As I keep telling people, all 4WD does is get youy moving. You'd be amazed at the number of people that think it allows you to drive faster in the snow due to "better all weather handling". These are the same morons that put high octane gas in their Civics for more power...
Zeke Yewdall wrote: > Around here I've certainly seen more SUV's upsidedown in the creek in > the snow than cars... Just based on how poorly most of even the new > SUV's handle in the snow compared to my 20 year old subaru, I'm not > really suprised. High center of gravity, high horsepower, short > wheelbase, and bad front/rear weight distribution just isn't too good > on icy highways. > > Z > > On 7/6/06, *Mike Weaver* <[EMAIL PROTECTED] > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>> wrote: > > It's a common misperception that SUV's are safer than smaller cars. > It's not true look up number of fatalities at iihs.org > <http://iihs.org> or hldi.org... > > Terry Dyck wrote: > > >Smart Cars are considered one of the safest cars on the road next > to a > >Volvo. The frame is solid steel. Large SUV's are the most > dangerous cars > >because they roll easily. Don't let size determine safety, it > does not work > >that way. > > > >Terry Dyck > > > > > > > > > >>From: Mike Weaver <[EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>> > >>Reply-To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org > <mailto:biofuel@sustainablelists.org> > >>To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org > <mailto:biofuel@sustainablelists.org> > >>Subject: Re: [Biofuel] was..was..smart car coming to US in 2008 > >>Date: Mon, 03 Jul 2006 09:01:51 -0400 > >> > >>I'd stay off the highway, heck, I'm scared to ride my Harley on the > >>interstate... > >> > >>mark manchester wrote: > >> > >> > >> > >>>I hate to see these things on the highway, looks like people > flying along > >>>under an umbrella. Surely can speed along, this is pretty much a > >>> > >>> > >>four-wheel > >> > >> > >>>hooded motorcycle. Incredibly cute, though, and comfy. Very > popular > >>> > >>> > >>here > >> > >> > >>>in Toronto, but there's zero trunk space. > >>>Jesse > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>>>From: Mike Weaver <[EMAIL PROTECTED] > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>> > >>>>Reply-To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org > <mailto:biofuel@sustainablelists.org> > >>>>Date: Sun, 02 Jul 2006 10:44:51 -0400 > >>>>To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org > <mailto:biofuel@sustainablelists.org> > >>>>Subject: Re: [Biofuel] was..was..smart car coming to US in 2008 > >>>> > >>>>I've been thinking that what I need would be a two seater with > a fairly > >>>>large storage space as I usually go downtown with servers and > stuff. My > >>>>Golf works ok with the seats down, but if the whole vehicle were > >>>>designed for hauling small and medium loads a "Smart Car" > design would > >>>>be perfect. Now think of a diesel/electric hybrid... > >>>> > >>>>-Weaver > >>>> > >>>>AltEnergyNetwork wrote: > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>Haken, > >>>>> > >>>>>I've seen the 2 seater up really close, took a look inside, > watched it > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>being > >> > >> > >>>>>parked > >>>>>in a miniscule spot, been behind one and in front of one in > traffic, > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>haven't > >> > >> > >>>>>driven one yet. > >>>>>They are really cool little cars. I think it is going to fill an > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>important > >> > >> > >>>>>niche market for > >>>>>couriers, deliveries, fleets and businesses that like the > fact that it > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>sips > >> > >> > >>>>>thimbles of gasoline. > >>>>>Still, in order to wean Americans off of their obsession with > suvs, it > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>might > >> > >> > >>>>>be a good idea if the company made a "heftier" 4 seater > utility that > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>would > >> > >> > >>>>>appeal to the suv crowd and still sip at the pump. Image is > everything > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>and if > >> > >> > >>>>>the average joe > >>>>>thinks that they can get one of these green machines and > still be able > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>to lug > >> > >> > >>>>>around > >>>>>the stuff that they do AND save at the pump, great. It's the > old " > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>having > >> > >> > >>>>>cake and eating it too" > >>>>>syndrome but people respond to it, > >>>>> > >>>>>regards > >>>>>tallex > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>>>Smart Car Coming to US in 2008 Launch by DaimlerChrysler > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>< > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >> > http://www.alternate-energy.net/N/news.php?detail=n1151818384.news > > >> > >> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>>-------Original Message------- > >>>>>>From: