Hi. The new routes are supposed to be complete by the end of this year.
I know it takes me a while to get around to fixing something on OSM. Perhaps if you are keen then approach 2 is OK (and signage will catch up eventually). If you are lazy then 1 is the default. :) - Ben Kelley. On 10 May 2013 07:06, "Ian Sergeant" <inas66+...@gmail.com> wrote: > Hi, > > I'm surprised you couldn't find some F3 signs there as well! > > In any event, we can.. > > 1. Ignore the new routes until they are completed. Then re-reference the > road. > 2. As soon as the route is confirmed and there are some signs, > re-reference the road > 3. Adopt some new schema that allows us to have both route references at > once. > 4. Adopt of hodge-podge approach, and reference partial roads, based on > the assessment/whim of the mapper concerned. > > I originally proposed 1, but now I'm leaning towards 2, because I feel I'm > swimming against the tide. > > I don't think we're capable of doing 3. And I'd hate to end up with 4. > > Ian. > > > On 10 May 2013 05:29, Ben Johnson <tangarar...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> I took a look there last weekend. As you say... inconsistencies >> everywhere. >> >> Northbound all are M1 with B74, and there's even a distance reassurance >> sign (not interchange-related) showing distances to Brisbane, titled "M1 >> Pacific Mwy" which I was surprised to see. >> >> Southbound all are NR1 with B74. >> >> The signs at the top of the ramps are in odd combinations like NR1 >> "Pacific Mwy" on one sign, and M1 "Freeway" on another... >> >> It's a real tourist attraction for sign geeks! >> >> BJ >> >> On 09/05/2013, at 22:11, Nathan Van Der Meulen <natvan...@yahoo.com> >> wrote: >> >> > You're not going to win any way you change the route references. On >> the ground, around the Tuggerah Interchange alone are references to Nat >> Route 1, M1, Pacific Motorway etc. Note that the freeway is referenced as >> M1 from Wyong Rd (B74) but on the freeway it's still NR1. B74 only seems >> to be referenced at the interchange. If you only edit as per what's on the >> ground, how do you edit that? >> > >> > Sent from my iPad >> > >> > On 03/05/2013, at 21:00, talk-au-requ...@openstreetmap.org wrote: >> > >> >> Send Talk-au mailing list submissions to >> >> talk-au@openstreetmap.org >> >> >> >> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit >> >> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au >> >> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to >> >> talk-au-requ...@openstreetmap.org >> >> >> >> You can reach the person managing the list at >> >> talk-au-ow...@openstreetmap.org >> >> >> >> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific >> >> than "Re: Contents of Talk-au digest..." >> >> >> >> >> >> Today's Topics: >> >> >> >> 1. Alphanumeric references in NSW (Ian Sergeant) >> >> 2. Re: Alphanumeric references in NSW (Ben Kelley) >> >> 3. Re: Alphanumeric references in NSW (Ian Sergeant) >> >> 4. Re: Alphanumeric references in NSW (Ben Johnson) >> >> 5. Re: Alphanumeric references in NSW (Ian Sergeant) >> >> >> >> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> >> >> Message: 1 >> >> Date: Fri, 3 May 2013 15:07:02 +1000 >> >> From: Ian Sergeant <inas66+...@gmail.com> >> >> To: OSM - Talk-au <Talk-au@openstreetmap.org> >> >> Subject: [talk-au] Alphanumeric references in NSW >> >> Message-ID: >> >> <CALDa4YLY+4KEnutrnBmjcRpE5z3G5hH4z6Yzyu=duwiw5sn...@mail.gmail.com> >> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" >> >> >> >> Hi, >> >> >> >> I've noticed a few people are changing the references in NSW to the >> >> alphanumeric references before the signage has changed. >> >> >> >> I don't see the purpose of this. I doesn't correspond to what is on >> the >> >> ground, it must be confusing to people actually trying to use OSM for >> >> navigation. Also, given it is the RTA coordinate this, it wouldn't be >> >> surprising if some of the routes actually differed from the proposed >> routes >> >> on the webpage. >> >> >> >> To the best of my knowledge the only route that has been re-referenced >> is >> >> the B73, the others still retain their existing signage - with perhaps >> an >> >> uncovered sign here and there. I traced the >> >> >> >> I'd suggest we can use the wiki to coordinate as these references >> change? >> >> That way we can ensure the entire route is renamed at once, rather >> than a >> >> patchwork? >> >> >> >> Ian. >> >> P.S. Of course there have been a few routes (M7, A31/M31 approaching >> >> Albury) that have been this way for a while, and aren't at issue here. >> >> -------------- next part -------------- >> >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >> >> URL: < >> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-au/attachments/20130503/f593d5da/attachment-0001.html >> > >> >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> >> >> Message: 2 >> >> Date: Fri, 3 May 2013 15:33:45 +1000 >> >> From: Ben Kelley <ben.kel...