Ta, ED. I especially like this part:
"...which also fines people if their mobile phones ring,..."
http://www.guardian.co.uk/smoking/Story/0,2763,1242520,00.html
If a St. Paul smoking ban compromise includes this AND not using phones at
all, I'm on board.
While on the subject of civilization and socialization,, I heard a story
today of a group of thirteen 14 & 15 year-olds who took a coach trip across
country last week. Nearly all of them had cell phones and/or iPods so
either talked to someone remotely or played games by themselves for two
days. Each way. Really a good way to get to know your neighbor/traveling
companion...
AMH
Andrew M. Hine
Corporate Research Materials Laboratory
3M Center 201-1W-28
St. Paul MN
55144-1000
USA
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: (651) 733-1070
Fax: (651) 737-5335
Lab 201-W110
Elizabeth
Dickinson To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
<[EMAIL PROTECTED] cc:
pring.com> Subject: [StPaul] Smoking Ban in
Cambridge, England?
Sent by:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
orum.org
06/19/2004 09:05
AM
I was amused to receive this from an English friend (he didn't send the
link...) Here are some excerpts. Particularly that a barman thinks a ban
would increase "illiberality"...Drinking, politics, or both?
Elizabeth Dickinson
West Side
Students see light but locals fired up by smoking ban plan
Cambridge could follow Dublin's lead to become a "smoke-free" city, but
there will be fierce opposition
John Vidal and Menka Parekh
Saturday June 19, 2004
The Guardian
There's barely a fag end in the ashtrays of the huge Wetherspoon pub in
Cambridge. A handful of well-scrubbed students in rented tuxedos and
tent-sized dresses sip gin and tonics before a college ball, a few office
workers down lagers, but no one smokes a cigarette - of any kind.
Three hundred yards away, down butt-less streets past smoke-free bars,
there
is little evidence that central Cambridge inhales much more than car fumes.
There are a few filters in the doorway of the Sedgwick Museum of Earth
Sciences, a couple of discarded rollups by the bicycles at King's College,
and a Benson pack in the gutter outside the history and philosophy of
science department. But that's about it.
Central Cambridge, it would seem, should have no problems becoming
Britain's
first 'smoke-free' city. Yesterday the local NHS, not waiting for central
government to hand out new targets, said that it intended all restaurants,
pubs, bars, workplaces and clubs, as well as the myriad university
buildings, to voluntarily ban smoking within five years.
"It has been agreed with the local authority, but we won't be imposing
bans", said Sue Smith, a spokeswoman for Cambridge primary care trust. "Our
priority will be workplaces, to get them to introduce smoke-free policies.
We want to provide an environment where no one is involuntarily exposed to
second-hand smoke. We aspire to get to where Dublin is now, but the city
must decide for itself."
Manchester and Birmingham are adopting similar policies, but it is thought
that relatively affluent Cambridge, with a population of highly educated
university people, stands a good chance of success.
But the city and the NHS may meet opposition. According to Yuli, a Japanese
economics student drinking - and smoking - in the Eagle, certain groups
will
be hard to crack. "A lot of philosophers smoke. It's the done thing after a
lecture. Philosophy is that kind of subject."
She says that Cambridge, like her, could turn to Plato rather than the NHS
for help in quitting. "Plato said that all vice was irrational, so if you
are rational you won't do bad things. I don't believe you can be rational
and do something that clearly damages you." She admits to not being
entirely
rational.
But her friend, Lucas, a London University history student, says that
rationality has nothing to do with it. He believes students will always
smoke because it is a social disease linked to pleasure and stress. He
needs
a cigarette to work out how to crash the St John's College ball (in a punt
and over a couple of wall his considered choice).
But Tom, a Lib Dem economist striding past King's with cigarette in fist on
his way to the Peterhouse College political society dinner, thinks
Cambridge
will have little problem quitting. "Everyone is far too nice to smoke here.
They're all so damn middle class and prim and proper here. Mummy and Daddy
really wouldn't like them to start, so they don't," he says. "This is
confirmed by a gang of eight students from Christ's, none of whom have ever
smoked. "We had a kind of vote in college to ban it. No one opposed it,"
says one.
The city does have a serious smoking problem, however. The latest figures
from the General Household Survey suggest that nationwide at least 26% of
people smoke regularly and that women are now smoking more and younger.
Cambridge, says the city's primary health care trust, is pretty average -
and that means smoking is by far the biggest cause of preventable
death."Our
job is to help smokers quit," says Ms Smith, who accepts that there is a
link between smoking and poverty.
The prospect of a ban worries Catherine Dixon, landlady of Champion of the
Thames pub, where many regulars smoke. She has been watching developments
in
Ireland and the lengths some bars are going to keep their smokers, such as
taking out windows or parking buses outside.
A ban would not achieve much, would be hypocritical and just increase
illiberality, says Lawrence, a barman. "People will always find a way to
smoke if they really want. What about the pollution in the streets? We can
barely breathe in Cambridge in the summer," he says.
But for hardcore smokers, the NHS will have to tackle the Ship Inn on the
Arbury estate in one of Cambridge's poorest areas. "Everyone smokes here.
Banning smoking may break the habit of having a cigarette with your beer.
But it won't make you quit," says one man who sells cheap cigarettes from
Portugal but does not offer his name.
"It'd kill us if we had a ban here. We would never go out," says Julie, a
heavy smoker who would like to quit but does not want a ban. "What I've
noticed is that smokers stick together. They also seem to enjoy life a lot
more. Probably the risk."
"Wouldn't it be great to live in a world where nobody smoked?" says Powis,
whose girlfriend died of cancer.
"But we do smoke, and we should have the freedom to. The solution is to
have
lots more pubs that have no smoking policies. Then people can have a
choice,
rather than be told what to do!"
Cambridge has two smoke-free pubs, both of which report good business.
Customers at The Cambridge Blue, which also fines people if their mobile
phones ring, says it avoids lager louts. "People become polite and
attractive when they stop smoking", says Michael, a flute player. "A
smoking
ban would work just like the seatbelt one. A few addicts would complain but
it would quickly become normal."
At which point his friend, George, dashes into the street and lights up.
_____________________________________________
NEW ADDRESS FOR LIST: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To subscribe, modify subscription, or get your password - visit:
http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/listinfo/stpaul
Archive Address:
http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/private/stpaul/
_____________________________________________
NEW ADDRESS FOR LIST: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To subscribe, modify subscription, or get your password - visit:
http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/listinfo/stpaul
Archive Address:
http://www.mnforum.org/mailman/private/stpaul/
