texascavers Digest 24 Mar 2014 13:55:23 -0000 Issue 1951
Topics (messages 23601 through 23617):
R.I.P. Speleo Digest
23601 by: Mixon Bill
23602 by: Logan McNatt
23603 by: Preston Forsythe
23604 by: Butch Fralia \(CAVEDBA\)
23605 by: Mark Minton
23606 by: David
23607 by: George Veni
NSS Library Update
23608 by: Preston Forsythe
on-line newsletters
23609 by: Mixon Bill
23610 by: Mark Minton
23616 by: Mark Minton
bibliographies
23611 by: Mixon Bill
23612 by: George Veni
searching for info
23613 by: Mixon Bill
23614 by: George Veni
Preserving Your Speleo-Library and other items
23615 by: Carl Kunath
NSS Earth Day Collage
23617 by: NSS Announcements
Administrivia:
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--- Begin Message ---
I see from the minutes of the NSS Board of Governors meeting on March
15 that the Speleo Digest series, the last issue of which was for
2003, is now officially dead. That's a shame, but it seems to
acknowledge reality. The series reprinted the best material out of
grotto newsletters during the title year, and was essentially _the_
library of American caves and caving. It was started by the Pittsburgh
Grotto in 1956. Production was taken over by the NSS for the 1964 issue.
I edited and prepared two or three issues back around 1970. The amount
of material in each issue has more than doubled since then; the 2003
has almost 600 pages of three-column small type. On the other hand, I
had to retype everything on a typewriter and assemble the pages with
scissors and paste. Modern technology and the ability to request files
for most of the articles from the publishing grottos ought to have
compensated, it seems to me, but nevertheless getting it out proved to
be beyond volunteers. Of course as the years went by, the interest in
working on an issue years out of date decreased. (The 2003 didn't
actually come out until 2007.)
Many of the more recent issues are available as PDF files on the NSS
web site at
https://secure.caves.org/nss-business/publications/Speleo_Digest/index.shtml
NSS members will have to log on with their NSS number and zip code.
Many are also available to anybody at the Karst Information Portal
http://www.karstportal.org/search/site
Search for Speleo Digest.
Without the Speleo Digest, a lot of great cave explorations and maps
published locally are essentially inaccessible. Sigh. -- Bill Mixon
----------------------------------------
If you can't say something nice, come and sit by me.
----------------------------------------
You may "reply" to the address this message
came from, but for long-term use, save:
Personal: [email protected]
AMCS: [email protected] or [email protected]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Thanks for the news, Bill, which will mean something only to the older generations of cavers, many of whom probably still have their collection
of Speleo Digests. They certainly were a good resource in the pre-digital years, and I'm glad to know that some of them are available online.
Thanks for your part in producing several of them.
On 3/20/2014 7:26 PM, Mixon Bill wrote:
I see from the minutes of the NSS Board of Governors meeting on March 15 that the Speleo Digest series, the last issue of which was for 2003,
is now officially dead. That's a shame, but it seems to acknowledge reality. The series reprinted the best material out of grotto newsletters
during the title year, and was essentially _the_ library of American caves and caving. It was started by the Pittsburgh Grotto in 1956.
Production was taken over by the NSS for the 1964 issue.
I edited and prepared two or three issues back around 1970. The amount of material in each issue has more than doubled since then; the 2003
has almost 600 pages of three-column small type. On the other hand, I had to retype everything on a typewriter and assemble the pages with
scissors and paste. Modern technology and the ability to request files for most of the articles from the publishing grottos ought to have
compensated, it seems to me, but nevertheless getting it out proved to be beyond volunteers. Of course as the years went by, the interest in
working on an issue years out of date decreased. (The 2003 didn't actually come out until 2007.)
Without the Speleo Digest, a lot of great cave explorations and maps published
locally are essentially inaccessible. Sigh. -- Bill Mixon
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
All Grotto newsletters should be available at the NSS Library in Huntsville.
