texascavers Digest 27 Jan 2011 18:44:35 -0000 Issue 1234

Thu, 27 Jan 2011 10:44:59 -0800 (PST) 

texascavers Digest 27 Jan 2011 18:44:35 -0000 Issue 1234

Topics (messages 16952 through 16960):

Re: Sewage dump into the Medina River?
        16952 by: caverarch

Re: Will new film "Sanctum" be the "Vertical Limit" of Caving?
        16953 by: Andy Gluesenkamp
        16954 by: Andy Gluesenkamp
        16955 by: tbsamsel.verizon.net

honey creek carpool
        16956 by: ryan monjaras

Wind farm vs bats litigation in Nevada :
        16957 by: JerryAtkin.aol.com

The Real Sanctum - tonight on National Geographic TV
        16958 by: speleosteele.aol.com
        16959 by: tbsamsel.verizon.net
        16960 by: Geary Schindel

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--- Begin Message --- 


The information on potential sewage discharge into the Medina River in the 
Castroville area (last paragraph) seems like it would be of interest to friends 
of karst in the area, as well as paddlers.  Plus there are some dates for river 
activities if you aren't going caving.


Roger Moore


-----Original Message-----
From: Tom Goynes <[email protected]>
To: List Serv Canoetx <[email protected]>
Sent: Wed, Jan 26, 2011 9:41 am
Subject: TRPA newsletter and Castroville news


Hello Paddlers,


Just wanted to let ya'll know that I have high hopes of getting the Texas 
Rivers Protection Association newsletter out next week, so if anyone has 
anything that needs to go in that newsletter, now is the time to let me know.


Here are some of the dates that you should note: March 5: San Marcos River 
Clean Up;  March 5: Annual Basura Bash - San Antonio; March 6: Annual TRPA 
meeting (at San Marcos River Retreat); April 2: Brazos River Cleanup; April 16 
and 17: Hidalgo Falls River Festival; May 7: Medina River Cleanup; May 7: 
Calallen Earth Club Annual River Cleanup - Corpus Christi.


You can read more about these (and other) events on our website: 
www.txrivers.org


Update on the Castroville sewage discharge case:  Brief history: The City of 
Castroville applied for a permit three years ago to discharge their sewage into 
the Medina River.  Up to now, they have been using that sewage to irrigate some 
kind of crop.  In our opinion, their sewage treatment plant is woefully 
inadequate, so we asked for a contested case hearing.  The Texas Commission on 
Environmental Quality denied our request for a contested case hearing, so we 
appealed their decision.  The appeal was heard by a Judge in Austin in early 
June of this past year.  We just got word last week that we won that appeal and 
that the TCEQ has been instructed to grant us a contested case hearing.  It is 
always possible that the state will appeal that order, but for now, we are 
winning.  I will have more info in the newsletter.


Hope to see you at the San Marcos Clean Up!


Tom Goynes


 
=

--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- 
and Bleach and Lysol!

and bat guano..... 




-----Original Message-----
From: ryan monjaras <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]; texas cavers <[email protected]>
Sent: Tue, Jan 25, 2011 6:44 pm
Subject: RE: [Texascavers] Will new film "Sanctum" be the "Vertical Limit" of 
Caving?


we could even go caving before hand and show up covered in dirt

"Semper Exploro" Ryan Monjaras 
Maverick Grotto
Cowtown Grotto
DFW Grotto
UT Grotto
Bexar Grotto
(832)754-5778



________________________________
Date: Mon, 24 Jan 2011 07:18:35 -0800
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] Will new film "Sanctum" be the "Vertical Limit" of 
Caving?


I think we should get a group of cavers together and go see it dressed up in 
gear, for fun. 

Kind of like the Harry Potter fanatics whenever a new Potter movie comes out.

Leslie Bell 

--- On Sun, 1/23/11, Nico Escamilla <[email protected]> wrote:


>From: Nico Escamilla <[email protected]>
>Subject: Re: [Texascavers] Will new film "Sanctum" be the "Vertical Limit" of 
>Caving?
>To: "Allan Cobb" <[email protected]>
>Cc: [email protected]
>Date: Sunday, January 23, 2011, 10:02 AM
>
>
>Where's the "like" button here? 
>
>
>Nico
>
>
>On Sun, Jan 23, 2011 at 9:51 AM, Allan Cobb <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>Linda and I will go see the movie when it comes out.  I am going to see a 
>MOVIE 
>not a DOCUMENTARY.  I go to movies for entertainment and am happy to 
>temporarily 
>suspend reality for a little entertainment.
>> Allan
> 
=

--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- 
Gibby Haynes?  Frontman for the Bu**hole Surfers?  He' is definitely 
scruffy-lookin' but not someone I'd want to go caving with.
 Andrew G. Gluesenkamp, Ph.D.
700 Billie Brooks Drive
Driftwood, Texas 78619
(512) 799-1095
[email protected] 




________________________________
From: Diana Tomchick <[email protected]>
To: "<[email protected]> <[email protected]>" <[email protected]>
Cc: "<[email protected]>" <[email protected]>; "<[email protected]>" 
<[email protected]>
Sent: Wed, January 26, 2011 11:03:34 AM
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] Will new film "Sanctum" be the "Vertical Limit" of 
Caving?