@gmail.com> >> >> To: Ian Sergeant <inas66+...@gmail.com> >> >> Cc: OSM - Talk-au <Talk-au@openstreetmap.org> >> >> Subject: Re: [talk-au] Alphanumeric references in NSW >> >> Message-ID: >> >> <CAE4-2TKPPKzjA3EE-kwfkDrH=8b-_by+h74hv3ytdgn+ajl...@mail.gmail.com> >> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" >> >> >> >> Hi. >> >> >> >> I have seen a few A15 signs on the New England Highway, but there are >> still >> >> quite a few 43 and 15 signs along the route. The ground can still be a >> bit >> >> confusing. >> >> >> >> - Ben Kelley. >> >> On 3 May 2013 15:08, "Ian Sergeant" <inas66+...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> >> >>> Hi, >> >>> >> >>> I've noticed a few people are changing the references in NSW to the >> >>> alphanumeric references before the signage has changed. >> >>> >> >>> I don't see the purpose of this. I doesn't correspond to what is on >> the >> >>> ground, it must be confusing to people actually trying to use OSM for >> >>> navigation. Also, given it is the RTA coordinate this, it wouldn't be >> >>> surprising if some of the routes actually differed from the proposed >> routes >> >>> on the webpage. >> >>> >> >>> To the best of my knowledge the only route that has been >> re-referenced is >> >>> the B73, the others still retain their existing signage - with >> perhaps an >> >>> uncovered sign here and there. I traced the >> >>> >> >>> I'd suggest we can use the wiki to coordinate as these references >> >>> change? That way we can ensure the entire route is renamed at once, >> >>> rather than a patchwork? >> >>> >> >>> Ian. >> >>> P.S. Of course there have been a few routes (M7, A31/M31 approaching >> >>> Albury) that have been this way for a while, and aren't at issue here. >> >>> _______________________________________________ >> >>> Talk-au mailing list >> >>> Talk-au@openstreetmap.org >> >>> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au >> >> -------------- next part -------------- >> >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >> >> URL: < >> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-au/attachments/20130503/deaad936/attachment-0001.html >> > >> >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> >> >> Message: 3 >> >> Date: Fri, 3 May 2013 15:47:02 +1000 >> >> From: Ian Sergeant <inas66+...@gmail.com> >> >> To: Ben Kelley <ben.kel...@gmail.com> >> >> Cc: OSM - Talk-au <Talk-au@openstreetmap.org> >> >> Subject: Re: [talk-au] Alphanumeric references in NSW >> >> Message-ID: >> >> <calda4yjaebwhjfczgsmc2yqdevjtquorqlvok-mkwzjgxxg...@mail.gmail.com> >> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" >> >> >> >> Agreed. >> >> >> >> I could see a strict "on-the-grounder" changing the ref for each road >> >> section :-) >> >> >> >> I've noticed Google Maps is using the A36 now for the Princes Hwy, but >> I've >> >> only seen one sign at Rockdale, so I still think it is too early to >> change >> >> the route in OSM, but I'm open to be convinced. >> >> >> >> But I think using the wiki to coordinate when a particular route has >> been >> >> referenced, and then we use old_ref to capture the previous route >> >> referencing. Currently when I use skobbler to do navigation its ugly >> >> moving back and forth in references between the same road. >> >> >> >> Ian. >> >> >> >> On 3 May 2013 15:33, Ben Kelley <ben.kel...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> >> >>> Hi. >> >>> >> >>> I have seen a few A15 signs on the New England Highway, but there are >> >>> still quite a few 43 and 15 signs along the route. The ground can >> still be >> >>> a bit confusing. >> >>> >> >>> - Ben Kelley. >> >>> On 3 May 2013 15:08, "Ian Sergeant" <inas66+...