If not then someone failed to send the NSS a copy.
Preston
---------------------------------------------------------------
----- Original Message -----
From: "Logan McNatt" <[email protected]>
To: "Mixon Bill" <[email protected]>; "Cavers Texas"
<[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2014 8:04 PM
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] R.I.P. Speleo Digest
Thanks for the news, Bill, which will mean something only to the older
generations of cavers, many of whom probably still have their collection
of Speleo Digests. They certainly were a good resource in the pre-digital
years, and I'm glad to know that some of them are available online. Thanks
for your part in producing several of them.
On 3/20/2014 7:26 PM, Mixon Bill wrote:
I see from the minutes of the NSS Board of Governors meeting on March 15
that the Speleo Digest series, the last issue of which was for 2003, is
now officially dead. That's a shame, but it seems to acknowledge reality.
The series reprinted the best material out of grotto newsletters during
the title year, and was essentially _the_ library of American caves and
caving. It was started by the Pittsburgh Grotto in 1956. Production was
taken over by the NSS for the 1964 issue.
I edited and prepared two or three issues back around 1970. The amount of
material in each issue has more than doubled since then; the 2003 has
almost 600 pages of three-column small type. On the other hand, I had to
retype everything on a typewriter and assemble the pages with scissors
and paste. Modern technology and the ability to request files for most of
the articles from the publishing grottos ought to have compensated, it
seems to me, but nevertheless getting it out proved to be beyond
volunteers. Of course as the years went by, the interest in working on an
issue years out of date decreased. (The 2003 didn't actually come out
until 2007.)
Without the Speleo Digest, a lot of great cave explorations and maps
published locally are essentially inaccessible. Sigh. -- Bill Mixon
---------------------------------------------------------------------
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
That's not necessarily electronic where those not hanging around Huntsville
can access.
A good bunch of volunteers could probably digitize them in a couple of
years.
\
Butch Fralia
3412 Walton Ave.
Fort Worth, TX 76133-2230
[email protected]
(Home) 817 346-2039
(Cell) 817 229-7693
-----Original Message-----
From: Preston Forsythe [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2014 9:00 PM
To: [email protected]; Mixon Bill; Cavers Texas
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] R.I.P. Speleo Digest
All Grotto newsletters should be available at the NSS Library in Huntsville.
If not then someone failed to send the NSS a copy.
Preston
---------------------------------------------------------------
----- Original Message -----
From: "Logan McNatt" <[email protected]>
To: "Mixon Bill" <[email protected]>; "Cavers Texas"
<[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2014 8:04 PM
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] R.I.P. Speleo Digest
> Thanks for the news, Bill, which will mean something only to the older
> generations of cavers, many of whom probably still have their collection
> of Speleo Digests. They certainly were a good resource in the pre-digital
> years, and I'm glad to know that some of them are available online. Thanks
> for your part in producing several of them.
>
>
> On 3/20/2014 7:26 PM, Mixon Bill wrote:
>> I see from the minutes of the NSS Board of Governors meeting on March 15
>> that the Speleo Digest series, the last issue of which was for 2003, is
>> now officially dead. That's a shame, but it seems to acknowledge reality.
>> The series reprinted the best material out of grotto newsletters during
>> the title year, and was essentially _the_ library of American caves and
>> caving. It was started by the Pittsburgh Grotto in 1956. Production was
>> taken over by the NSS for the 1964 issue.
>>
>> I edited and prepared two or three issues back around 1970. The amount of
>> material in each issue has more than doubled since then; the 2003 has
>> almost 600 pages of three-column small type. On the other hand, I had to
>> retype everything on a typewriter and assemble the pages with scissors
>> and paste. Modern technology and the ability to request files for most of
>> the articles from the publishing grottos ought to have compensated, it
>> seems to me, but nevertheless getting it out proved to be beyond
>> volunteers. Of course as the years went by, the interest in working on an
>> issue years out of date decreased. (The 2003 didn't actually come out
>> until 2007.)
