On Fri, 2003-03-28 at 13:34, Sterin, Ilya wrote: > Not sure about why all are ranting about this economy, but there are more > than enough jobs available in IT. It's qualifications what set the ones > with a job apart from the ones without. There are still over 100,000 > reported unfilled jobs in the IT sector, as well as if you go to > monster.com, jobs.perl.org, and many other sites, you'll see daily postings > of jobs. So there are jobs, I guess the question is whether the developers > we are speaking of are qualified for those jobs.
Oh, well that must explain why I can't find a job in Atlanta. I'm not qualified....I see. > > Ilya > > -----Original Message----- > From: apachep2 > To: 'Struts Users Mailing List' > Sent: 3/28/03 7:50 AM > Subject: RE: [OT] Contract Work: Going Rate? > > Have you guys ever think of a situation, when a developer loses his job > for a while, he will take whatever contract it is and being paid > whatever the employer will offer? In this economy condition, supply of > developers always exceeds demanding. I see seniors applying for an entry > level job. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Sterin, Ilya [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: March 28, 2003 9:04 AM > To: 'Andrew Hill '; 'Struts Users Mailing List ' > Subject: RE: [OT] Contract Work: Going Rate? > > I'm still not understanding why you are having problems believing those > rates? > > Here, an average IT employee salary for full time staff employee, is > $30+/hour. An employer, spends about another 20% on benefits, madical, > dental, etc... So the employer, really faces about a $36-$40 average > expense on an employee. Now, if this contract is say 1 year or less, > then > there is a drawback of having someone stay, when they are not needed > after > the work is done. > > Now, $40 dollars, is just per employee expense. Now, each employer has > to > pay FICA tax, for each on staff employee, which is about 15% more. So > now > were are up to about the $50 round about figure per hour. Lets see, > then > there is office expenses, etc... so the figure is getting higher and > higher > and that's just the average. > > Now, an average rate for a contractor is about $50, which actually saves > the > company money, for outsourcing it, then also allows them to only be > billed > for hours as needed, so if one week there is a break, and no work is > done, > there is no bill, at least some of the time, since as we know, > consultants > always find ways to bill:-) > > Now, getting to higher figures of say $75/hour-$150/hour, those are > usually > for expert consultants. Say, I know people who've written books on the > subject, and they have the credibility to charge that much, etc... Also > past experience, thorough knowledge of technology, being a core team > developer of this particular technology or similar ranking. Also, most > of > those rates are for shorter term projects. > > I hope this helps you understand this a bit better. An averag > McDonald's > employee is costing the company about $25/hour, so if the burger flipper > was > smart, he or she would break a deal of $20/hour and call it a day:-) > > Ilya > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Andrew Hill > To: Struts Users Mailing List > Sent: 3/27/03 9:02 PM > Subject: RE: [OT] Contract Work: Going Rate? > > Half right. :-) > > I guess low is a distinctly relative term. Especially when comparing > apples & oranges (or salary & contract) ;->. > > Rates here may be low compared to US or UK contract rates (are they > really so high? - still have trouble believing those figures!), but as > for those in India, Russia, etc... they would get a fraction of the > going rate here, and there are probably folk doing the same stuff > elsewhere who get even less. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Scott Barr [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Friday, 28 March 2003 07:44 > To: Struts Users Mailing List > Subject: RE: [OT] Contract Work: Going Rate? > > > > Yeah, but we both (i think Andrew is an Aussie) live in Australia. Land > of low wages > > Scott > www.exergonic.com.au > > On Fri, 2003-03-28 at 06:26, Sterin, Ilya wrote: > 30*3000 is more than your whole entire career earnings? Where are you > from? > India? Russia? > > In US that's an average developer contract salary, and $30/hour is a > charge > that most contractors will laugh at here. > > Ilya > > -----Original Message----- > From: Andrew Hill > To: Struts Users Mailing List > Sent: 3/27/03 1:32 AM > Subject: RE: [OT] Contract Work: Going Rate? > > These are USD per HOUR? > > Crikey! You could retire after a couple of years on that! > Nah that cant be right. I did a bit under 3000 hours last year, multiply > by > 30 and convert to local currency adds up to more than Ive earned in my > whole > working life (4+ years). A lot more... > > Are those fair dinkum rates or are you just having us on? > > Five weeks holiday??? OT pay??? > > Yeh. Thought so. Its a joke. hehe. You had me going there mate! > > -----Original Message----- > From: Simon Kelly [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Thursday, 27 March 2003 16:08 > To: Struts Users Mailing List > Subject: Re: [OT] Contract Work: Going Rate? > > > These are some going full time rates for a London based e-learning > company, > for an average of 1880 hrs worked in one year (Five weeks holiday not > included in the figures, but you'd get the same rate). The company pays > OT > on projects that need it, but actually limit the number of hours in a > week > that an employee can be in the office. (Something about a work/life > balance, > whatver than means :-) > > All in US dollars (converted from blighty pounds) > > Grade one (Whipping boy) - 30$ > Grade two (Code monkey) - 40$ > Grade three (Designer) - 55$ > Grade four (Architect) - 90$ > Grade five (Senior Architect) - 150$ > > These don't include the options and bonuses (last xmas bonus ranged from > 500$ to 6000$) and the OT isn't in there (Usually 1.5*hourly > week-day/sat -- > 2*hourly sun). > > Contractor have to pay all the insurance and stuff, so I'd dap about > 22-40% > on top of each of these + a little extra if your gonna have to live in > an > expensive part of town. > > NOTE to the lawer. It only becomes illegal if it can be proven that we > have > set a level of pay *and* have all agreed to follow this level. If > you've > been on here long enough, you'd know *noone* ever agrees about > anything!! > =]:0) > > Good luck with the job, I hear California is nice this time of year!! > > Cheers > > Simon > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- James Mitchell Software Developer/Struts Evangelist http://www.open-tools.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
