texascavers Digest 2 Aug 2011 02:17:54 -0000 Issue 1358
Topics (messages 18261 through 18267):
new Karst Management book
18261 by: Mixon Bill
Cover of new Karst Management Book
18262 by: Justin Leigh Shaw
18263 by: Mark Minton
Re: Banjercito Office in Acuna
18264 by: Gary Franklin
Article on KHOU on Twinkie's Cave
18265 by: Fofo
18266 by: Andy Gluesenkamp
18267 by: Marvin & Lisa
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"This volume provides important perspectives for university students,
educators, geoengineers, resource managers, and planners who are
interested in or work with this unique physical landscape."
Well, I guess it might if it didn't cost $179. -- Mixon
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May the last lawyer be strangled with the entrails of the last priest.
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Correct me if I'm wrong,
but the cover picture is of a sinkhole in Guatemala that opened in April
of 2007 and was not the result of the workings of a karst system, but rather
the result of the workings of piping caused by faulty drainage systems
installed in poorly consolidated volcanic ash substrate. If this is correct
I am led to conclude that the sinkhole is the result of human engineering
error, and not the result of a karst system. I recall a past CaveTex posting
citing a study with this conclusion.
I know you shouldn't judge a book by it's cover, but really?
Justin
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Justin is correct. That's a pretty amazing oversight on the
part of the editors; even if it qualifies as karst by some arcane
definition, surely they could have found something more
appropriate. Reminds me of a similar faux pas committed by the NSS
some years ago. The book "Caving in America" published in 1991 as a
commemoration of the 50th anniversary of the NSS had two cover
photos: one of cavers from the 1940s and one of cavers from the
1990s. I can't speak for the former, but the picture of the latter
was of Rolf Adams, Noel Sloan and me at Cheve in 1989. Two of us
(Rolf and I) had never been NSS members at the time, and the other
(Noel) had let his membership lapse. Maybe they didn't check, but
you'd think they would have publicized long-standing members in
modern gear. Somewhat surprisingly, we already look dated (carbide
"ceiling burners" and Wheat lamps).
Mark Minton
At 12:45 AM 7/31/2011, Justin Leigh Shaw wrote:
Correct me if I'm wrong,
but the cover picture is of a sinkhole in Guatemala that opened
in April of 2007 and was not the result of the workings of a karst
system, but rather the result of the workings of piping caused by
faulty drainage systems installed in poorly consolidated volcanic
ash substrate. If this is correct I am led to conclude that the
sinkhole is the result of human engineering error, and not the
result of a karst system. I recall a past CaveTex posting citing a
study with this conclusion.
I know you shouldn't judge a book by it's cover, but really?
Justin
Please reply to [email protected]
Permanent email address is [email protected]
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An update to the Vehicle Permit Return in Acuna.
I was able to return the Mexican vehicle permit to the Banjercito at the
Acuna bridge checkpoint. The Banjercito building is just off the Main
Border Checkpoint complex square. After crossing the bridge, Banjercito
Parking spaces are immediately through the Red Light/Green Light Checkpoint
at the Complex and were clearly marked ( There were about 8 parking spaces
with Parking Pylons painted with BANJERCITO about 40 feet through). The
Banjercito Building is about 150 feet away from the parking where I walked
over, stood in line, and told the attendant that I wanted to return a
Permit. The attendant came out from behind the counter with a hand held
computer, walked with me back to the vehicle, photographed the VIN, scanned
the pass before removing it, then printed a receipt from the handheld
computer to send me on my way.
I am thankful to have the permit returned and be processed rapidly where
the entire process of crossing took less than and hour and $5.10 total in
Toll fees to cross where I was never more than eyesight from the bridge.
Thanks to all the cavers who helped with information to get this done.
Also, I had a great time caving at Carte Valley and Fort Stockton.
Gary
On Thu, Jul 28, 2011 at 9:31 AM, Gary Franklin <[email protected]> wrote:
> I am trying to return a vehicle pass to Acuna this weekend.
>
> Is there a Banjercito Office to return a Vehicle Permit right at the bridge
> or is the office farther in ?
>
> Any information would be helpful as I have never crossed at this location
> and only want to return the permit.
>
> Gary
>
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�Hola!