>>
>> Without the Speleo Digest, a lot of great cave explorations and maps
>> published locally are essentially inaccessible. Sigh. -- Bill Mixon
>>
>>
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> Visit our website: http://texascavers.com
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected]
> For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected]
>
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Visit our website: http://texascavers.com
To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected]
For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
A better solution might be for all grottos, regions, etc.
that publish newsletters to send them to the Karst Information
Portal. They already process a number of regional publications
(including the NSS News and Texas Caver) and OCR the text so that it
is searchable. The NSS could theoretically do the same, but it seems
less likely to actually get done, at least in the short term. (The
NSS still does not have electronic records of all past NSS members,
for example.)
Mark
At 10:29 PM 3/20/2014, Butch Fralia \(CAVEDBA\) wrote:
That's not necessarily electronic where those not hanging around Huntsville
can access.
A good bunch of volunteers could probably digitize them in a couple of
years.
\
Butch Fralia
3412 Walton Ave.
Fort Worth, TX 76133-2230
[email protected]
(Home) 817 346-2039
(Cell) 817 229-7693
-----Original Message-----
From: Preston Forsythe [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2014 9:00 PM
To: [email protected]; Mixon Bill; Cavers Texas
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] R.I.P. Speleo Digest
All Grotto newsletters should be available at the NSS Library in Huntsville.
If not then someone failed to send the NSS a copy.
Preston
---------------------------------------------------------------
----- Original Message -----
From: "Logan McNatt" <[email protected]>
To: "Mixon Bill" <[email protected]>; "Cavers Texas"
<[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2014 8:04 PM
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] R.I.P. Speleo Digest
> Thanks for the news, Bill, which will mean something only to the older
> generations of cavers, many of whom probably still have their collection
> of Speleo Digests. They certainly were a good resource in the pre-digital
> years, and I'm glad to know that some of them are available online. Thanks
> for your part in producing several of them.
>
> On 3/20/2014 7:26 PM, Mixon Bill wrote:
>> I see from the minutes of the NSS Board of Governors meeting on March 15
>> that the Speleo Digest series, the last issue of which was for 2003, is
>> now officially dead. That's a shame, but it seems to acknowledge reality.
>> The series reprinted the best material out of grotto newsletters during
>> the title year, and was essentially _the_ library of American caves and
>> caving. It was started by the Pittsburgh Grotto in 1956. Production was
>> taken over by the NSS for the 1964 issue.
>>
>> I edited and prepared two or three issues back around 1970. The amount of
>> material in each issue has more than doubled since then; the 2003 has
>> almost 600 pages of three-column small type. On the other hand, I had to
>> retype everything on a typewriter and assemble the pages with scissors
>> and paste. Modern technology and the ability to request files for most of
>> the articles from the publishing grottos ought to have compensated, it
>> seems to me, but nevertheless getting it out proved to be beyond
>> volunteers. Of course as the years went by, the interest in working on an
>> issue years out of date decreased. (The 2003 didn't actually come out
>> until 2007.)
>>
>> Without the Speleo Digest, a lot of great cave explorations and maps
>> published locally are essentially inaccessible. Sigh. -- Bill Mixon
Please reply to [email protected]
Permanent email address is [email protected]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
According to a recent mathmatical study in the link shown below, human
civilization
as we know and appreciate it, will drastically change for the worse in just a
few decades.
http://www.sesync.org/sites/default/files/resources/motesharrei-rivas-kalnay.pdf
This is the study that was on all the major news sites today.
If this is true, should cavers put their speleo-library somewhere
safe, like deep in
a cave that is not very humid ? Is so, which cave ? Grutas del
Precipicio ?
