Migrating to PyQt solves problems only for GPLed products, otherwise you need to pay license fees for non-GPLed version of the binding on Windows. Continuum is a parasite in Spyder ecosystem, because they deliver stuff made by others without contributing back. Although they donate to NumFocus, which lists Spyder among list of its projects, I don't really know how NumFocus really helps Spyder. So despite all marketing buzz, money don't work here. If there are bugs in PySide, they should be at least reported so that people had a chance to fix them. Continuum could raise awareness that open source projects that it delivers also need bugfixes and contributions. But they don't do this in their marketing materials. They use and promote, get attention and resources, but then they prefer to hide the issues. Why hide? Because people perceive that Continuum plays a major role in the ecosystem and if they can not handle the issues, the image will be hurt and market share will fade. That's just an assumption. I am not saying that they should pay everybody, but they the only company that can choose how they deal with things, and who pretends to do analytics well, so I believe that they definitely could find an alternative way to settle things in a way that is beneficial for all agents.
As a consequence of Continuum action, therefore visibility of the actual problems with PySide becomes even lower. There are little chances that issues in PySide are be fixed if companies that use them continue to ignore the fact that project need maintainers and skilled people to tackle stuff on C++ level. They prefer that "somebody else" will fix issues automagically. And it happens. If people feel that this is important. But Continuum doesn't even do this. What message this Anaconda 2.0 release conveys? "Spyder is cool, we are delivering it, but PySide is a pain in the ass, so we turn it off". PySide is an awesome project, but it requires some support too, and who if not commercial vendors (who own developers) should think about how to solve this problem, then who? The message could be "damn, the PySide brings us down, there are multiple issues with .., .. and .., which can be improved like .., ..". This is what I expect from guys, who are not parasites. I am not a user of conda, Numba and Blaze, but I am the one who picked up Spyder in early days and learned Qt with its code, so its code is already in my head, and even though I am not active now it is still damn sad to see that people are unable to do anything bigger than just "use" the software instead of trying to improve it for everybody. You know, when you're contributing to open source that is done under non-restrictive license, you do so because you value the effort that was made so far by these people to bring this stuff live for all us to use, and you just try to pay back improving it a little for everybody. But now people are just taking the existence of such things for granted, or they just don't feel capable, or corporate environment denies their "resources" from "wasting" time on doing this. In any case this a sign of regress. People are reinventing bicycles instead of trying to improve existing things and this is a waste of time on a global scale. Maybe my expectations for scientific company are too high, but if not them, who else can do anything? Big business is not interested, because they need to see money, not to "increase waste" to feed 85% of their loyal workers who are "not providing any significant value". I hoped that Continuum is different and tries at least explore what is this new "knowledge economy" buzzword is about. I've heard that Europe promoted it as our future. But if awesome open source projects like PySide are dying, I don't see any hope for open science or anything open at all. On Sun, Sep 7, 2014 at 11:40 PM, Ronan Paixão <[email protected]> wrote: > I don't understand why you're so upset. First of all, Anaconda 2.0 was not > released now, but in may. Then, what I found out is that Spyder was one of > the applications that weren't playing nicely with PySide. Migrating did > solve most of my problems by migrating to PyQt. Besides, it just changed the > default Qt package and PySide is still available through conda. > > Also, I don't think that Continuum is "just another parasite". It's making > Blaze (though on the shoulders of NumPy, but with parallel in mind), conda > and Numba. Although the Pro versions are paid, just releasing some of that > as open source seems to me like "non-parasite". > > > 2014-09-07 0:25 GMT-03:00 anatoly techtonik <[email protected]>: >> >> ...PyQt is now the default Qt binding, as some users were experiencing >> stability problems >> with spyder... >> http://continuum.io/blog/anaconda-2-released >> >> I feel like claims that Anaconda is completely free now are false >> https://store.continuum.io/cshop/anaconda/ >> >> Why am I upset about it? With so much buzz and marketing power that >> Continuum >> delivers, I expected guys to be active somehow in the open source part of >> the ecosystem >> and pay attention at the values of the project that are not only at the >> top of their IDE list >> http://docs.continuum.io/anaconda/ide_integration.html >> but also important enough to break dozens (hundreds?) internal >> application. That's why a >> major version change. >> >> I am not saying that everybody here wants non-restricted Qt bindings on >> Windows. People >> usually don't care, but after MS killed Nokia, so that there is no PySide >> team anymore, >> I'd expect a company like Continuum to be able to calculate the impact >> made and provide >> at least some support value back to PySide project. Reporting bugs at >> minimum. >> >> It is just my personal rant, but... >> Getting the best out of open source projects, wrapping them in package and >> marketing it >> at a conferences. This is not what you expect from a scientific company >> that holds the >> keys to open source, algorithms and processing. You expect them to be on a >> edge of >> researching the economy, the system that powers it - the ecosystem - to >> make sure that >> useful agents survive, not die. You expect them to be leaders that explain >> the trends, how >> the stuff works, to provide some hope for this darkness. And what you see >> from the >> ecosystem point of view? Just another parasite trying to survive in this >> "economy". >> >> Just to make clean about the matter. I am sitting right now trying to code >> some stuff for >> the money that will be plenty enough for food or buying new clothes, I see >> people quitting >> social science, biology, neural networks labs just to earn cash and write >> dumb >> games or join outsourcing business (because, well, it is boring for US >> developers to write >> and maintain code for their own products). My "quality of life" directly >> depends on the >> amount of people involved in research jobs, because I hope that one day it >> will be possible >> to find a solution for my personal issue. Hoped. If money always kills the >> game, it is >> pointless for me to continue in the open source race, because I will never >> be able to >> afford the costs of the outcome as I am not as smart as others to earn >> some. >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "spyder" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected]. >> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/spyderlib. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to a topic in the > Google Groups "spyder" group. > To unsubscribe from this topic, visit > https://groups.google.com/d/topic/spyderlib/gZLrhwUGRHk/unsubscribe. > To unsubscribe from this group and all its topics, send an email to > [email protected]. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/spyderlib. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. -- anatoly t. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "spyder" group. 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