On Mon, May 15, 2023 at 09:42:47AM -0400, Bryan Steele wrote: > On Mon, May 15, 2023 at 09:17:00AM -0400, Okan Demirmen wrote: > > On Mon 2023.05.15 at 10:41 +0200, Matthieu Herrb wrote: > > > On Mon, May 15, 2023 at 06:26:41AM +0000, Klemens Nanni wrote: > > > > Both fvwm(1) and twm(1) have a restart menu that contains other window > > > > managers by default, which is useful if you want to switch around > > > > without restarting X and/or custom window manager config. > > > > > > > > cwm(1) only offers to restart into itself by deafult. > > > > Add the other two we ship by default so users can round trip between > > > > them. > > > > > > > > Feedback? OK? > > > > > > Last year I mentionned that I think we should retire twm. It's really > > > too old and missing support for the modern window managers hints. > > > > > > People still using it should switch to cwm or maybe ctwm from ports > > > (to keep the same configurarion system), or someone should step up to > > > maintain it and enhance it with exwmh support. (but this is somehow > > > just wasting time imho).
I don't know anything about twm, so I'll leave that to others. > > > > > > Otherwise ok to add this and fix the other WM menus for other window > > > managers (those parts of the configs are already local changes in > > > Xenocara) > > > > I might argue the opposite, to remove cwm from fvwm and twm restart menus, > > if > > this inconsistency is a real concern. The entries in fvwm/twm are in the > > (shipped) example config files, where-as below it is, well, there for good > > with > > no user choice. Heck, how often to do people even use this restart wm to > > another WM outside of playing around? Most window managers handle restarts > > differently, regardless of what ICCCM/EWMH says) and even then, crossing > > window > > managers like this introduces inconsistencies. It's fine for playing around > > I > > suppose, but is it really a demanded "workflow"? It is convenient for testing because you keep all your windows and don't have to login out and in again; that's about it for me. > > > > PS: fwvm and twm menus more programs we don't ship, e.g. "wm2", and > > > > twm dies when failing to execute them (fvwm and cwm keeps running); > > > > do we want to keep those default-broken entries around? > > > > I'd support removing them. > > +1 > > I don't think hardcoding window managers into cwm makes sense. I don't > think anyone is actually switching around WMs at runtime like this. Except for cwm itself, since that's how you reload the cwmrc(5). No idea how fvwm(1) handles config reload and/or state across restart. > If the point is for new users to have an example that provides a list > of alternative WMs, perhaps this is a man page issue and they should > be added to "SEE ALSO" sections. Sure, these can't hurt. > > -Bryan. > I prefer consistency across base window managers, so if we don't want users to hop around by default, here's a tentative diff to remove foreign window managers from fvwm. Lef click -> Root Menu -> (Re)Start no lists xterm and fvm itself, the latter results in an appearent restart and a new FvwmPager process whilst 'fvwm -s' remains on the same PID (I don't use fvwm). There are multiple configs, I changed all containing cwm or twm. So something like this? Not touching twm (assuming it goes away) or cwm (needs itself for reload). Index: sample.fvwmrc/system.fvwm2rc =================================================================== RCS file: /cvs/xenocara/app/fvwm/sample.fvwmrc/system.fvwm2rc,v retrieving revision 1.2 diff -u -p -r1.2 system.fvwm2rc --- sample.fvwmrc/system.fvwm2rc 15 Aug 2019 16:15:04 -0000 1.2 +++ sample.fvwmrc/system.fvwm2rc 16 May 2023 02:31:40 -0000 @@ -196,13 +196,6 @@ AddToMenu Quit-Verify "Really Quit Fvwm + "Restart Fvwm2" Restart fvwm2 + "Restart Fvwm" Restart fvwm + "" Nop -+ "Start twm" Restart twm -+ "Start ctwm" Restart ctwm -+ "Start tvtwm" Restart tvtwm -+ "Start vtwm" Restart vtwm -+ "Start mwm" Restart mwm -+ "Start olwm" Restart /usr/openwin/bin/olwm -+ "" Nop + "Start dummy" Restart xterm + "" Nop + "No, Don't Quit" Nop Index: sample.fvwmrc/system.fvwm2rc-sample-1 =================================================================== RCS file: /cvs/xenocara/app/fvwm/sample.fvwmrc/system.fvwm2rc-sample-1,v retrieving revision 1.1.1.1 diff -u -p -r1.1.1.1 system.fvwm2rc-sample-1 --- sample.fvwmrc/system.fvwm2rc-sample-1 26 Nov 2006 10:53:57 -0000 1.1.1.1 +++ sample.fvwmrc/system.fvwm2rc-sample-1 16 May 2023 02:21:06 -0000 @@ -206,10 +206,6 @@ AddToMenu Quit-Verify "Really Quit Fvwm + "Yes, Really Quit" Quit + "Restart Fvwm2" Restart fvwm2 + "Restart Fvwm" Restart fvwm -+ "Start twm" Restart twm -+ "Start mwm" Restart mwm -+ "Start olwm" Restart /usr/openwin/bin/olwm -+ "Start tvtwm" Restart vtwm + "Start dummy" Restart xterm + "" Nop + "No, Don't Quit" Nop Index: sample.fvwmrc/system.fvwmrc =================================================================== RCS file: /cvs/xenocara/app/fvwm/sample.fvwmrc/system.fvwmrc,v retrieving revision 1.10 diff -u -p -r1.10 system.fvwmrc --- sample.fvwmrc/system.fvwmrc 24 Jan 2021 20:30:56 -0000 1.10 +++ sample.fvwmrc/system.fvwmrc 16 May 2023 02:31:34 -0000 @@ -205,15 +205,6 @@ AddToMenu Module-Popup "FvwmModules" Tit AddToMenu Quit-Verify + "Restart Fvwm%mini.refresh.xpm%" Restart fvwm + "" Nop -+ "Start cwm" Restart cwm -+ "Start wm2" Restart wm2 -+ "Start twm" Restart twm -+ "Start ctwm" Restart ctwm -+ "Start flwm" Restart flwm -+ "Start mwm" Restart mwm -+ "Start openbox" Restart openbox -+ "Start tvtwm" Restart tvtwm -+ "" Nop + "Start dummy%mini.xterm.xpm%" Restart xterm + "" Nop + "No, Don't Quit" Nop