Should we even bother ? What is the point, if nobody will probably ever find
the books or understand the meaning of them ? The Mayans seemed to have
gone to a lot of trouble to tell their story, yet the majority of the human race
doesn't seem to care about it, and only a handful of people seem to have an
idea what their message was.
I have a respectable speleo-library and even a rare book. But I do not
have the time to read them, or reminisce thru them, etc. Most of them have
been boxed up for 20 years.
I will need to will those books to a reliable caver someday, as I bet my
offspring or relatives will throw them in the trash.
On a related note, if the study in the link above is accurate, then shouldn't we
all select a cave, to have some sort of refuge in. Which cave ?
David Locklear
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Mark,
Thanks for making this point. The Portal is searchable, free, and designed
specifically for this purpose. Butch makes a point I've heard from others, that
we can scan and post the material. We can, but not nearly as well. The Portal
is based at the University of South Florida (USF) Libraries where high-end
equipment is used to get quality that isn't available to most people, and the
staff encrypts metadata and other information that makes the posted material
far more discoverable, and even useable for technologies not yet available.
If anyone is interested in digitally posting their newsletters on the Karst
Information Portal, contact me off-list. NCKRI is a partner with USF in
developing and managing the Portal.
For anyone who hasn't checked it out, visit www.karstportal.org.
George
Sent from my mobile phone
********************
George Veni, Ph.D.
Executive Director
National Cave and Karst Research Institute
400-1 Cascades Avenue
Carlsbad, New Mexico 88220-6215
USA
Office: 575-887-5517
Mobile: 210-863-5919
Fax: 575-887-5523
[email protected]
www.nckri.org
-------- Original message --------
From: Mark Minton <[email protected]>
Date: 2014/03/20 20:44 (GMT-07:00)
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: [Texascavers] R.I.P. Speleo Digest
A better solution might be for all grottos, regions, etc.
that publish newsletters to send them to the Karst Information
Portal. They already process a number of regional publications
(including the NSS News and Texas Caver) and OCR the text so that it
is searchable. The NSS could theoretically do the same, but it seems
less likely to actually get done, at least in the short term. (The
NSS still does not have electronic records of all past NSS members,
for example.)
Mark
At 10:29 PM 3/20/2014, Butch Fralia \(CAVEDBA\) wrote:
>That's not necessarily electronic where those not hanging around Huntsville
>can access.
>
>A good bunch of volunteers could probably digitize them in a couple of
>years.
>\
>Butch Fralia
>3412 Walton Ave.
>Fort Worth, TX 76133-2230
>[email protected]
>(Home) 817 346-2039
>(Cell) 817 229-7693
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Preston Forsythe [mailto:[email protected]]
>Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2014 9:00 PM
>To: [email protected]; Mixon Bill; Cavers Texas
>Subject: Re: [Texascavers] R.I.P. Speleo Digest
>
>All Grotto newsletters should be available at the NSS Library in Huntsville.
>
>If not then someone failed to send the NSS a copy.
>
>Preston
>
>---------------------------------------------------------------
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Logan McNatt" <[email protected]>
>To: "Mixon Bill" <[email protected]>; "Cavers Texas"
><[email protected]>
>Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2014 8:04 PM
>Subject: Re: [Texascavers] R.I.P. Speleo Digest
>
> > Thanks for the news, Bill, which will mean something only to the older
> > generations of cavers, many of whom probably still have their collection
> > of Speleo Digests. They certainly were a good resource in the pre-digital
>
> > years, and I'm glad to know that some of them are available online. Thanks
>
> > for your part in producing several of them.
> >
> > On 3/20/2014 7:26 PM, Mixon Bill wrote:
> >> I see from the minutes of the NSS Board of Governors meeting on March 15
> >> that the Speleo Digest series, the last issue of which was for 2003, is
> >> now officially dead. That's a shame, but it seems to acknowledge reality.
>
> >> The series reprinted the best material out of grotto newsletters during
> >> the title year, and was essentially _the_ library of American caves and
> >> caving. It was started by the Pittsburgh Grotto in 1956. Production was
> >> taken over by the NSS for the 1964 issue.