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >>> >> >>>> Hi, >> >>>> >> >>>> I've noticed a few people are changing the references in NSW to the >> >>>> alphanumeric references before the signage has changed. >> >>>> >> >>>> I don't see the purpose of this. I doesn't correspond to what is on >> the >> >>>> ground, it must be confusing to people actually trying to use OSM for >> >>>> navigation. Also, given it is the RTA coordinate this, it wouldn't >> be >> >>>> surprising if some of the routes actually differed from the proposed >> routes >> >>>> on the webpage. >> >>>> >> >>>> To the best of my knowledge the only route that has been >> re-referenced is >> >>>> the B73, the others still retain their existing signage - with >> perhaps an >> >>>> uncovered sign here and there. I traced the >> >>>> >> >>>> I'd suggest we can use the wiki to coordinate as these references >> >>>> change? That way we can ensure the entire route is renamed at once, >> >>>> rather than a patchwork? >> >>>> >> >>>> Ian. >> >>>> P.S. Of course there have been a few routes (M7, A31/M31 approaching >> >>>> Albury) that have been this way for a while, and aren't at issue >> here. >> >>>> _______________________________________________ >> >>>> Talk-au mailing list >> >>>> Talk-au@openstreetmap.org >> >>>> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au >> >> -------------- next part -------------- >> >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >> >> URL: < >> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-au/attachments/20130503/616a9529/attachment-0001.html >> > >> >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> >> >> Message: 4 >> >> Date: Fri, 3 May 2013 17:13:04 +1000 >> >> From: Ben Johnson <tangarar...@gmail.com> >> >> To: Ian Sergeant <inas66+...@gmail.com> >> >> Cc: OSM - Talk-au <Talk-au@openstreetmap.org> >> >> Subject: Re: [talk-au] Alphanumeric references in NSW >> >> Message-ID: <c1b0a966-8138-40ea-852c-a8a56e55a...@gmail.com> >> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" >> >> >> >> I agree this can be better coordinated, but not everyone uses or reads >> this list. >> >> >> >> I have a particular interest in these new routes? (don't ask). >> >> >> >> B74 is already majorly unveiled at the Tuggerah junction with M1 - so >> I turned B74 on in OSM. >> >> http://www.ozroads.com.au/NSW/Special/MAB/563.jpg >> >> http://www.ozroads.com.au/NSW/Special/MAB/558.jpg >> >> >> https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-vEehFafhUeo/UWnpzpBCuNI/AAAAAAAAALg/rKvL4389seo/s1600/IMG_3205.JPG >> >> >> >> We should expect large-scale coverplate removal any day now. RMS has >> been waiting until end of school holidays, and also I believe for the >> release of Sydway and UBD 2014 editions which apparently are now available >> with new route numbers? so I think we're about to see big changes fast. So >> brace yourselves. >> >> >> >> I'm going that way again tomorrow and will investigate B70 to see if >> there's any action there yet. I've created a few route relations for alphas >> in Central Coast and Newcastle region, but haven't set the ref tags yet >> until there is on-ground signage in place. This will make it easier (when >> the signs are unveiled) to select an entire route in JOSM and add the ref >> tag. If you agree with this method then I'm happy to volunteer to continue >> creating relations for the new routes. I have 5 weeks holidays starting >> soon with plenty of spare time and I want to get back into contributing to >> the project. >> >> >> >> What should become of the old routes? Should old_ref be retained, >> should old route relations remain? >> >> >> >> Regard hierachies - have we agreed that all A routes are Trunk, and >> all B routes are Primary? Should former the "State" routes (e.g. SR83 Old >> Pacific Hwy from Gosford to Doyalson) currently assigned as a Primary road >> now be lowered to Secondary as it loses its route number. >> >> >> >> Happy to help out - but I don't want to step on toes. >> >> >> >> BJ >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On 03/05/2013, at 3:07 PM, Ian Sergeant <inas66+...