texascavers Digest 23 Jan 2011 21:11:00 -0000 Issue 1231
Topics (messages 16909 through 16927):
Re: Public web site on the TSA Spring Convention
16909 by: Simon Newton
16910 by: Gill Edigar
caving in the news
16911 by: David
16916 by: Louise Power
Will new film "Sanctum" be the "Vertical Limit" of Caving?
16912 by: Tim Stich
16913 by: Fofo
16914 by: mark gee
16915 by: Louise Power
16917 by: Nico Escamilla
16918 by: Scott Boyd
16923 by: Dale Barnard
16924 by: Allan Cobb
16925 by: Nico Escamilla
interesting video
16919 by: David
Re: realistic caving in movies
16920 by: David
"Sanctum"...
16921 by: Robert Tait
New NPS Podcast alerts People to Threat to Smokies Bat Populations :
16922 by: JerryAtkin.aol.com
International Journal of Speleology
16926 by: George Veni
16927 by: germanyj.aol.com
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----------------------------------------------------------------------
--- Begin Message ---
Nope. The FBI has interests in LinkedIn and Friendster.
On Sat, Jan 22, 2011 at 2:41 AM, Stefan Creaser <[email protected]>wrote:
> I thought it would be the FBI, aren't the CIA 'external'?
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Jan 21, 2011, at 12:12 PM, "Simon Newton" <[email protected]<mailto:
> [email protected]>> wrote:
>
> Only Facebook matters, since this is what goes into the CIA database.
>
>
>
>
>
> ;-)
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Diana Tomchick <[email protected]<mailto:
> [email protected]>>
> To: caverarch <<mailto:[email protected]>[email protected]<mailto:
> [email protected]>>
> Date: Wed, 19 Jan 2011 20:02:18 +0000
> Subject: Re: [Texascavers] Public web site on the TSA Spring Convention
> So what is wrong with updating the TSA web site for the Spring Convention?
> Just send the info to the webmaster.
>
> This should be done regardless of whether there is a Facebook Event page
> for the Convention.
>
> Diana
>
> * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
> Diana R. Tomchick
> Associate Professor
> University of Texas Southwestern Medical Center
> Department of Biochemistry
> 5323 Harry Hines Blvd.
> Rm. ND10.214B
> Dallas, TX 75390-8816, U.S.A.
> Email: <mailto:[email protected]>
> [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]
> >
> 214-645-6383 (phone)
> 214-645-6353 (fax)
>
>
>
>
> -- IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are
> confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended
> recipient, please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the
> contents to any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the
> information in any medium. Thank you.
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Well, internally the CIA is only external. But externally you'll find
that they are also internal. When a lead crosses the line they'll
follow it.
--Ediger
On Fri, Jan 21, 2011 at 6:41 PM, Stefan Creaser <[email protected]> wrote:
> I thought it would be the FBI, aren't the CIA 'external'?
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The link below was published today and describes a ridgewalking trip
in one of the Northern Emirates,
( of the UAE in the middle east )
http://www.thenational.ae/news/uae-news/seeking-dreams-in-realm-of-jinn
Ref:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ras_al-Khaimah
>From this article, it appears that Dr. Tadej Slabe is the leading cave
>scientist
in the world and is from Slovenia.
Their goal appears to be to find caves over 50 meters deep.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
That's quite an article. I find it very interesting that the leader of this
expedition is a woman. Not common in Middle Eastern countries. From the looks
of things she's got quite an amazing group working with her. I hope they find
something interesting.
> From: [email protected]
> Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2011 14:07:52 -0800
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: [Texascavers] caving in the news
>
> The link below was published today and describes a ridgewalking trip
> in one of the Northern Emirates,
> ( of the UAE in the middle east )
>
> http://www.thenational.ae/news/uae-news/seeking-dreams-in-realm-of-jinn
>
> Ref:
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ras_al-Khaimah
>
>
> From this article, it appears that Dr. Tadej Slabe is the leading cave
> scientist
> in the world and is from Slovenia.
>
> Their goal appears to be to find caves over 50 meters deep.
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> Visit our website: http://texascavers.com
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected]
> For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected]
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Here's the trailer. I have a bad feeling about it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jaZHjv3ASfw
It seems to have all of the earmarks of an exploitation style hack job.
Stupid, needless bickering within the expedition group. Backwards,
Aussie-style rappelling. All that seems to be missing is the nitro.
So who's going to go see it? I'll wait for your reviews.