> >>
> >> I edited and prepared two or three issues back around 1970. The amount of
>
> >> material in each issue has more than doubled since then; the 2003 has
> >> almost 600 pages of three-column small type. On the other hand, I had to
> >> retype everything on a typewriter and assemble the pages with scissors
> >> and paste. Modern technology and the ability to request files for most of
>
> >> the articles from the publishing grottos ought to have compensated, it
> >> seems to me, but nevertheless getting it out proved to be beyond
> >> volunteers. Of course as the years went by, the interest in working on an
>
> >> issue years out of date decreased. (The 2003 didn't actually come out
> >> until 2007.)
> >>
> >> Without the Speleo Digest, a lot of great cave explorations and maps
> >> published locally are essentially inaccessible. Sigh. -- Bill Mixon
Please reply to [email protected]
Permanent email address is [email protected]
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Visit our website: http://texascavers.com
To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected]
For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
My hat is off to Bill Torode who has worked and volunteered for decades,
yes decades, for the NSS office, doing whatever is necessary including
taking care of the library. He continues to do that on a volunteer basis,
daily...5 or 6 days a week as far as I can see, and we have been down there
a lot lately. Most cavers already know some of the work and caving record of
Bill Torode. I would call it dedication to the NSS. Torode has lived across
the street from the present, (old), NSS office all of these years. He is
head of the Shelter Cave Preserve, a cave with a room the size of three
football fields, which is under the present office on Pulaski Pike in north
Huntsville. There are now three official caves that meet the Alabama cave
survey definition of a cave on the "new" 94 acre NSS property. Guess who had
a hand in the discovery and survey of those three caves. Yes, Torode. He
discovered, surveyed and mapped two of the three in 2008 and was directly
responsible for the discovery of the third cave only two weeks ago. The new
cave is an 8 minute walk from the new NSS Headquarters. A 4th cave on the
property is 20 ft. short of meeting the AL cave definition, but I would call
it a cave, at least a FRO, for the record only.
But, what you may not know is the new NSS librarians will be volunteers Paul
and Trish Spiliotis. Yes, Spiliotis. Greek, a real name! Spi-li-o-tis. I
flip whenever I hear that name. I have met them and they are very active
supporting the NSS by serving on this year's convention staff, working on
the campground several days a week and by doing volunteer work on the new HQ
building mainly by doing painting. When the construction in the new library
is complete I know they,
Torode and others will go 100% in moving the NSS library to the new and much
larger space. Trish is a RN and works with heart patients. Paul and Trish
live in Huntsville.
Preston in Western KY
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Even if all grotto newsletters were on line and publicly accessible,
that wouldn't substitute for the Speleo Digest. What it did is weed
out the stuff (vast majority of most newsletters) of no permanent
value and gather the rest into one convenient collection. Certainly it
did an incomplete job of that, but a lot better than nothing. I'm not
going to spend a lot of time browsing the web to find stuff I don't
even know is there. Sure, if I wanted a map of XYZ Cave, Google might
turn up the newsletter it is in if it's on the web somewhere, but what
if I've never even heard of XYZ Cave but might like to?
Oh, well, as I said, R.I.P. -- Mixon
----------------------------------------
If you can't say something nice, come and sit by me.
----------------------------------------
You may "reply" to the address this message
came from, but for long-term use, save:
Personal: [email protected]
AMCS: [email protected] or [email protected]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I agree that Speleo Digest was a great
publication. I refer to mine often when
researching what's known about specific caves.
There is an international alternative to Speleo
Digest, and that is Speleological Abstracts /
Bulletin Bibliographique Spéléologique
<http://ssslib.ch/bbs/public/anglais/index.htm>
put out by the UIS (Union Internationale de
Spéléologie / International Union of Speleology).