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> >> >>> Hi, >> >>> >> >>> I've noticed a few people are changing the references in NSW to the >> alphanumeric references before the signage has changed. >> >>> >> >>> I don't see the purpose of this. I doesn't correspond to what is on >> the ground, it must be confusing to people actually trying to use OSM for >> navigation. Also, given it is the RTA coordinate this, it wouldn't be >> surprising if some of the routes actually differed from the proposed routes >> on the webpage. >> >>> >> >>> To the best of my knowledge the only route that has been >> re-referenced is the B73, the others still retain their existing signage - >> with perhaps an uncovered sign here and there. I traced the >> >>> >> >>> I'd suggest we can use the wiki to coordinate as these references >> change? That way we can ensure the entire route is renamed at once, >> rather than a patchwork? >> >>> >> >>> Ian. >> >>> P.S. Of course there have been a few routes (M7, A31/M31 approaching >> Albury) that have been this way for a while, and aren't at issue here. >> _______________________________________________ >> >>> Talk-au mailing list >> >>> Talk-au@openstreetmap.org >> >>> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au >> >> >> >> -------------- next part -------------- >> >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >> >> URL: < >> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-au/attachments/20130503/fecea80f/attachment-0001.html >> > >> >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> >> >> Message: 5 >> >> Date: Fri, 3 May 2013 21:00:04 +1000 >> >> From: Ian Sergeant <inas66+...@gmail.com> >> >> To: Ben Johnson <tangarar...@gmail.com> >> >> Cc: OSM - Talk-au <Talk-au@openstreetmap.org> >> >> Subject: Re: [talk-au] Alphanumeric references in NSW >> >> Message-ID: >> >> <CALDa4YJeiNJcD-J3a=ywgi_fl3nm97or+gqnkewwjxchlwu...@mail.gmail.com> >> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252" >> >> >> >> On 3 May 2013 17:13, Ben Johnson <tangarar...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> >> >> >> >>> We should expect large-scale coverplate removal any day now. RMS has >> been >> >>> waiting until end of school holidays, and also I believe for the >> release of >> >>> Sydway and UBD 2014 editions which apparently are now available with >> new >> >>> route numbers? so I think we're about to see big changes fast. So >> brace >> >>> yourselves. >> >> If you're fairly confident, I would be happy to live with the new >> >> references a few weeks in advance, if that's what we decide. It is >> >> primarily just the hotch-potch I'd like to avoid. >> >> >> >> What should become of the old routes? Should old_ref be retained, >> should >> >>> old route relations remain? >> >> >> >> I think where it is easy to retain the old_ref during the transition we >> >> should. However, these routes have changed so many times, and we don't >> >> currently have the schema to retain every variation old route, so I >> see it >> >> just as a transitional thing. >> >> >> >> >> >>> Regard hierachies - have we agreed that all A routes are Trunk, and >> all B >> >>> routes are Primary? Should former the "State" routes (e.g. SR83 Old >> >>> Pacific Hwy from Gosford to Doyalson) currently assigned as a Primary >> road >> >>> now be lowered to Secondary as it loses its route number. >> >> >> >> I think reflects our current agreement. And finally we'll be able to >> have >> >> a deterministic algorithm at least for trunk and primary. >> >> >> >> I imagine the RMS in their wisdom are going to call the Hume south of >> >> Berrima the A31, rather than M31, so we'll have to make a call on >> whether >> >> we keep that as motorway. I'd personally be in favour of doing so. >> >> >> >> Ian. >> >> -------------- next part -------------- >> >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >> >> URL: < >> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-au/attachments/20130503/4696a56f/attachment.html >> > >> >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> >> Talk-au mailing list >> >> Talk-au@openstreetmap.org >> >> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au >> >> >> >> >> >> End of Talk-au Digest, Vol 71, Issue 2 >> >> ************************************** >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Talk-au mailing list >> > Talk-au@openstreetmap.org >> > http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Talk-au mailing list >> Talk-au@openstreetmap.org >> http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au >> > > > _______________________________________________ > Talk-au mailing list > Talk-au@openstreetmap.org > http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au > >
_______________________________________________ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