-Tim
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Oh, who are we kidding? We will _all_ see it, like The Descent and The Cave,
and then when it's out on DVD someone will have friends over (hey, a drinking
game when every time there's something completely out of normal caving happens
on screen can get pretty interesting) or it'll be shown at a grotto social.
I'm looking forward to it!
- Fofo
On Jan 22, 2011 17:24, Tim Stich <[email protected]> wrote:
Here's the trailer. I have a bad feeling about it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jaZHjv3ASfw
It seems to have all of the earmarks of an exploitation style hack job. Stupid,
needless bickering within the expedition group. Backwards, Aussie-style
rappelling. All that seems to be missing is the nitro.
So who's going to go see it? I'll wait for your reviews.
-Tim
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Fo Fo, I feel the same way. I like a good movie.
________________________________
From: Fofo <[email protected]>
To: Cavers Texas <[email protected]>
Sent: Sat, January 22, 2011 7:34:26 PM
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] Will new film "Sanctum" be the "Vertical Limit" of
Caving?
Oh, who are we kidding? We will _all_ see it, like The Descent and The Cave,
and
then when it's out on DVD someone will have friends over (hey, a drinking game
when every time there's something completely out of normal caving happens on
screen can get pretty interesting) or it'll be shown at a grotto social.
I'm looking forward to it!
- Fofo
________________________________
On Jan 22, 2011 17:24, Tim Stich <[email protected]> wrote:
Here's the trailer. I have a bad feeling about it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jaZHjv3ASfw
It seems to have all of the earmarks of an exploitation style hack job. Stupid,
needless bickering within the expedition group. Backwards, Aussie-style
rappelling. All that seems to be missing is the nitro.
So who's going to go see it? I'll wait for your reviews.
-Tim
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Whadda you expect? It's from James Cameron, most recently of Avitar fame. Let's
face it guys, it's not a film for cavers, it's a film for thrill seekers who
want to confirm in their own minds that you have to be crazy to be a caver.
AND, IT'S IN 3D!!!
Well, you don't have to be crazy, but it helps.
Louise
List-Post: [email protected]
Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2011 17:40:36 -0800
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]; [email protected]
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] Will new film "Sanctum" be the "Vertical Limit" of
Caving?
Fo Fo, I feel the same way. I like a good movie.
From: Fofo <[email protected]>
To: Cavers Texas <[email protected]>
Sent: Sat, January 22, 2011 7:34:26 PM
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] Will new film "Sanctum" be the "Vertical Limit" of
Caving?
Oh, who are we kidding? We will _all_ see it, like The Descent and The Cave,
and then when it's out on DVD someone will have friends over (hey, a drinking
game when every time there's something completely out of normal caving happens
on screen can get pretty interesting) or it'll be shown at a grotto social.
I'm looking forward to it!
- Fofo
On Jan 22, 2011 17:24, Tim Stich <[email protected]> wrote:
Here's the trailer. I have a bad feeling about it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jaZHjv3ASfw
It seems to have all of the earmarks of an exploitation style hack job. Stupid,
needless bickering within the expedition group. Backwards, Aussie-style
rappelling. All that seems to be missing is the nitro.
So who's going to go see it? I'll wait for your reviews.
-Tim
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I might even drive to Austin or San Antone to watch it cause who knows when
it'll come out down here, if at all.
Nico
------------------------------
> *From:* Fofo <[email protected]>
> *To:* Cavers Texas <[email protected]>
> *Sent:* Sat, January 22, 2011 7:34:26 PM
> *Subject:* Re: [Texascavers] Will new film "Sanctum" be the "Vertical
> Limit" of Caving?
>
> Oh, who are we kidding? We will _all_ see it, like The Descent and The
> Cave, and then when it's out on DVD someone will have friends over (hey, a
> drinking game when every time there's something completely out of normal
> caving happens on screen can get pretty interesting) or it'll be shown at a
> grotto social.
>
> I'm looking forward to it!
>
> - Fofo
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
> On Jan 22, 2011 17:24, Tim Stich <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> Here's the trailer. I have a bad feeling about it.
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jaZHjv3ASfw
>
> It seems to have all of the earmarks of an exploitation style hack job.
> Stupid, needless bickering within the expedition group. Backwards,
> Aussie-style rappelling. All that seems to be missing is the nitro.
>
> So who's going to go see it? I'll wait for your reviews.
