I read the list this morning and read 20 messages about too much traffic and then read 30+ messages that were either labelled OT (which I assume stands for off-topic) and messages like this, which are interesting but have absolutely nothing to do with Struts. This isn't a poolman, expresso, EJB list, this is a Struts list. Talking about the others where they deal with Struts is OK. If people think there is too much traffic on this list, they can stop discussing off-topic things. I bet the traffic would go down 25%.
My 2 cents Jay On Wed, 13 Feb 2002, Keith wrote: > rage on! I want java to survive .net. > If people use too much technology or over eloborate designs, their systems get > expensive to write & hard to maintain & then it looks like java is not good. > When I see the posts by people using frames I am pleased I avoid them. > One of my aims is to write systems that a beginner can read & a junior can > maintain. > > As for EJB's - oops I may start to rant! > I write a business logic class to a standard design pattern, it can be called > from a Swing app or a struts Action. > If I want to call it from a remote server or it needs to participate in a > distributed transaction it should take only a few hours to write > a wrapper around it to make it an EJB session bean. It needs to receive/return > it's parameters as value objects (to save repeated calls acoss the network). > But like 98% of systems I have no such requirement - so no EJB's - for now. > So what's the big deal about them - can't most of us can remain blissfully > ignorant of them? > > Personally I'd like to see that b^%&$� PetStore written in 3 ways - > 1 - As a pet store would actually want it (Small scale architecture) > 2 - Mid scale > 3 - Monster scale. > And if we are really lucky No 1 write run nearly as fast as the .net version!! > > --- stf <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > ok, the link is rather old, and maybe also a bit dogmatic: But most of it > > still holds true. Apart from the usability-hassles described in the link, in > > my experience you can add a bunch of problems you get when you try to > > generate your frames programmatically (the simplest one being the > > requirement to generate a link to the preceding "page"(whatever that means > > when you use frames) that also had to work when javascript is deactivated - > > the history.back() at last works halfway consistent for almost all browsers, > > but it took them a while...) - then you have the problem with deep-links > > into the site (you almost always end up with an xml-file that contains the > > complete site-layout and from which you can generate right frameset - almost > > always buggy and hard to maintain...), synching data in different frames > > (using an equally bad mixture of javascript/sevlet-code...). There are some > > applications out there which almost all have to something with configuration > > (configuring a new car, a new pc and so on) which make heavy use of > > javascript and frames to maintain the state of the configuration: Although > > i agree that there almost always a whole lot of data flows from and to the > > browser, which can/should be cached in frames, in reality these > > configrurators almost always seem to be crashing short before purchasing > > your new car, which took you about an hour to configure... > > > > so, no, i don't see any real reason for using frames for other things than > > doing some static designer-portfolio-pages (but i think they are currently > > overusing flash for this purpose...) > > > > ps: excuse me for this elaborate rage, but i have been burnt before in > > projects where i was forced to use frames.... > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Keith" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > To: "Struts Users Mailing List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Sent: Wednesday, February 13, 2002 10:25 AM > > Subject: Re: App Design > > > > > > > > > > Is there a good argument for using frames? It needs to be good, they > > obviously > > > are problematic to use. > > > Beware the page linked to below is dated Dec. 1996 - most of what's in it > > is > > > obsolete! > > > > > > --- stf <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > frames suck: I don't think it's a good idea to separate your page-flow > > onto > > > > two different layers, one being the javscript/frame-constellation, the > > other > > > > the struts config-files. What exactly are you trying to achive? If you > > just > > > > want to reuse your navigation, then go for some kind of > > template-engine(e.g. > > > > tiles, even simple, maybe parametrized includes will be better than > > > > frames..) - if you have a designer, who insists, that frames are more > > > > "usable" or just look better, have him read this: > > > > http://www.useit.com/alertbox/9612.html - it's already so old that i > > > > thought, everybody knows it by now ;) > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2002 9:10 PM > > > > Subject: App Design > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi all, > > > > > I am thinking of structuring an application as follows, > > and > > > > > would appreciate any advice and ideas of how to do this: > > > > > > > > > > There will be two frames. First is a navigation frame where the user > > > > > presses a button to determine the JSP that is loaded into the second > > > > frame. > > > > > Each possible JSP for the second frame will have form. If a user is > > > > > entering data into the form, and then presses a button on the > > navigation > > > > > frame to go to a different jsp/form, I want to save the partially > > entered > > > > > form data from the page the user is leaving. Then when the user goes > > back > > > > > to the first page they can continue where they left off. > > > > > > > > > > I have been prototyping an idea; the navigation frame uses JavaScript > > to > > > > > submit the form and redirect the old page to the new desired page. So > > far > > > > > I have accomplished that when the form is submitted the action does > > not > > > > > really do anything, so the form data is saved in the bean. But how do > > I > > > > > accomplish the redirect? > > > > > > > > > > Any ideas are greatly appreciated. > > > > > Mark Glatzer > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > **************************************************************************** > > > > *** > > > > > <<Disclaimer>> > > > > > > > > > > This message is intended only for the use of the Addressee and > > > > > may contain information that is PRIVILEGED and/or > > > > > CONFIDENTIAL or both. > > > > > > > > > > This email is intended only for the personal and confidential use > > > > > of the recipient(s) named above. > > > > > > > > > > If the reader of this email is not an intended recipient, you have > > > > > received this email in error and any review, dissemination, > > > > > distribution or copying is strictly prohibited. > > > > > > > > > > If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender > > > > > immediately by return mail and permanently deleting the copy > > > > > you received. > > > > > > > > > > Thank you. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > **************************************************************************** > > > > *** > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > > > > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: > > > > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: > > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > For additional commands, e-mail: > > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > > > > > > > > > > __________________________________________________ > > > Do You Yahoo!? > > > Send FREE Valentine eCards with Yahoo! 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