On Jan 4, 2009, at 9:23 PM, Wade Brainerd wrote: > Personally, I don't believe that Sugar Labs the organization needs > to be concerned with any of these four points. Ahh, but a recurring question from existing Sugar deployments is how to get Flash, why Flash doesn't run faster, etc.
> The question is whether the Sugar *software* is flexible enough to > adapt to the needs of its users. Who are we to say what they > should install, and what tools they should use to make their content? The question is what answer you provide to this crucial question. How crucial ? Any (non-x86) processor design hoping to for MID/ settop/laptop market penetration is paying Adobe to support them from day one. One day, we hope they will instead pay someone to port Gnash + codecs instead... > Currently Sugar is incapable of running software which is not > specifically designed for it. Sugar runs simpler SWF applications just fine, through the Browser. They don't have to be "designed" for Sugar. > This precludes smaller organizations who cannot design custom Sugar > activities from producing good content. Once the Sugar software is > more flexible and able to run arbitrary programs (Gnash, Flash, > Silverlight, GTK, Qt) without massive time investment and hacking > on the part of the content producers, the other questions won't > even reach this list. > > Best regards, > Wade > > On Sun, Jan 4, 2009 at 8:38 PM, David Farning > <dfarn...@sugarlabs.org> wrote: > Bryan Berry started a great thread about activity development a few > days ago. In the initial post he proposed using flash as means of > developing content. Before taking the thread any farther I though we > should stop and look at what flash actually is. > > The term flash is often interchangeably used as: > 1. A brand > 2. A player > 3. A development environment > 4. A protocol > > Yep, confusing. As we continue the discussion, I thought we should > look at how 'flash' relates to Sugar and to more generally to OLPC and > Open Source. I have CCed MaryBeth from Open Media Now and Rob from > Gnash to help clarify the many shortcomings in my explanations. > > First, the brand - > Flash is primarily a brand. It was originally created by MacroMedia > and has been purchased by Adobe. The brand consists of the player, > IDE, protocol, and the support and marketing provided by Adobe. As a > brand, Flash is competing head-to-head with Microsoft's Silverlight. > > Second, the player - > The most visible part of flash is the player. The _Adobe_Flash_Player > is a proprietary product which is developed, supported, and > distributed by Adobe. Currently, the Adobe Flash Player can only be > distributed with Adobe's permission. Binary code for the player can > be downloaded for most operating systems and distributions. > > Third party redistribution is strictly prohibited without permission. > As such it would not be possible for Sugar Labs to distribute the > Adobe_Flash_Player in its code bundles. Deployments can, and often > do, add the Player as an available activity. The Player can be > legally redistributed over an organization's intra-net. > > Third, the authoring tools - > Adobe's business model is to give away the player and sell the > authoring tools. As a result, Adobe sells several very good, yet, > expensive authoring tools. Adobe's development tool costs > approximately $750 US. > > Fourth, the Standards - > Flash deliverables come in two formats .swf and .flv. Swf and > ActionScript, the development language use to create .swfs have been > open sourced. I believe that the ActionScript source code is jointly > held by Adobe and Mozilla. There are possible legal questions about > the patent encumberment status of some of the media codecs used in > swfs and flvs. We would need clarification from the Software Freedom > Conservancy on these issues. > > So, counting backwards how does this affect Sugar Lab? > Fourth, the Standards - > We need to wait for feedback from the SFC and Open Media Now. > > Third, the authoring tools - > Adobe has done a very effective job eliminating the competition for > flash authoring tools. http://osflash.org/ has a number of open > source development tools. I am not enough of a flash developer to > judge if the authoring products are mature enough to be useful or not. > Are there any Flash developers out there, can you judge the quality > of some of these products? > > Second, the player - > The Free Software Foundation has flash player project called Gnash. > The project is makin slow yet steady progress towards being a fully > capable swf player. The project suffers from lack of support. Many > Open Source users either download the Adobe player or forgo using > flash. The itch factor is pretty low. > > As a product, Gnash is approaching, yet is not yet ready for, prime > time. I spent New Years Day with my sister's kids( ages 11, 7, and 4) > looking at their favorites sites under Ubuntu/Flash, Ubuntu/Gnash, > Xo/Flash, and Xo,Flash. I bet that was the first time they have ever > heard a adult tell them to, 'come on, play it again, just one more > time, please...' about their favorite games:) > > There was a steady decrease in the availability and usability of sites > with Xo and Gnash. We need to wait for feedback from Gnash about the > product's technical limitations and the project's development > limitations. > > Finally, the brand - > Adobe has recently asked Gnash to call their player a SWF player > rather than a flash player:) > > I appreciate your feedback on the technical aspect of Bryan's propose. > In the next few days, I will try to summarize the (1) > organization/development and (2) the educational/pedagogically issues > of his proposal. > > thanks > david > _______________________________________________ > IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) > i...@lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep > > _______________________________________________ > IAEP -- It's An Education Project (not a laptop project!) > i...@lists.sugarlabs.org > http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/iaep _______________________________________________ Sugar-devel mailing list Sugar-devel@lists.sugarlabs.org http://lists.sugarlabs.org/listinfo/sugar-devel