Hakan Falk < [EMAIL PROTECTED] > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>> > >>>>>>Subject: Re: [Biofuel] was..smart car coming to US in 2008 > >>>>>>Sent: 02 Jul '06 08:22 > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Tallex, > >>>>>> > >>>>>>The market for 250 pound people is very much smaller in > Europe than in > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>US > >> > >> > >>>>>>and > >>>>>>I think that it is not a primary target for SMART cars. Do > not only > >>>>>>look at one, try > >>>>>>it and you will be surprised on how spacious it is for 2 > people and > >>>>>>how well it > >>>>>>transport/park for urban dwellers. I do however agree on the > problems > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>in US, > >> > >> > >>>>>>it is little space for the oversized chip and snack packs, > that seems > >>>>>>to be the > >>>>>>essentials for US commuters. > >>>>>> > >>>>>>I am not a small person 186 centimeter and 96 kilo (which is too > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>much), but > >> > >> > >>>>>>I > >>>>>>fit well in a Smart. I did however not consider the image > problem. > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Hakan > >>>>>> > >>>>>>At 09:15 02/07/2006, you wrote: > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>>>That's great Haken, so if they already have a four seater, > >>>>>>>it is not to much of a stretch to do a minivan version as > well and > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>still > >> > >> > >>>>>>>be considered a smart car? > >>>>>>>Also, I've seen the two seater and while really cool, there > is no way > >>>>>>>you are going to fit 2 - 250 pound people side by side, > they would > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>look > >> > >> > >>>>>>>like > >>>>>>>circus clowns stuffed into the seats. > >>>>>>>People want utility in their vehicles and still be as > efficient as > >>>>>>>possible. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>tallex > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>Smart Car Coming to US in 2008 Launch by DaimlerChrysler > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>< > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>http://www.alternate-energy.net/N/news.php?detail=n1151818384.news > > >> > >> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>-------Original Message------- > >>>>>>>>From: Hakan Falk <[EMAIL PROTECTED] > <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>> > >>>>>>>>Subject: Re: [Biofuel] smart car coming to US in 2008 > >>>>>>>>Sent: 02 Jul '06 06:56 > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>They do have a 4 seater model already, it is selling in > Europe for > >>>>>>>>quite a while. > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Hakan > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>At 08:06 02/07/2006, you wrote: > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Great idea but I think that they better make a four > seater for the > >>>>>>>>>US market. Smart cars have been out for about a year in > Canada and > >>>>>>>>>while really cool, I have a hard time > >>>>>>>>>imagining 2 average Americans in one ;) LOL, > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>regards > >>>>>>>>>tallex > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Smart Car Coming to US in 2008 Launch by DaimlerChrysler > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>< > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >> > http://www.alternate-energy.net/N/news.php?detail=n1151818384.news > > >> > >> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Get your daily alternative energy news > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Alternate Energy Resource Network > >>>>>>>>>1000+ news sources-resources > >>>>>>>>>updated daily > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> http://www.alternate-energy.net > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Next Generation Grid > >>>>>>>>>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/next_generation_grid/ > <http://groups.yahoo.com/group/next_generation_grid/> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Tomorrow-energy > >>>>>>>>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/tomorrow-energy/ > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Alternative Energy Politics > >>>>>>>>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Alternative_Energy_Politics/ > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>_______________________________________________ > >>>>>>>>>Biofuel mailing list > >>>>>>>>> Biofuel@sustainablelists.org > <mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org> > > >>>>>>>>>http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org > > <http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Biofuel at Journey to Forever: > >>>>>>>>>http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html > <http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>>Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>(50,000 messages): > 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