Hi
1. & 4.DMMOs, of course, have a process. OSM should only be interested
in them once they been confirmed.
2. & 5. I'd be happy with them on paper. Their accuracy isn't great to
start with & every iteration looses detail. Amending the route of paths
is definitely not an armchair exercise. (Which is why I'm miffed an
experienced mapper close to me is amending on site surveyed paths to
align with DMs)
DaveF
On 31/05/2017 12:30, Adam Snape wrote:
Hi again,
Very much appreciate the effort being made on improving our coverage
of Rights of Way. It is a worthwhile area for OSMUK to look at.
Here are some further thoughts:
1., Dave refers to copies of Definitive Map Modification Orders
(DMMOs) on council websites. They are obliged to publish a register of
DMMO applications on their websites:
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2005/2461/regulation/2/made Whilst
these are a great source of information their use is limited for OSM
purposes because an application to change a map is just that, an
application. It may or may not be successful (see also point 4).
2. The Orders are paper based (usually scanned for uploading), not GIS
files which could be imported straight into OSM.
3. Many, many counties have yet to release ROW information under the
OSM-compatible Open Government Licence (thank you Robert for
clarifying this for me). Very few have released the accompanying
Definitive Statements. I suggest that acquiring nationwide
availability of at least the Definitive Maps (and preferably the
statements where they exist in a digital form) is a much more urgent
priority than the relatively small proportion of paths that have been
subject to recent changes for which we do not yet have updated shape
files.
4. If we do end up receiving copies of Orders, like the Ramblers,
PNFS, CTC, BHS et al it is important that whoever deals with it
should understand the process and that we should not be altering our
mapping for everything we receive. For example, just making the DMMO
does not change the definitive map. There is a period for objections
to be received in response to the Order and possible referral to the
Secretary of State. The final stage is for an order to be confirmed.
It is ony this final stage which actually changes the definitive line
or status of the path. There may be many years (not uncommonly a
decade or more) between the DMMO application, the making of the Order,
and its confirmation.
5. Finally, I'd be wary of 'armchair mapping' recent changes without a
ground survey. The advantage of being up to date ceases to be a
benefit when changes have not yet been effected on the ground.
Hope that helps.
Kind regards,
Adam
On 30 May 2017 at 14:13, Adam Snape <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
Hi,
One thing that springs to mind is that these organisations receive
orders as they are statutory consultees who may wish to object to
the order. It isn't just to keep these organisations up to date. I
suspect a request by osm to be notified of changes just to keep
might get the response that orders are already available to the
public.
It seems what we're really asking for is an equivalent of
councils' obligation to send Ordnance Survey notification of
confirmed changes rather than their obligation to notify statutory
consultees throughout the DMMO process.
Adam
On 29 May 2017 12:04 p.m., "Brian Prangle" <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
There's been a suggestion that OSMUK lobbiesfor the statutory
right to receive copies of the legal orders which change
Public Rights of Way as it can be slow for any official
changes to make their way onto the Definitive Map and then be
picked up by mappers. There is already legislation that allows
various organisations the right to receive copies of the legal
orders that effect changes to Public Rights of Way. The list
is contained in Schedule 6 of the Wildlife and Countryside
(Definitive Maps and Statements) Regulations 1993:
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1993/12/schedule/6/made
<http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1993/12/schedule/6/made>
These are:
Auto-Cycle Union
British Horse Society
Byways and Bridleways Trust, Open Spaces Society
Ramblers Association
British Driving Society
Cyclists Touring Club
Peak and Northern Footpaths Society
Chiltern Society
Welsh Trail Riders' Association
The Board has discussed this and agreed we should do it. I've
volunteered to lead this activity. We think that we would
need to convince the relevant Secretary of State that it was a
good idea, and get them to amend/re-issue the Statutory
Instrument linked above that includes the list. From the
introductory text, it looks like it's jointly the Secretaries
of State for the Environment and Wales.
My thinking on how we should approach this is first to contact
each of the organisations who are already on the list and ask
1. Were they added at the time the legislation was passed or
subsequently?
2. If subsequently, do they know the procedure?
3. How is the data provided to them?
4. What licence terms does it have?
5. If it's open data would they be willing to share it with
us until we get on the list?
If anybody has any knowledge or experience of this legislation
or any contacts at these organisations or any other ideas on
how to approach this campaign we'd love to know either here or
on the OSMUK Loomio
<https://www.loomio.org/g/M3fz1PkQ/openstreetmap-uk>
discussion site.
Regards
Brian
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