Of course it will not be so focused on American
publications, but does cover some of them,
including the NSS News, AMCS Activities
Newsletter and West Virginia Caver. They would be
happy to cover more U. S. publications if someone
would take the time to send them abstracts. (My
partner Yvonne does the NSS News and WV Caver.)
It is by far the easiest way to find information
on caves in other countries. Unlike Speleo
Digest, it does not select specific articles, but
rather provides abstracts of every article in
each issue of the publications it covers. That
doesn't serve to weed out the bad from the good,
but at least the information is there and
searchable. Actually getting a copy of an article
you're interested is another issue. They don't
have the newsletters themselves, only the
abstracts sent in by their collaborators.
Fortunately more and more newsletters are becoming available online.
Mark
At 11:59 PM 3/20/2014, Mixon Bill wrote:
Even if all grotto newsletters were on line and publicly accessible,
that wouldn't substitute for the Speleo Digest. What it did is weed
out the stuff (vast majority of most newsletters) of no permanent
value and gather the rest into one convenient collection. Certainly it
did an incomplete job of that, but a lot better than nothing. I'm not
going to spend a lot of time browsing the web to find stuff I don't
even know is there. Sure, if I wanted a map of XYZ Cave, Google might
turn up the newsletter it is in if it's on the web somewhere, but what
if I've never even heard of XYZ Cave but might like to?
Oh, well, as I said, R.I.P. -- Mixon
Please reply to [email protected]
Permanent email address is [email protected]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Yvonne pointed out that I misspoke when
I said that the BBS does not have copies of the
original publications that their abstracts come
from. Apparently they do, and could provide
copies of articles if necessary, although they
encourage users to contact national caving
organizations first. That would be the NSS in our case.
Mark
At 11:24 AM 3/21/2014, Mark Minton wrote:
I agree that Speleo Digest was a great
publication. I refer to mine often when
researching what's known about specific caves.
There is an international alternative to Speleo
Digest, and that is Speleological Abstracts /
Bulletin Bibliographique Spéléologique
<http://ssslib.ch/bbs/public/anglais/index.htm>
put out by the UIS (Union Internationale de
Spéléologie / International Union of
Speleology). Of course it will not be so
focused on American publications, but does
cover some of them, including the NSS News,
AMCS Activities Newsletter and West Virginia
Caver. They would be happy to cover more U. S.
publications if someone would take the time to
send them abstracts. (My partner Yvonne does
the NSS News and WV Caver.) It is by far the
easiest way to find information on caves in
other countries. Unlike Speleo Digest, it does
not select specific articles, but rather
provides abstracts of every article in each
issue of the publications it covers. That
doesn't serve to weed out the bad from the
good, but at least the information is there and
searchable. Actually getting a copy of an
article you're interested is another issue.
They don't have the newsletters themselves,
only the abstracts sent in by their
collaborators. Fortunately more and more
newsletters are becoming available online.
Mark
At 11:59 PM 3/20/2014, Mixon Bill wrote:
Even if all grotto newsletters were on line and publicly accessible,
that wouldn't substitute for the Speleo Digest. What it did is weed
out the stuff (vast majority of most newsletters) of no permanent
value and gather the rest into one convenient collection. Certainly it
did an incomplete job of that, but a lot better than nothing. I'm not
going to spend a lot of time browsing the web to find stuff I don't
even know is there. Sure, if I wanted a map of XYZ Cave, Google might
turn up the newsletter it is in if it's on the web somewhere, but what
if I've never even heard of XYZ Cave but might like to?
Oh, well, as I said, R.I.P. -- Mixon
Please reply to [email protected]
Permanent email address is [email protected]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
If anyone wants to search through bibliographies, such as
Speleological Abstracts (numbers 1-46 1974-2007) or Current Titles in
Speleology (1-25 for 1969-1992) or more obscure things like
Internationale Bibliographie für Speläelogie for 1950-1960, feel free
to come by and spend a good amount of time digging. Speleological
Abstracts for 24 years is available on a CD, but I don't have it--they
want ~$300 for it.--Mixon
----------------------------------------
If you can't say something nice, come and sit by me.
