Hi Again: I had turned of the mouse voice setting and the phantom speech went away for at least several days. I did encounter problems reading some context menu items and when I turned the mouse voice back on they read properly. During testing I have set the mouse voice up quite a bit so I can instantly recognize when it speaks. Yesterday twice, out of being on the computer most of the day, I heard the mouse voice speak what I had either tabbed to or arrowed over - I forget if the normal voice spoke the same text after and was waiting for it to happen again to detail the problem but it has not happened again yet. I don't remember if I was in a context menu, on the Desktop or in Internet Explorer but for sure the mouse is reading things behind the scenes without any user interaction as Jim had mentioned and why I tried turning the mouse voice off. As I told Chris I have the track mouse with cursor csetting turned off in the WE Control Panel dialog. Just a heads up that WE will try to speak things without any user interaction requesting speech via what seems to be mouse movement behind the scenes and is required, likely, for WE to handle some things like that situation with the Context Menu not reading all the entries unles I arrowed, cycled through it a few times. So, with the mouse voice on I get one set of phantom speech and perhaps focus problems and with the mouse voice off I get a diferent set of problems and focus problems - considering not being able to find to click on a context menu item a focus problem which it actually may not be but then if you cant read it you cant focus it. I did find the missing menu items even with the mouse voice turned off, by cycling through what sounded like a changing set of MenuItems a couple of times and they were spoken by the correct cursor voice. I wonder if that was due to turning the mouse voice feature back on or if it is a timing problem with WindowEyes code base and, or, scripts. I was in the My Computer list of available folders I think so may try to reproduce it by turning the mouse voice on and off and trying that windows feature to see if it is reproducable. What a hassle, good thing WindowEyes is pretty much free. Rick USA Rick USA
-----Original Message----- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+ofbgmail=mi.rr....@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Rick Thomas via Talk Sent: Monday, May 25, 2015 6:27 AM To: 'Chris Grabowski'; 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: RE: Problem Patterns Continued Hi Chris: I have had it turned off in WE Control Panel all along. I just verified it is still turned off, status off. Rick USA -----Original Message----- From: Chris Grabowski [mailto:cgrabow...@aisquared.com] Sent: Monday, May 25, 2015 5:10 AM To: Rick Thomas; Window-Eyes Discussion List Subject: RE: Problem Patterns Continued Rick, Turn off track mouse with focus. Mouse/other. With this option enabled, your telling Window-eyes to move the mouse pointer wherever the focus goes, it is not necessary. Chris Window-Eyes Product Support Ai Squared 725 Airport North Office Park Fort Wayne, IN 46825 (802) 362-3612 www.aisquared.com -----Original Message----- From: Talk [mailto:talk-bounces+cgrabowski=aisquared....@lists.window-eyes.com] On Behalf Of Rick Thomas via Talk Sent: Sunday, May 24, 2015 7:54 AM To: 'Window-Eyes Discussion List' Subject: Problem Patterns Continued Hi Guys: OK, after having turned off the mouse voice setting the phantom speech went away. But, now when in some lists like the "This Computer" list of drives and reviewing the Context Menuu or in my own program WindowEyes will sometimes start reading a list item then stop, speech is cut off before the end of the list item with focus. Also, in the list sometimes I hear 2 items read after hitting the down arrow key instead of just one. Also, some list items are not read at all unless I ReRead the list several times - it seems they are there sometimes and not there other times. So I turned the mouse voice back on. I went into the "This Computer" and the Context Menu items read very well except for a phantom word "graphic" reading on the first item indicating again that the WindowEyes use of the mouse related to dynamic content is likely causing problems. This is not good since if I turn it off I don't get phantom speech but it seems I have even more serious problems, sigh. The real situation here seems to lie with the underlying mechanism WindowEyes is using to monitor dynamic content and execute speech. I am not sure there is anything a end user like me can do to improve or work-around these what appear to be fundemental WindowEyes buggs since they may lie in the design of their code rather than just being a simple bugg. Also, just thinking, allot of the dynamic stuff is handled by using a delay before speeking something to ensure it is fully displayed before reading it. Here is something I thought of: A control starts to read, another dynamic feature happens and WindowEyes chopps off the speech or doesn't speak it as the second read happens and is trying to read either before the wait time is up on the first read or in the middle of reading it thus chopping it off - now, there is no way of checking something like this out since multiple main code and multiple scripts are all handling dynamic and focus changes at the same time which makes trying to analyze these types of problems impossible from my view of the WindowEyes platform. If my test are accurate, and they well may not be since everything is so dynamic and the problems so many and so intermittant, there are fundemental design flaws in the WindowEyes platform that need to be ironed out or WindowEyes will remain very unstable and the symptoms may seem so diferent from test to test that trying to nail down the problem will be close to impossible. The current and past tests are indicative of how fixing one problem will cause another problem with the current design if my analysis is correct and, again don't get mad, it may be incorrect since I can only see symptoms and not the entire code base to try and debug the code base. Even if I were a programmer with access to it trying to figure out if the problem was in the underlying code base, could be in several places if messages are processed on demand, or in one of several scripts conflicting with each other due to timing as mentioned above or other problems related to how WindowEyes handles dynamic content changes while trying to handle visible focus changes with the standard tab and arrow keys. There are some good WindowEyes folks on this list and the scripting list so if all this gives you any ideas perhaps you could suggest something or work with AI2 to help them fix WindowEyes so it is more stable. I don't have the time nor WindowEyes experience to handle such a project. But, if the AI2 guys are still reading this list they may benefit from this thread and consider their options. Rick USA _______________________________________________ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/cgrabowski%40a isquared.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com _______________________________________________ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/ofbgmail%40mi. rr.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com _______________________________________________ Any views or opinions presented in this email are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of Ai Squared. For membership options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/options.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com/archive%40mail-archive.com. For subscription options, visit http://lists.window-eyes.com/listinfo.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com List archives can be found at http://lists.window-eyes.com/private.cgi/talk-window-eyes.com
