Hello Allie! On Tuesday, June 14, 2005, 6:01 PM, you wrote:
>>> b) memory problems. After running the program for more than two >>> hours, when I shut down, lots of hanging and then sometimes I have to >>> kill the program. Version 25 was a little better, not much. >> >> No such problem here. So, could you detail further circumstances of >> your specific set-up that might help the developers pinpoint why this >> is happening to you and not to most of the rest of us? > What more information would be helpful here? Allie, I am so very ignorant. I didn't mean to open a can of worms or to make Jerry feel that his observations aren't wanted, and I just now said so to him. But, I thought maybe he could say what other programs were running concurrent with TB! when he shuts it down, whether maybe the CC thought it should still be completing a task (I've seen that happen myself a long time ago, as early as v. 2.xx), and what the Task Manager was saying about all of it. I thought that Jerry knows a lot more about programs than I do--just as I think that you do, Allie--and that he could add something to his report of "hanging" on shut-down. > Anyway, to give Ethan something to test, I can confirm the increased > memory consumption. The 'good part' being that if you don't have TB! > set to always have its icon in the systray, the memory is released on > minimizing TB!.. I'm glad to have you add this. I remembered your having said something along those lines, just couldn't remember when. >>> d) Overall, a noted decrease in speed and performance over the last >>> official release. >> >> Again, this is way too general a comment to help anyone pinpoint >> what's going wrong for you. :( > Apart from some objective evidence, i.e., actual timings to help > eliminate subjectivity, I don't see what more can be said here.. Well, yes, compare times in numbers between the releases that ran well for him and those that didn't. And whether he was running the same mix of programs alongside The Bat! with the older versions that ran fast enough as with v. 3.5.25 and v. 3.5.26. > What specifically would you wish to know? Well, maybe, is his OS in general running slow? Would he be willing to put say, v. 3.0.2.10 or perhaps v. 3.1.33 back on his machine for a little while and actually time the difference in speed? >> "Overall," I think, will not be constructive or helpful criticism. >> >> What's needed are specific reports of exact circumstances--when >> confirmed, these can be added to the Bug Track issues pages, where >> they can be assigned to specific programmers for work. > If the problem isn't specific, how can one give a specific report. One > can only report that they aren't happy and what the general problem is. True. And then we read these reports over a period of days and weeks, and no one answers, so I thought maybe we could get a description with some numerical measurements in it and get a developer to answer. > That's a start; i.e., communicating that you're not happy. Only the > developers or someone highly experienced in development and beta > testing etc. can point the person reporting in the right direction. > They're the ones that will have ideas about what could be wrong and ask > for the relevant information. Yes. I don't know what the developers need. I just know that I have seen people like 9Val and Maxim over and over on this list--when they actually began to pay attention and work on someone's problem--ask for a more specific description. > I've been there many times, i.e., starting general and being asked > specifics by developers. Things are mentioned that I'd just never think > of. If the reporter has specific circumstances, they'll usually state > it. Just asking for it without any guidance doesn't help. Frankly, I > don't know what to ask, but I sure acknowledge that he *is* having a > problem, even though I may not be able to duplicate it. Well, that's why I started talking to Jerry. I saw that he had a problem--even though my set-up with v. 3.5.26 is not exhibiting that problem. I wanted to help get some attention for it, as he seemed to feel he was not getting that attention. The same way that I wanted to understand and help with Avi's CC foreground/background problem. >>> ...Furthermore, IMAP is still "questionable" at best. I've given up >>> on that front and use other programs if IMAP is required. >> >> Well, Jerry! Again, non-specific complaining. Everyone knows that IMAP >> is receiving serious work in the current beta series, or at least I >> would guess, everyone *should* know!! > I know, and I'm quietly using Mulberry here. Serious work doesn't take > this situation away... at least not yet. I don't really see it as a > complaint. He's stating his problems as you asked him to. The whole > IMAP deal is a can of worms and I fully understand his making a general > comment and not really getting into it. What would be the point of it? > It's so heavily discussed already. He's just mentioning it as part of > his pool of problems that you were curious about. I truly did want specific descriptions, though. I guess I didn't make that clear when I first wrote to him. >> I think, just my own opinion, the questions and complaints of the beta >> testers should be at least as specific and concise as Maxim's >> above-quoted list. :) > It cannot always be like that. I doubt it will ever be like that. He > has control, and he made specific changes that he can report on. Well, it's a goal to shoot for. > OTOH, I may just see high memory usage ... and I just report what I see > and wait for further instructions. Quite often, and this memory issue > makes a good example, fixes are made without any query for specifics > after we simply reported the problem. But, Jerry says he is *still* seeing high memory usage. >> For the sake of everyone's peace of mind, I hope that you will get >> some real (that is, road-map-type news), too. But I think the general >> direction of the work is clear, and that we can be most helpful by >> staying very specific in what we report and ask for on TBBETA. > That's an ideal that, IMO, will never be realized under the current > circumstances. I see something close to that ideal on other lists, but > the current conditions and communication levels make this a highly > unlikely thing to happen here. I do see your point. However, Maxim is clearly reading us and clearly concerning himself with the OTFE and installation issues. I know he's a good programmer and good also at dealing with the public and with his beta testers. I just truly would like to see a little appreciation offered along with the presentation of problems. And I would like for those of us presenting problems to give as much information as we can think of when we tell about them. <friendly smile> -- Best regards, Mary The Bat 3.5.26 on Windows XP 5.1 2600 Service Pack 2 ________________________________________________________ Current beta is 3.5.26 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html IMPORTANT: To register as a Beta tester, use this link first - http://www.ritlabs.com/en/partners/testers/
