Jeff Grant [[EMAIL PROTECTED]] wrote:
> In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Ralph Clark
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes
> >Many people on this list, myself included, are able to help anyone who's
> >willing
> >to do some of the work themselves. But some of us may have little sympathy for
> >people who come across as unremittingly lazy or greedy. Obviously mistakes can
> >be made when one is making judgements on such scanty evidence, but that's life
> >basically.
> >
> >So for those newbie lurkers reading this now - when you get around to posting a
> >question, make sure you get your presentation right!
> >
>
> Right. Doubtless there are - like in any other sphere of life -
> pathological takers. But have you thought that maybe - just maybe - some
> of us newbie lurkers out here might not know - did *you* always? - the
> ramifications of the question we're asking? I think your attitude could
> put a lot of people off asking, rather than encourage them. And what's
> the point in that? All you have to do with those you suspect of being
> 'unremittingly lazy or greedy' is ignore them.
The point is that we don't have unlimited time and resources to answer all of
your questions that we had to read and do the effort to find answers for.
Some concrete examples of questions that will likely get nice help:
1) "Hi, I've checked the available documentation, but I can't seem to find the
answer I need. Could someone give me a hand or point me in the right
direction if I'm just missing something? <detailed description of problem,
including relevant details>."
2) "Hi, I'm new to Linux... can someone tell me where to find more inforation
about <topic or problem>."
Example of questions that will probably get an RTFM:
1) "I just installed Lunix and I need to know how to make my system totally
secure SOMEONE TELL ME HOW."
2) "How do I make WP8 underline things?"
3) "My monitor won't work with X Windows, how do I fix it?" (this prolly won't
get an RTFM as much as a request for more detail -- what kind of monitor, what
have you tried, etc -- and if these requests are met with a "I don't know why
should it matter HELP ME NOW" response, they'll prolly not get much more
help.)
Yes we all know that we used to be newbies. Yes there is a matter of
arrogance and pissing contests in this community, esp when dealing with
newbies. There is also a matter of frustration when dealing with newbies,
though. You need to remember that we all have only limited time, and it is
frustrating to answer the same questions over and over when the answers are
cleary documented (if it's an FAQ, there is prolly a FAQ document that
contains it), simply because people haven't bothered to do any of their own
checking. We're glad to help people that really need our help, but we aren't
tech support robots. It's a waste of our time to answer the same basic
questions over and over... time that could be better spent answering more
difficult questions and continuing to gain knowledge ourselves. It is
frustrating to feel that you're being taken for granted or taken advantage of,
even if the other person isn't doing it maliciously or deliberately.
For those that claim that in the Linux world RTFM doesn't apply because there
is no single manual... I'm sorry, but that's just bogus. There are some basic
sources of info for any problem that you can check. If they don't have the
answer, they will likely contain pointers to more places to look.
We're not expecting everyone to have read every book on Linux before asking a
question. We're asking them to help us help them and others by first looking
at the things we've done to make helping them easier (FAQs, the LDP, etc).
For any given problem, you can check:
1) relevant man/info pages
2) other relevant FAQs/READMEs/manuals
3) the LDP: http://metalab.unc.edu/LDP/
4) archives for relevant mailing lists/newgroups
5) postings to relevant mailing lists/newsgroups
6) the program/process' author/maintainer/contact person
Note that lists like this are #5 on that list, and only after checking the
archives. Yeah, we won't get everyone to always do all of that, and some man
pages/etc are just beyond some people, but if people would at least make the
effort, a lot of wasted time and repeated effort wouldn't happen.
--
Jeremy Blosser | [EMAIL PROTECTED] | http://jblosser.firinn.org/
-----------------+-------------------------+------------------------------
"Would you fight to the death, for that which you love?
In a cause surely hopeless ...for that which you love?"
-- D. McKiernan, _Dragondoom_
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