Here's an article that I saw today about Twinkie's Cave in Comal County.
http://www.khou.com/news/Local-man-makes-prehistoric-discovery-in-his-own-backyard-125157069.html
Or http://tinyurl.com/3lynqxr
The text of the article is below.
Take care,
- Fofo
----------------------------------
SAN ANTONIO -- Somewhere in Comal County is a small parcel of private
land full of breathtaking views. Hidden amidst the beauty is a
mysterious entrance to the unknown.
Inside, there is not much space, and it quickly goes from dry to wet.
That�s because it's a cave full of spring-fed water. And there are
plenty of creatures living inside.
�There's a small colony of bats in there,� said William �BT� Price, who
owns the land.
Price bought the land where the hidden cave is located two years ago.
Now, he's a retired banker who's become an explorer of his own backyard.
The cave is at least a mile in length. Price and friends are constantly
pushing the limits by going into areas where the water and ceiling are
separated by inches.
�It can be very dangerous -- very, very dangerous -- if it's not done
right,� said Price.
Within the unknown lies a familiar treasure from prehistoric times:
fossils.
�Here's some pieces of mastodon teeth,� said Kurt Menking, who has
helped Price discover the fossils.
Some of the most exotic discoveries include an almost complete skull of
a Homotherium, an animal that was part of the saber-tooth tiger family.
Other remains are from beasts you only hear about in movies, like
10-foot-tall, 8,000-pound sloths.
Concordia University biology professor Laurence Meissner is just one of
a few professionals to verify the recent discovery.
�Yes, they're legitimate fossils. They lived in the late Ice Age.
Probably went extinct around 10 to 15 thousand years ago,� Meissner said.
Experts like Meissner said it�s very rare to find fossils in Texas,
especially animals like the Homotherium found in the local cave.
�It just gives us a record of the past. It tells us what life used to be
like 10 to 20,000 years ago and it shows there's been substantial change
in the environment here,� Meissner said.
Price said he plans to continue seeking more fossils in the area he�s
dubbed �Twinkie�s Cave,� named after his fianc�e�s dog.
Price�s long-term goal is to have the fossils preserved, then donate the
cave to either a caving group or to state-funded paleontology
organizations that have seen funding cuts due to budget woes.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Those specimens belong in a museum (or in a cave), not on someone's
bookshelf. Also, BT oughtta fess up that the fossils are coming from a part of
the cave on his neighbor's property, not his.
Andy
Andrew G. Gluesenkamp, Ph.D.
700 Billie Brooks Drive
Driftwood, Texas 78619
(512) 799-1095
[email protected]
________________________________
From: Fofo <[email protected]>
To: texascavers <[email protected]>
Sent: Mon, August 1, 2011 11:28:05 AM
Subject: [Texascavers] Article on KHOU on Twinkie's Cave
¡Hola!
Here's an article that I saw today about Twinkie's Cave in Comal County.
http://www.khou.com/news/Local-man-makes-prehistoric-discovery-in-his-own-backyard-125157069.html
Or http://tinyurl.com/3lynqxr
The text of the article is below.
Take care,
- Fofo
----------------------------------
SAN ANTONIO -- Somewhere in Comal County is a small parcel of private land full
of breathtaking views. Hidden amidst the beauty is a mysterious entrance to the
unknown.
Inside, there is not much space, and it quickly goes from dry to wet. That’s
because it's a cave full of spring-fed water. And there are plenty of creatures
living inside.
“There's a small colony of bats in there,” said William “BT” Price, who owns
the
land.
Price bought the land where the hidden cave is located two years ago. Now, he's
a retired banker who's become an explorer of his own backyard.
The cave is at least a mile in length. Price and friends are constantly pushing
the limits by going into areas where the water and ceiling are separated by
inches.
“It can be very dangerous -- very, very dangerous -- if it's not done right,”
said Price.
Within the unknown lies a familiar treasure from prehistoric times: fossils.
“Here's some pieces of mastodon teeth,” said Kurt Menking, who has helped Price
discover the fossils.
Some of the most exotic discoveries include an almost complete skull of a
Homotherium, an animal that was part of the saber-tooth tiger family.
Other remains are from beasts you only hear about in movies, like 10-foot-tall,
8,000-pound sloths.
Concordia University biology professor Laurence Meissner is just one of a few
professionals to verify the recent discovery.