----------------------------------------
You may "reply" to the address this message
came from, but for long-term use, save:
Personal: [email protected]
AMCS: [email protected] or [email protected]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Many people have complained about the cost of Speleological Abstracts, which
brings me back again to the Karst Information Portal. The UIS (International
Union of Speleology) is another partner in the Portal and Speleological
Abstracts is produced by the UIS Bibliographic Commission. During the
Commission's meeting at the International Congress of Speleology last year, the
Commission members decided to wrap up the printed and CD version of
Speleological Abstracts that are currently in the works and then work to merge
Speleological Abstracts into the Karst Information Portal, where it will be
free to everyone.
The Portal basically has three levels of information:
1) Reference only. This is like the old fashion library card catalogue where
you just got the name of the publication but no other information.
2) Reference and abstract. This is like Speleological Abstracts, where you get
a summary of the publication along with the reference. Many links to
professional journal papers on the Portal take you to the abstract of the paper
on the journal's website. In many cases the abstract tells you what you need to
know. If you want more details, then the journal (NOT the Portal) requires you
to pay a fee of typically $35 to get a PDF of the full paper. The Portal can't
provide you these papers without violating copyright laws.
3) Full publication. This is the full publication. In many and increasingly
more cases, the entire publications are fully text searchable by the Portal.
So, for example, if you looking for information on Honey Creek Cave and you
search on that name, you will find it mentioned in many publications that you
wouldn't otherwise know about because they don't include the cave name in the
title or as a keyword, but the publication may still have information you may
find valuable.
Back to Speleological Abstracts, one of things we are hoping to see happen with
the transition to putting the information into the Portal is that the
contributors, rather than collecting the articles and writing abstracts for
them, would for less or similar effort collect a wider and larger array of
articles that can directly be digitally archived and accessed via the Karst
Information Portal.
George
********************
George Veni, Ph.D.
Executive Director
National Cave and Karst Research Institute
400-1 Cascades Avenue
Carlsbad, New Mexico 88220-6215 USA
Office: 575-887-5517
Mobile: 210-863-5919
Fax: 575-887-5523
[email protected]
www.nckri.org
-----Original Message-----
From: Mixon Bill [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Friday, March 21, 2014 11:42 AM
To: Cavers Texas
Subject: [Texascavers] bibliographies
If anyone wants to search through bibliographies, such as Speleological
Abstracts (numbers 1-46 1974-2007) or Current Titles in Speleology (1-25 for
1969-1992) or more obscure things like Internationale Bibliographie für
Speläelogie for 1950-1960, feel free to come by and spend a good amount of time
digging. Speleological Abstracts for 24 years is available on a CD, but I don't
have it--they want ~$300 for it.--Mixon
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"In many and increasingly more cases, the entire publications are
fully text searchable by the Portal." Or by Google: I think in those
cases a Google search will also pick it up, and the Karst Information
Portal copy will come up as a source. I'd try a Google search first,
as it will also pick up other things. I think the KIP is great,
especially for its efforts to scan and OCR things that had never been
digitized, like all the old NSS News's and NSS bulletins. But some of
what it provides is redundant; Google will find the abstracts of all
those journal papers. But hopefully KIP's collections of more obscure
caver literature will be more permanent than many other web sites turn
out to be. If KIP has digitized or just archived the newsletter of the
Bogalosa Grotto and the Bogalosa Grotto and its own web site
disappear, we're still covered. (The NSS library should also keep its
own copies of all internal organization newsletters that are available
as PDFs. It really should be scanning them itself, but it's a
monumental task, and if KIP has the resources, more power to them.)
-- Mixon
----------------------------------------
If you can't say something nice, come and sit by me.
