About Murder on the Zinderneuf...I have the DOS version, and I'm in the
Northern Hemisphere! :-) I had no idea it was valuable at all. I don't
remember where/when I got mine, but the person would have been lucky to get
$5 for it. I don't see how the DOS version would have been especially rare.
EA was notorious for mass producing games. The DOS version didn't come out
until 1984 -- the original (Atari 800 version, 1983) has the distinction of
being the first game to sign a contract with EA (it is also historically
significant, of course, because it was written by Free Fall Associates --
also of Archon fame -- Jim Freeman's (founder of Epyx) company). So in my
opinion, the Atari 800 version is far move "valuable" from a historic
standpoint. I didn't know the DOS version was especially rare, but I'll
keep an eye out from now on! There is another EA Flat for DOS only called
Radio Baseball. I haven't seen many of these around, so maybe the DOS
versions of EA games are more rare...maybe they didn't sell well.
By the way, to blow my own horn, if I have one area of expertise it would be
EA flat box games. I have one of the few complete collections of EA flats
that I know about (some of you probably have complete as well). I don't
have every platform, but I do have every title. Anyone who wants to know
more on the topic should visit my EA Flats page:
http://www.classicgaming.com/gotcha/eaflats.htm
Or my EA History page:
http://www.classicgaming.com/gotcha/ea.htm
Or my Epyx History (Free Fall Associates) page:
http://www.classicgaming.com/gotcha/epyx.htm
Best regards,
Hugh
-----Original Message-----
From: Jim Leonard [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Monday, July 02, 2001 9:57 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [SWCollect] trademark for collectors
"C.E. Forman" wrote:
>
> >So I'm actually not surprised that anyone who "collects"
> >anything has a slight bit of a neurological disorder.
>
> It would explain a lot of odd, quirkish behavior. And I myself am mildly
> obsessive-compulsive in other areas of my life besides collecting.
I think anyone who collects anything fits this criteria. Something for
a thesis study, no doubt.
> >I purchase 2 of everything: 1 to appreciate, and the other to crack the
> >shrinkwrap on.
>
> I'm this way with my Infocoms (you just have to be able to get at the
> props), but I've got to know: If you get a shrinked copy BEFORE you get an
> opened copy, do you personally (1) break the wrap first and risk not being
> able to appreciate another wrapped copy for a long long time, or (2) hang
> onto the wrapped copy until you find another wrapped copy or one that's
> already been opened, and take the chance that the disk media will go bad
> while you're waiting? Jim, from what you write after this statement it
> sounds like you're definitely in the first category... How about everyone
> else?
I'm definitely in the first category. I crack the wrap. And you'll
just love this one: Sometimes I buy a third so that I can cut up the
manual. Yes, I cut all the pages out of the manual. This is so I can
get the best possible scan of the manual pages for creating an archival
quality PDF of them (the stuff on Underdogs is mostly crap).
> >(!!!) Yes, I break original shrinkwrap so that I can
> >release the game to the public domain if nobody else has. Why do you
> >think the hardcore oldwarez community is so eager to get their hands on
> >Chris' copy of Cyborg? Because it may very well be the last copy that
> >exists, and we want to copy the disk before it goes bad and fades away.
>
> This raises an interesting dilemma, and the main reason I continually
refuse
> to open it: Suppose I did break the wrap, I went to copy the disk... and
> it's already bad? The retrogamers are upset because they won't be able to
> play it after all. I'm out my shrinkwrapped package with absolutely
nothing
> to show for it. But there's no way to tell that until I do crack it.
> Classic "Schroedinger's Cat". I don't gamble with my collection.
It's definitely a classic schroedinger's cat. There's just no way to
know. And so we wait for another copy to turn up.
> (I've dealt with my other reasons in Shoppe columns enough times that I
> won't bore you reciting them again here.)
What, you have other reasons? :-) I think the above is the best
reason. I totally support you, BTW -- it just sucks for both of us.
Somewhere, someday, another copy will turn up. We hope.
> >Sadly for us -- and detailed in an old conversation that you can look at
> >in the archives -- Chris and many other collectors place much less value
> >on the diskette than the entire package.
>
> I've thought about this one for a long time, and yes, the software is
> definitely worth less to me than the package. Why? Because the package
is
> PHYSICAL. Only a certain number of game packages were ever produced.
Once
> all the others have been lost or thrown out, that's it. Mine is the only
> one left, and there will never be any more. But software does not exist
in
> any physical sense. One very last copy easily becomes 8 million copies.
So
> it's far easier to obtain and thus of far less value to someone who prizes
> rarity.
This is because you (and most collectors) value the package, whereas
some people value the games themselves. I collect mostly for the games
themselves -- I truly appreciate the work and effort that went into an
older game, because the designers had a lot more hurdles to jump on such
old hardware. This goes across all genres, including sports games
(which I don't personally play but still collect out of respect).
> >Me personally, if I crack open
> >a rare game only to find that the disk is bad, the entire thing is
> >nearly worthless for me.
>
> Exactly. So why take the chance? (BTW, if you ever open any rare
adventure
> games that turn out to have bad disks, I'll cut you a good deal on those
> "nearly worthless" items. B-)
Yes, you and the entire mailing list I'm sure :-)
> The thing is (using Cyborg as an example), you CAN play it... provided
> you're willing to expend a little extra effort and download an Apple II
> emulator and the disk image. This exists on the web, I've seen it. The
> problem I've run into is that there are so many picky-shit players out
there
> who absolutely MUST play the PC version, nothing else will do. "They
don't
> have pepperoni pizza, only sausage, so I guess I'll just go hungry." It's
a
> little hard to feel sorry for people like that.
Agreed, but this isn't the reason I would like to see it copied; I like
to compare different ports of games. I get a large amount of enjoyment
of comparing and contrasting the following:
- The original version of a game
- The PC conversion (PC was powerful at the time but lacked decent
graphics and sound)
- The Mac conversion (2-color graphics; okay sound; mac-like
mouse-dependent game interface changes almost certain)
- Other ports
This is because a lot of interesting and amazing things can happen when
porting a game, and it's interesting to see how the programmers doing
the port solved significant technical problems between platforms. For
example, the Amiga Cinemaware classic Defender of the Crown had the very
best graphics for any computer game up until that year, so how did the
conversion from 320x240x32 to 320x200x4 work when porting to the PC? Or
Commodore 64 (160x200x16)? Or Mac (512x384x2)? It turns out that all
ports solved those problems in very creative ways, and all of them
(except maybe the C64 version ;-) were winners.
Now, in the case of interactive fiction, Chris is right when he says
it's almost 100% certain the the Apple dumped disk image and the PC
gameplaying experience are the same. In fact, I'm certain of it, as the
Infocom stuff is quite definitely the same across platforms. So his
Cyborg is safe for the forseeable future. Examples of games that
*aren't* safe would include stuff like:
- The PC versions of Murder on the Zinderneuf (which I will crack the
shrink on very soon <MASSIVE GROANS HEARD FROM THE COLLECTING COMMUNITY
AS THE VALUE OF IT GOES FROM $350 to $40> because I am almost positive I
have the only copy in the northern hemisphere)
- Rescue on Fractalus (for which a box mock-up exists but is unverified
if a PC version ever existed)
- Crush, Crumble and Chomp! (which was ported to the PC in BASIC)
All three of those are not only rare as hell but fit my argument
exactly. You've just gotta see how they're different! ;-)
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