“Yes, they're legitimate fossils. They lived in the late Ice Age. Probably went
extinct around 10 to 15 thousand years ago,” Meissner said.
Experts like Meissner said it’s very rare to find fossils in Texas, especially
animals like the Homotherium found in the local cave.
“It just gives us a record of the past. It tells us what life used to be like
10
to 20,000 years ago and it shows there's been substantial change in the
environment here,” Meissner said.
Price said he plans to continue seeking more fossils in the area he’s dubbed
“Twinkie’s Cave,” named after his fiancée’s dog.
Price’s long-term goal is to have the fossils preserved, then donate the cave
to
either a caving group or to state-funded paleontology organizations that have
seen funding cuts due to budget woes.
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BT and Will (the owner of the upstream entrances) have been very
conscientious about taking finds to several professors at UT and have
developed some good relationships with them. One fellow even took a tour of
the cave recently. The truth is that the university doesn't have the funds
to run a project at the cave right now. BT and Will would be more than happy
to accomodate them. What has been suggested to to BT is that he maintain the
collection and sometime in the near future he will get some assistance
(probably unpaid) to catalogue the items, but they will stay with him (or
Will) for now. Immediately after the first bones were found - which was also
coincident with finding the upstream entrances - BT and Will worked out an
agreement for how to deal with any finds.
You know that news stories don't always give you the whole picture.
Marvin Miller
_____
From: Andy Gluesenkamp [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Monday, August 01, 2011 11:44 AM
To: Fofo; texascavers
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] Article on KHOU on Twinkie's Cave
Those specimens belong in a museum (or in a cave), not on someone's
bookshelf. Also, BT oughtta fess up that the fossils are coming from a part
of the cave on his neighbor's property, not his.
Andy
Andrew G. Gluesenkamp, Ph.D.
700 Billie Brooks Drive
Driftwood, Texas 78619
(512) 799-1095
[email protected]
_____
From: Fofo <[email protected]>
To: texascavers <[email protected]>
Sent: Mon, August 1, 2011 11:28:05 AM
Subject: [Texascavers] Article on KHOU on Twinkie's Cave
¡Hola!
Here's an article that I saw today about Twinkie's Cave in Comal County.
http://www.khou.com/news/Local-man-makes-prehistoric-discovery-in-his-own-ba
ckyard-125157069.html
Or http://tinyurl.com/3lynqxr
The text of the article is below.
Take care,
- Fofo
----------------------------------
SAN ANTONIO -- Somewhere in Comal County is a small parcel of private land
full of breathtaking views. Hidden amidst the beauty is a mysterious
entrance to the unknown.
Inside, there is not much space, and it quickly goes from dry to wet. Thats
because it's a cave full of spring-fed water. And there are plenty of
creatures living inside.
There's a small colony of bats in there, said William BT Price, who owns
the land.
Price bought the land where the hidden cave is located two years ago. Now,
he's a retired banker who's become an explorer of his own backyard.
The cave is at least a mile in length. Price and friends are constantly
pushing the limits by going into areas where the water and ceiling are
separated by inches.
It can be very dangerous -- very, very dangerous -- if it's not done
right, said Price.
Within the unknown lies a familiar treasure from prehistoric times: fossils.
Here's some pieces of mastodon teeth, said Kurt Menking, who has helped
Price discover the fossils.
Some of the most exotic discoveries include an almost complete skull of a
Homotherium, an animal that was part of the saber-tooth tiger family.
Other remains are from beasts you only hear about in movies, like
10-foot-tall, 8,000-pound sloths.
Concordia University biology professor Laurence Meissner is just one of a
few professionals to verify the recent discovery.
Yes, they're legitimate fossils. They lived in the late Ice Age. Probably
went extinct around 10 to 15 thousand years ago, Meissner said.
Experts like Meissner said its very rare to find fossils in Texas,
especially animals like the Homotherium found in the local cave.
It just gives us a record of the past. It tells us what life used to be
like 10 to 20,000 years ago and it shows there's been substantial change in
the environment here, Meissner said.
Price said he plans to continue seeking more fossils in the area hes dubbed
Twinkies Cave, named after his fiancées dog.
Prices long-term goal is to have the fossils preserved, then donate the
cave to either a caving group or to state-funded paleontology organizations
that have seen funding cuts due to budget woes.
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