>
> -Tim
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
We also know it's for entertainment (to make money), not a documentary
accurately portraying caving techniques. (Did you expect it to be accurate
and/or realistic Tim?)
Caves are in 3D, so the 3D movie must be realistic, right?
Scott
--- On Sat, 1/22/11, Louise Power <[email protected]> wrote:
From: Louise Power <[email protected]>
Subject: RE: [Texascavers] Will new film "Sanctum" be the "Vertical Limit" of
Caving?
To: "Texas Cavers" <[email protected]>
List-Post: [email protected]
Date: Saturday, January 22, 2011, 8:20 PM
Whadda you expect? It's from James Cameron, most recently of Avitar fame. Let's
face it guys, it's not a film for cavers, it's a film for thrill seekers who
want to confirm in their own minds that you have to be crazy to be a caver.
AND, IT'S IN 3D!!!
Well, you don't have to be crazy, but it helps.
Louise
List-Post: [email protected]
Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2011 17:40:36 -0800
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]; [email protected]
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] Will new film "Sanctum" be the "Vertical Limit" of
Caving?
#yiv2137401650 .yiv2137401650ExternalClass DIV
{}
Fo Fo, I feel the same way. I like a good movie.
From: Fofo <[email protected]>
To: Cavers Texas <[email protected]>
Sent: Sat, January 22, 2011 7:34:26 PM
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] Will new film "Sanctum" be the "Vertical Limit" of
Caving?
Oh, who are we kidding? We will _all_ see it, like The Descent and The Cave,
and then when it's out on DVD someone will have friends over (hey, a drinking
game when every time there's something completely out of normal caving happens
on screen can get pretty interesting) or it'll be shown at a grotto social.
I'm looking forward to it!
- Fofo
On Jan 22, 2011 17:24, Tim Stich <[email protected]> wrote:
Here's the trailer. I have a bad feeling about it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jaZHjv3ASfw
It seems to have all of the earmarks of an exploitation style hack job. Stupid,
needless bickering within the expedition group. Backwards, Aussie-style
rappelling. All that seems to be missing is the nitro.
So who's going to go see it? I'll wait for your reviews.
-Tim
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Fofo's right. Denise and I will surely show this movie poolside this
summer (or whenever it comes out on DVD). The drinking game is a great idea.
And at our poolside theater, everything will be in 3D except the movie.
Dale
On 1/22/2011 7:34 PM, Fofo wrote:
Oh, who are we kidding? We will _all_ see it, like The Descent and The
Cave, and then when it's out on DVD someone will have friends over
(hey, a drinking game when every time there's something completely out
of normal caving happens on screen can get pretty interesting) or
it'll be shown at a grotto social.
I'm looking forward to it!
- Fofo
------------------------------------------------------------------------
On Jan 22, 2011 17:24, Tim Stich <[email protected]> wrote:
Here's the trailer. I have a bad feeling about it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jaZHjv3ASfw
It seems to have all of the earmarks of an exploitation style hack
job. Stupid, needless bickering within the expedition group.
Backwards, Aussie-style rappelling. All that seems to be missing is
the nitro.
So who's going to go see it? I'll wait for your reviews.
-Tim
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Linda and I will go see the movie when it comes out. I am going to see a MOVIE
not a DOCUMENTARY. I go to movies for entertainment and am happy to
temporarily suspend reality for a little entertainment.
Allan
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Where's the "like" button here?
Nico
On Sun, Jan 23, 2011 at 9:51 AM, Allan Cobb <[email protected]> wrote:
> Linda and I will go see the movie when it comes out. I am going to see a
> MOVIE not a DOCUMENTARY. I go to movies for entertainment and am happy to
> temporarily suspend reality for a little entertainment.
>
> Allan
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Last night,
the History Channel aired a short interesting video in one of
its Modern Marvel series, about a unique enterprise at Luray
Caverns.
I looked on their episode list and could not find it,
so maybe it is too new to be listed?
http://www.history.com/shows/modern-marvels/episodes#slide-21
The manager of the cave is interviewed and explains the process for
removing coins from their wishing well and the procedures they
have for getting the coins cleaned and donated to charities. They
claim their wishing well raises more money for charities than
any other wishing well in a cave.
He states the city has a secret committee that determines which
charity receives the money, which is about $ 30,000 annually.
Ref:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LeNFXezISJU
Personally, I found their operation to be very inefficient, and a burden
on too many volunteers who haul the loot to the truck on the surface,
but it was still a well made video and interesting to watch. It seemed
mostly made for curious kids.
