On Tue, Jan 01, 2019 at 11:37:09AM -0500, D. Hugh Redelmeier via talk wrote: > | From: James Knott via talk <[email protected]> > > | On 01/01/2019 12:48 AM, D. Hugh Redelmeier via talk wrote: > | > + I like the keyboard. US, not the Bilingual Canadian layout. > | > | It's bilingual because English and French speakers hate it equally! ;-) > > It's complicated. I will now demonstrate this. > > STOP READING HERE IF YOU ARE NOT INTERESTED IN MINUTIAE. > > We'd all think it was fine if we grew up with it. But most of us have > not. > > To the extent that one hunts and pecks it would probably be OK. > > Those who think that being able to type other languages is important, > should support this keyboard. I guess that "Knott" indicates scots > ancestors > <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scottish_Gaelic_orthography> > > But my fingers learned to touchtype more than 50 years ago and are set > in their ways. > > It's actually annoying to try to figure out the standard these > keyboards are supposed to conform to. > > The bilingual keyboard is apparently an instantiation of an ISO > standard where the US keyboard is an ANSI standard. > <https://deskthority.net/wiki/ANSI_vs_ISO> > By default, I'd like to conform to ISO vs ANSI since I'm not a US > Citizen (even so, I once was a member of an ANSI committee). > > The actual standard for the keyboard is probably CAN/CSA Z243.200-92. > That is dated 1992 and reaffirmed in 2016. It costs money (roughly > $100!) to get a copy. > > "All CSA PDF's now have Digital Rights Management (DRM) features: > - Unlimited PDF access on any internet browser connected devices > (desktop, laptop, tablet, mobile phone). One License can be shared > among many users. Use will be restricted to one concurrent session at > a time. > -Ability to download an offline browser accessed PDF on up to 3 > devices. > -Ability to print one complete copy on paper or as a standalone PDF. > -All PDF's will be watermarked with your license information. > > For more informaiton call 1-(888)-361-0003" > > I hate DRM. > > The most useful discussion I've found is from the Quebec government. > <https://www.tresor.gouv.qc.ca/ressources-informationnelles/architecture-dentreprise-gouvernementale/standards-et-normes/standard-sur-le-clavier-quebecois-sgqri-001/> > > Fun fact: the Quebec page gives alternative names for the keyboard, and > one is "clavier LaBonté". LaBonté is a guy I've actually talked to (years > ago). He's one of the committee members who managed to get iso8859-1 > depricated (in favour of iso8859-15) because of a fight amongst > francophones over OE (dipthong or ligature?). Of course the intro of the > Euro symbol helped a lot. > > This does not match the engravings on any keyboard I have: > <http://www.oqlf.gouv.qc.ca/images/ti/clavier.gif> > It seems telling that this is from Quebec's Office de la langue > francaise. > > LaBonté wrote > <https://www.tresor.gouv.qc.ca/fileadmin/PDF/ressources_informationnelles/standard_clavier_quebecois/ISO_9995-7.pdf> > > Among its dubious claims is that in Canada, English writers use '.' or > ',' as the "decimal sign" in "general usage" but French writers always > use ','. I'd suggest the reverse. > > He also suggests replacing / and * for division and multiplication. > Good luck with that.
If the laptops shipped with the Canadian Multilingual keyboard, I might actually not mind. But they don't. They ship with Canadian French, which is a totally different thing and is NOT a version of the ISO international keyboard. At least last time I saw a laptop in a store it was Canadian French, not Multilingual. I have read a claim that someone at IBM in Toronto that hated Quebec invented the Canadian French keyboard. I think I believe the story. Canadian French has « and » on the key taking up half of the left shift. A Canadian Multilingual instead has Ù and | on that key. Usually Canadian French has a vertical enter key, while the Multilingual usually has the horizontal enter key (like most US layout keyboards have too). -- Len Sorensen --- Talk Mailing List [email protected] https://gtalug.org/mailman/listinfo/talk