----------------------------------------
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Bill is right that Google will also find many of the same things that KIP will
discover and I use both. But I use KIP first because Google and other general
search engines will dig up many things that are irrelevant to my search (like
people, streets, and towns named "cave") and waste my time, while those obvious
false hits won't appear on KIP. KIP's searches are also powered by Google.
George
********************
George Veni, Ph.D.
Executive Director
National Cave and Karst Research Institute
400-1 Cascades Avenue
Carlsbad, New Mexico 88220-6215 USA
Office: 575-887-5517
Mobile: 210-863-5919
Fax: 575-887-5523
[email protected]
www.nckri.org
-----Original Message-----
From: Mixon Bill [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Friday, March 21, 2014 1:14 PM
To: Cavers Texas
Subject: [Texascavers] searching for info
"In many and increasingly more cases, the entire publications are fully text
searchable by the Portal." Or by Google: I think in those cases a Google search
will also pick it up, and the Karst Information Portal copy will come up as a
source. I'd try a Google search first, as it will also pick up other things. I
think the KIP is great, especially for its efforts to scan and OCR things that
had never been digitized, like all the old NSS News's and NSS bulletins. But
some of what it provides is redundant; Google will find the abstracts of all
those journal papers. But hopefully KIP's collections of more obscure caver
literature will be more permanent than many other web sites turn out to be. If
KIP has digitized or just archived the newsletter of the Bogalosa Grotto and
the Bogalosa Grotto and its own web site disappear, we're still covered. (The
NSS library should also keep its own copies of all internal organization
newsletters that are available as PDFs. It really should be scanning them
itself, but it's a monumental task, and if KIP has the resources, more power to
them.)
-- Mixon
----------------------------------------
If you can't say something nice, come and sit by me.
----------------------------------------
You may "reply" to the address this message came from, but for long-term use,
save:
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AMCS: [email protected] or [email protected]
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--- Begin Message ---
David, you wrote (in part):
“I have a respectable speleo-library and even a rare book. But I do not
have the time to read them, or reminisce thru them, etc. Most of them have
been boxed up for 20 years.
I will need to will those books to a reliable caver someday, as I bet my
offspring or relatives will throw them in the trash.
David Locklear”
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
David, you and other cavers have an excellent option to preserve your valuable
speleo-archives.
The Texas Speleological Survey has for many years been seeking, acquiring,
cataloging, and storing all sorts of things having to do with caving. Our
acquisitions are housed in secure, climate-controlled, facilities on the campus
of the Pickle Research Center in Austin, Texas.
Sample donation forms are attached to this mail.
These archives are, for the most part, open to any interested researcher by
making an appointment with the office manager or by appearing at the work
sessions or special tutorial seminars that are held throughout the year and
announced on TexasCavers well in advance.
Any participation is welcome and, if all else fails, simply hand over your
donations to any of the TSS Officers/Directors. A list of Officers/Directors
and much other information about the Texas Speleological Survey had be found by
visiting this web site:
http://texasspeleologicalsurvey.org/
=== Carl Kunath (TSS Archives Committee)
Caver Donation Form, April 2001 [Moore].pdf
Description: Adobe PDF document
Caver Donation Form, April 2001 [Moore].rtf
Description: MS-Word document
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The National Speleological Society Social Media Committee is creating
a collage of troglobites, trogloxenes, and troglophiles for Earth Day-
please send us your favorite photo! Please include your name, NSS#,
and the state of the cave that you took the photo in. By sending us
your photo, you acknowledge that it is your photo and that you are
granting permission for us to use it in the Earth Day collage. Send
your photo by April 14, 2014 to [email protected], and watch for
the collage on Earth Day on Facebook, Google+, Twitter, Instagram,
LinkedIn, and the Twitter widget on caves.org!
Curious about what the Social Media Committee can do for you? Check
out our new website: http://www.caves.org/committee/sm/
--- End Message ---