David Locklear
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Here is a realistic caving video, that was just posted on YouTube 2
weeks ago.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6cbEBs5f11M
Would the general public pay $ 10 to see it at a theater when it is
free on YouTube?
The best part is the shot of the bolt-climber at 6:49.
I don't care for the music.
Note they throw some serious rocks down the pit and don't yell,
"Rock!" What if they
busted a bunch of pristine formations down there. Unlikely, I guess. Oztotl
would have eventually sent them tumbling anyways. Right? What
other choice did they
have?
I am making a wild guess that the cavers are somewhere inside this mountain:
http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Grigne.jpg
David Locklear
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I figure it would be great to show the film as an "intro to caving" the next
time I take a batch of boy scouts to Clarksville, her in update new York.
I got no argument with Aussie style rapping. It's inherent in the nature
of hemisphere... just like toilets flushing backwards..
Hope y'all have a happy and prosperous new year!
Rob
In upstate New York.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
New Podcast alerts People to Threat to Smokies Bat Populations
January 20, 2011
By _Scott_ (http://www.nc-cherokee.com/theonefeather/author/scotmckie37/)
Bats play a significant role in the natural world and this biological
function is being threatened by a disease that has already killed off millions
of bats in the northeast United States. A new podcast recently released by
Great Smoky Mountains National Park describes Park bat and cave resources
and the potential threat of the often fatal disease known as white-nose
syndrome (WNS) to its bat populations. The in-depth podcast, produced by
Great Smoky Mountains Association, is posted on the Park’s website
_http://www.nps.gov/grsm/photosmultimedia/wns-bat-video.htm_
(http://www.nps.gov/grsm/photosmultimedia/wns-bat-video.htm) .
In addition, a new bat exhibit has been installed at the Park’s Sugarlands
Visitor Center, giving visitors a chance to learn about these often
misunderstood mammals.
“The educational materials provide a wealth of information on bat biology,
their roosting and foraging behavior, the potential implications of WNS
and what researchers and biologists are doing to manage this threat, as well
as how the public can help protect bats,” said Bill Stiver, Park Wildlife
Biologist.
The Park is home to at least 11 species of bats, a primary group of flying
mammals that play a critical role in the health of ecosystems by consuming
forest and agricultural crop insects—such as moths, beetles and
mosquitoes. One of the species in the Park, the Indiana bat, is federally
endangered
and another, the Rafinesque’s big-eared bat, is a state listed species of
concern in both Tennessee and North Carolina. In the winter of 2010, two
little brown bats in a Park cave tested positive for a newly-described
fungus, Geomyces destructans, which is thought to be the cause of WNS, a
symptom that appears on the faces of bats as a white frothy substance.
In an effort to prevent the unintentional spread of the fungus by people,
the Park closed all of its 16 caves and two mine complexes to public entry
in 2009. The Park’s caves serve as important hibernacula (place of rest)
and the closure is still in effect as researchers try to understand how the
disease is being transmitted from bat to bat and from cave to cave.
Violators face fines of up to $5,000 or six months imprisonment.
WNS was first detected in the Northeast in 2006 and is quickly spreading
south and has been found in cave systems as far west as Oklahoma. According
to biologists from the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service, WNS is taking a
heavy toll on bats that hibernate in caves and mines and has the potential for
wiping out federally-endangered species such as the Indiana bats and even
more common species of bats such as the little brown bat.
Scientists theorize that the fungus irritates the bats, making them
restless and causing them to wake early burning precious fat reserves needed
during winter hibernation. They speculate that the affected bats could freeze
to death or starve before the insects on which they feed emerge in the
spring. There is still much to be learned about WNS. Fish and Wildlife
Service officials say that no human illnesses related to the disease have been
documented, but humans could certainly feel the effects of losing entire bat
species which help to keep insect populations in check. One little brown
bat can eat up to 1,000 of those pesky mosquitoes in one hour.
The National Park Service is taking an active role in developing
monitoring and surveillance strategies and containment protocols for its
caves. The
Great Smoky Mountains National Park is cooperatively working with other
parks and federal, local and state agencies across the country to protect
bats and manage cave habitats. Ongoing research in the Smokies includes
monitoring bat populations in the winter during hibernation and tracking bats
in the summer to determine habitat use. Park biologists are taking
additional steps to better understand bat populations and their habitats to
help
officials identify potential impacts of this fungus on the Smokies
resources. This winter biologists will test other bat species for the
fungus.
