh & Son, LP an EMCOR Company 7614 Opportunity Drive . Fort Wayne, IN . 46825 direct 260.487.7824 / cell 260.417.0625 / fax 260.487.7991 email mmo...@shambaugh.com -----Original Message----- From: Sprinklerforum <sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org> On Behalf Of Brian Harris via Sprinklerforum Sent: Thursday, April 1, 2021 9:43 AM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Cc: Brian Harris <bhar...@bvssystemsinc.com> Subject: RE: Head or Not? BE ADVISED - This email originated outside EMCOR. I could have been clearer. The reason I asked is the soffit is 3'-0" wide but is over a counter top and I was wondering if that makes a difference whether a head is needed as I was taught years ago that "we protect floor space".... Brian Harris, CET BVS Systems Inc. https://nam12.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Furldefense.com%2Fv3%2F__http%3A%2F%2Fbvssytemsinc.com__%3B!!FaxH778!Kkt4x4aQk2Fa19sQ70N9lD68vowUmt5VglBb6FHymfYeeU1kMd8H6_RjiffOP-rA%24&data=04%7C01%7Ccwebber%40reliablesprinkler.com%7C80400c02cef848f3984c08d8f54d02a2%7C361f92efbca442cdaf0d8099acee2244%7C0%7C0%7C637529058404414297%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=iZO2h9rCAAsSkbuKT3SO3sz32z5JE5QWtXnGSBNHr3o%3D&reserved=0 -----Original Message----- From: Sprinklerforum <sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org> On Behalf Of Cary Webber via Sprinklerforum Sent: Thursday, April 01, 2021 9:32 AM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Cc: Cary Webber <cweb...@reliablesprinkler.com> Subject: RE: Head or Not? In the absence of language about what that obstruction is, and what might be below it, it seems clear the intent is to allow omission of protection below. Cary Webber CFPS Director, Technical Services Reliable Automatic Sprinkler Co., Inc. 1470 Smith Grove Road, Liberty, SC 29657 Tel: 864-843-5161 -----Original Message----- From: Sprinklerforum <sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org> On Behalf Of Brian Harris via Sprinklerforum Sent: Thursday, April 1, 2021 9:20 AM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Cc: Brian Harris <bhar...@bvssystemsinc.com> Subject: Head or Not? CAUTION: This email originated from outside of the organization. Do not click links or open attachments unless you can confirm the sender and know the content is safe. NFPA-13 (2013) Figure 8.6.5.1.2(c) Would a head be required under the soffit if the soffit is over a counter? Floor space is protected from heads at the deck. Brian Harris, CET BVS Systems Inc. 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