I find this things very hard to believe. My father was telling me about 
how in the 70s someone put together a book that said we where going to 
run out of nickel copper and various other metals. The book quoted 
mostly dates in the 80s. It is now 2004 and we are recycling some stuff, 
but we are not going to run out anytime soon. David Szuki in Canada has 
been predicting complete environmental collapse since the 80s. Like some 
cult he keeps moving the date out when it becomes obvious that it isn't 
going to happen. Certainly some of these things are risks, but there is 
not solid evidence that any of them are going to happen. In fact as we 
speak algae has started growing better in the oceans and is partially 
reversing the greenhouse affect.

Stop preaching doom and gloom. There is no proof it is going to happen. 
Just as there is little proof it isn't. So far the evidence seems to 
support life is a lot less fragile than we thought. It is certainly more 
stable than David Szuki was intimating.

Now back to reality. We need to find recyclable ways to replace parts of 
our society that are throw away. Possibly the way we get there is by 
waiting until the cost of the recyclable product drops below the cost of 
the throw away product but I would like to see it happen sooner 
primarily but considering throw away a sin tax. And taxing it appropriately.

Things that have been irritating me:
Electric cars produce more polution and CO2 than gas cars. Remember 
marginal electricity is produced by Coal in NA.

The Green party in Can has their heart in the right place but can't seem 
to do basic scientific research so they promote electric cars.

The Green party in Can claims they believe in science and financial 
responsibility and they push unscientifically proven remedies on people.

Why the vast majority of people who believe in the environment are so 
left wing no one is willing to take them seriously.

For that matter most right wing governments don't seem to get the 
environment.

Why most left wing governments don't understand you need a strong 
business economy to pay for all of the stuff to help out the little guy 
and the environment.

Why most right wing governments don't understand the only thing public 
corporations want is money. They don't EVER care about anything else.

Ok I admit I am in a bad mood and am done now.

                                                - bfn - JAW


Ken Provost wrote:

> on 6/15/04 7:48 AM, Dan Fitzpatrick at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> 
> 
> 
>>I'm very interested to learn how far we could go towards
>>completely replacing fossil-fuels without sacrificing lifestyle.
> 
> 
> 
> Probly not very far. Check out "The Party's Over", Richard Heinberg.
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail
> /-/0865714827103-4126562-7176623?v=glance
> 
> I just bought 10 copies to give away. Not the definitive work
> by any means, but everything has been brought together nicely
> in one place, including a lot of history I never knew. He and
> others make the case that our "lifestyle" is a petroleum-fed
> aberration, and likely a good thing to sacrifice (or jettison)
> as soon as possible, surely including much misery in the process.
> 
> -K
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
> http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
> 
> Biofuels list archives:
> http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/biofuel/
> 
> Please do NOT send Unsubscribe messages to the list address.
> To unsubscribe, send an email to:
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> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> 
> 





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