Bob,

I have worked with the biomass gasification process for quite a few years and 
the conversion efficiency  of biomass carbon to methanol is more in the 20% 
region.  Check  http://www.refuelnet.de/content/refuelnet/pdf/SOMFB_99.pdf

At today's natural gas prices, it is cheaper to produce methanol via gas 
synthesis than produce it via fermentation.   Hang on though, prices might be 
changing soon.  The real energy loser in the fermentation process (after 
production costs) is concentrating the methanol from a dilute water solution to 
a fuel quality liquid.

I am still interested in learning about a direct process to convert glycerin to 
any type of fuel.

Art Krenzel, P.E.
PHOENIX TECHNOLOGIES
10505 NE 285TH Street
Battle Ground, WA 98604
360-666-1883 voice
[EMAIL PROTECTED]






----- Original Message ----- 
  From: bob allen 
  To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com 
  Sent: Thursday, June 10, 2004 1:45 PM
  Subject: Re: [biofuel] Making Methanol from Glycerin ( was Re: Biodiesel 
Glycerin-to-Methanol Condensor plans )


  no problem in principle.   Any  starch/sugar/cellulosic material can be 
  thermally degraded to  to a mixture of gases  and light liquids.(often 
  referred to as destructive distillation)  Catalytic reforming should 
  yield methanol.  The only problem, an engineering feat rather than a 
  chemical problem would be optimizing yield.  On an industrial scale, you 
  only get about a 50 % energy return going from green timber to 
  methanol.  A bacterial fermentation may also be possible to produce 
  methanol or other alcohols from glycerol. 


  A


  Keith Addison wrote:

  >Hasn't anyone got an answer or some info for Greg? This is an 
  >interesting possibility, if it is one.
  >
  >Best wishes
  >
  >Keith
  >
  >
  >  
  >
  >>Can anyone spot flaws in my theory?
  >>
  >>Greg H.
  >> ----- Original Message -----
  >> From: Greg Harbican
  >> To: biofuel@yahoogroups.com
  >> Sent: Saturday, June 05, 2004 10:14
  >> Subject: [biofuel] Making Methanol from Glycerin ( was Re: 
  >>Biodiesel Glycerin-to-Methanol Condensor plans )
  >>
  >>
  >> You know, I wasn't fully awake and definitely was not tracking 
  >>correctly when I first read the subject line, but, I think that it 
  >>was probably a good thing.
  >>
  >> What I read was Biodiesel Glycerin-to-Methanol ( totally missed 
  >>the condenser part ), and was thinking that here was a idea that 
  >>allowed people to use the glycerin by-product to make methanol. 
  >>When I read the message, I realized that I had made a mistake, but, 
  >>thinking about that mistake, I thought that it might just be 
  >>possible.
  >>
  >> Now I'm sure that someone will correct me if I'm wrong, but, does 
  >>not water and glycerin mix well?
  >>
  >> Then if that is the case, the solution would be a water / hydrogen 
  >>& carbon solution, similar to that of sugar water, which according 
  >>to Walt Patrick mentioned can be used to produce Syn Gas, then 
  >>converted to methanol.
  >>
  >> Please, let me know your thoughts about this possibility.
  >>
  >> Greg H.
  >>    
  >>
  >
  >
  >
  >
  >Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
  >http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
  >
  >Biofuels list archives:
  >http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
  >
  >Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address.
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  >
  >
  > 
  >
  >
  >  
  >


  -- 
  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
       Bob Allen, Professor of Chemistry
       http://ozarker.org/bob


  Everyone has the right to freedom of opinion and expression;
  this right includes freedom to hold opinions without interference
  and to seek, receive and impart information and ideas through any
  media and regardless of frontiers.

  Article 19 of The Declaration of Human Rights, adopted by the
  United Nations General Assembly,10 December 1948:
  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~





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