On Feb 17, 12:30am, Robert Elz wrote: } } Date: Sat, 16 Feb 2019 15:02:58 -0000 (UTC) } From: chris...@astron.com (Christos Zoulas) } Message-ID: <q498n2$3f0j$1...@blaine.gmane.org> } } What I do replace from base (every time) is postfix (by sendmail). } Somehow I doubt that a request to stick sendmail back in base is } going to get very far.
I would support it. :-) But, I agree with you that it would be pretty pointless to make the proposal. You would get a crap ton of people jumping up and down, screaming stuff about security, even with: i386devel: {169} cvs up pkg-vulnerabilities M pkg-vulnerabilities (the local mods are all related to Asterisk) i386devel: {170} grep -ic sendmail pkg-vulnerabilities 15 i386devel: {171} grep -ic postfix pkg-vulnerabilities 18 Some will argue about ease of configuration and this can certainly be a valid argument. I've been configuring sendmail since the late '80s, i.e. before the M4 days. I also make extensive use of milters. With postfix, I know enough to get it to forward to a smart mailer, which will be sendmail. I don't know how to configure it to do the stuff that I do with sendmail. However, I do recogonise that having a simple well commented config file will be easier for most people, especially those that don't have highly complex special situations. } | As features become standard to other OS's we should evaluate if } | we should follow suit. } } That's reaosnable. But "XYZ has it, so so should we" or "XYZ has it } and I like it" are not reasons - what we need to discover is what we } are missing (what we cannot achieve) without it. or what is much } harder. If something adds some ability that is either lacking, or } very difficuly to achieve any other way, then sure, we should add it. } If all it would achieve is making NetBSD look the same as XYZ, then } we should not. +1 } ps: Also in this discussion there has been menytion of "ls -F". I had } always assumed that we had that utter crud only because POSIX says that } it is required, I never imagined that anyone would actually use that } nonsense. Eg: } } jinx$ ls -F } x* y* } } What do you deduce from that? If you thing there are two files, x and } y, and they're both executable, then, sorry, you're wrong. But even } with that knowledge, what do you know now? Anything at all? I very } much doubt it (except that there are two files in '.'). The only part } of ls -F that works, is the '/' to indicate directories, but that's } not needed, as "ls -d */." or just "echo */." work to tell you what } sub-dirs exist in the current directory (and do it better). } } Whever designed that option (the way that it works) is a cretin. } } The way to find out what kind of things exist in a directory is to use } ls -l and look at the mode bits, or use stat - or write a simple script } to use one of those (or find) to extract whatever info you actually need, } which will almost certainly be different than what I need. It has been } that way since the early Bell Labs versions, and nothing anyone has ever } done t attempt to make it better, or easier (in any environment) has } achieved either of those goals, as best I can tell. Nothing. Wow! Quite the rant. I use ls -F all the time and find it to be very useful. I've been using it since I first touched a unix-like system somewhere in the late '80s. The alternatives that you mention certainly work, but are more cumbersome. I agree that they may be needed in some situations as they are more "authoritative". After all, there is nothing stopping somebody from naming a regular file "x*", which would be quite annoying, since the only characters that can't appear in a file name are "/" and "(null)". What is interesting about this rant is that many people use colorls to do what "ls -F" does (i.e. distinguish regular files from directories and executables). This means that your rant mostly applies to colorls as well, except that colorls won't mix up regular file "x*" with executable file "x". However, since I don't know what the different colours mean (and they would disappear if I send the output to a pipe/file) they convey absolutely no useful information to me (and likely many others not coming from a certain environment). On a side note, I once had an issue with a "/" appearing in a filename. It was on a system that acted as an NFS server to Macs. MacOS used ":" as the directory separator so "/" was allowed. This was obviously a bug in the NFS server software. I ended up using cleari followed by fsck to get rid of that nasty little thing. It was probably the only time that I used cleari. }-- End of excerpt from Robert Elz