Park managers are also asking visitors to help biologists monitor bats by
reporting unusual bat behavior, appearing out of season, or one that
appears to be sick or injured. For human safety, it is important not to touch
or
handle a bat. Reports on bat incidents inside the Park can be made to the
Park’s visitor centers or a Park Ranger. Unusual bat activity outside the
Park should be reported to state wildlife agencies.
- Source: NPS
_http://www.nc-cherokee.com/theonefeather/2011/01/20/new-podcast-alerts-peop
le-to-threat-to-smokies-bat-populations/_
(http://www.nc-cherokee.com/theonefeather/2011/01/20/new-podcast-alerts-people-to-threat-to-smokies-bat-popula
tions/)
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Dear Friends of Cave and Karst Science,
The International Journal of Speleology (IJS) is going through some
important changes. The IJS is a publication of the International Union of
Speleology (UIS) and was beautifully published for many years by the Italian
Speleological Society (SSI). The UIS thanks them for their great service.
Recently, the SSI decided to retire from publishing the IJS, and it will now
by published by the University of South Florida in the USA. The excellent
quality of the printing and the content will not change.
The IJS is available for free as pdfs through the IJS website
(http://www.ijs.speleo.it/) and the Karst Information Portal
(www.karstportal.org). It will continue to be printed in 2011 and 2012, but
beginning in 2013 it will be available only in free digital format. The U.S.
National Cave and Karst Research Institute is assisting the UIS by
collecting payments for subscriptions to printed copies of the journal for
2011 and 2012. If you want printed copies of the IJS, pay now for both years
and you will get a lower price:
http://www.ijs.speleo.it/IJS-Subscription-2011.pdf.
Thank you for your interest and support of the International Journal of
Speleology.
George Veni
Vice President of Administration, International Union of Speleology
Executive Director, U.S. National Cave and Karst Research Institute
*Please distribute this message to anyone you believe is interested.
***************************
George Veni, Ph.D.
Executive Director
National Cave and Karst Research Institute
1400 Commerce Drive
Carlsbad, New Mexico 88220 USA
Office: 575-887-5517
Mobile: 210-863-5919
Fax: 413-383-2276
[email protected]
www.nckri.org
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I love the IJS. Been a subscriber for years. And now it's FREE, FREE, FREE!
Thanks, George!
In case you didn't think there would be anything about Texas caving in this
pub, just look at the article in the Jan 2011 issue:
http://www.ijs.speleo.it/pdf/74.604.40%281%29_Brown.et.al.pdf
Our own Andy Grubbs is one of the listed authors about this study of a CBSP
cave!
- julia
-----Original Message-----
From: George Veni <[email protected]>
To: 'New Mexico Cavers' <[email protected]>; 'Texas Cavers'
<[email protected]>
Sent: Sun, Jan 23, 2011 1:18 pm
Subject: [Texascavers] International Journal of Speleology
Dear Friends of Cave and Karst Science,
The International Journal of Speleology (IJS) is going through some important
changes. The IJS is a publication of the International Union of Speleology
(UIS) and was beautifully published for many years by the Italian Speleological
Society (SSI). The UIS thanks them for their great service. Recently, the SSI
decided to retire from publishing the IJS, and it will now by published by the
University of South Florida in the USA. The excellent quality of the printing
and the content will not change.
The IJS is available for free as pdfs through the IJS website
(http://www.ijs.speleo.it/) and the Karst Information Portal
(www.karstportal.org). It will continue to be printed in 2011 and 2012, but
beginning in 2013 it will be available only in free digital format. The U.S.
National Cave and Karst Research Institute is assisting the UIS by collecting
payments for subscriptions to printed copies of the journal for 2011 and 2012.
If you want printed copies of the IJS, pay now for both years and you will get
a lower price: http://www.ijs.speleo.it/IJS-Subscription-2011.pdf.
Thank you for your interest and support of the International Journal of
Speleology.
George Veni
Vice President of Administration, International Union of Speleology
Executive Director, U.S. National Cave and Karst Research Institute
*Please distribute this message to anyone you believe is interested.
***************************
George Veni, Ph.D.
Executive Director
National Cave and Karst Research Institute
1400 Commerce Drive
Carlsbad, New Mexico 88220 USA
Office: 575-887-5517
Mobile: 210-863-5919
Fax: 413-383-2276
[email protected]
www.nckri.org
--- End Message ---