Gabby-who?

You're showing your age, dude.

In order to explore and survey virgin cave in Texas these days, you have to be 
well-prepared for long, hard trips, and since everyone has waterproof cameras, 
it helps to be photogenic, too.

Diana

P.S. Last night on Turner Classic Movies I caught a few minutes of a 
forgettable 
B&W screwball comedy from 1937. "That actor looks vaguely familiar," I thought. 
I was surprised to discover that prior to Frederic March's turn in "Inherit the 
Wind (1960)" and "Death of a Salesman (1951)" he was a romantic lead in the 
movies of the '30's. I guess it's all relative.

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Diana R. Tomchick
Associate Professor
University of Texas Southwestern Medical Center
Department of Biochemistry
5323 Harry Hines Blvd.
Rm. ND10.214B
Dallas, TX 75390-8816, U.S.A.
Email: [email protected]
214-645-6383 (phone)
214-645-6353 (fax)



On Jan 26, 2011, at 6:17 AM, <[email protected]>
<[email protected]> wrote:

> I notice in the trailers that the intrepid group is all spiffed out in 
>seemingly new REI-like toggery. No old clothes .. and everyone's makeup is 
>perfect. What a crock.. aren't there any Gabby Hayes-like (or Marjorie 
>Main-like) scruffy sorts available for these acting gigs?
>
> T
>
>
> Jan 25, 2011 04:16:50 PM, [email protected] wrote:
> I saw the initial release of Raiders of the Lost Ark in Alexandria, 
> Louisiana, 
>with a bunch of other archeologists.  We dressed like we always did in the 
>field 
>(jeans and T-shirts), but carried no field gear.  I think I had already 
>retired 
>my pith helmet by then, but I had worn fedoras for ages.
>
> Roger Moore
> Houston
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Leslie Bell
> To: [email protected]
> Sent: Mon, Jan 24, 2011 9:18 am
> Subject: Re: [Texascavers] Will new film "Sanctum" be the "Vertical Limit" of 
>Caving?
>
> I think we should get a group of cavers together and go see it dressed up in 
>gear, for fun.
> Kind of like the Harry Potter fanatics whenever a new Potter movie comes out.
>
> Leslie Bell
> --- On Sun, 1/23/11, Nico Escamilla <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> From: Nico Escamilla <[email protected]>
> Subject: Re: [Texascavers] Will new film "Sanctum" be the "Vertical Limit" of 
>Caving?
> To: "Allan Cobb" <[email protected]>
> Cc: [email protected]
> List-Post: [email protected]
Date: Sunday, January 23, 2011, 10:02 AM
>
> Where's the "like" button here?
>
> Nico
>
> On Sun, Jan 23, 2011 at 9:51 AM, Allan Cobb <[email protected]> wrote:
> Linda and I will go see the movie when it comes out.  I am going to see a 
> MOVIE 
>not a DOCUMENTARY.  I go to movies for entertainment and am happy to 
>temporarily 
>suspend reality for a little entertainment.
>
> Allan
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------- Visit 
> our 
>website: http://texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: 
>[email protected] For additional commands, e-mail: 
>[email protected]


________________________________

UT Southwestern Medical Center
The future of medicine, today.

---------------------------------------------------------------------
Visit our website: http://texascavers.com
To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected]
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- Gabby Hayes

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_%22Gabby%22_Hayes


Jan 26, 2011 03:06:22 PM, [email protected] wrote:
Gibby Haynes?  Frontman for the Bu**hole Surfers?  He' is definitely scruffy-lookin' but not someone I'd want to go caving with.
 
Andrew G. Gluesenkamp, Ph.D.
700 Billie Brooks Drive
Driftwood, Texas 78619
(512) 799-1095
[email protected]


From: Diana Tomchick
To: " "
Cc: "" ; ""
Sent: Wed, January 26, 2011 11:03:34 AM
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] Will new film "Sanctum" be the "Vertical Limit" of Caving?

Gabby-who?

You're showing your age, dude.

In order to explore and survey virgin cave in Texas these days, you have to be well-prepared for long, hard trips, and since everyone has waterproof cameras, it helps to be photogenic, too.

Diana

P.S. Last night on Turner Classic Movies I caught a few minutes of a forgettable B&W screwball comedy from 1937. "That actor looks vaguely familiar," I thought. I was surprised to discover that prior to Frederic March's turn in "Inherit the Wind (1960)" and "Death of a Salesman (1951)" he was a romantic lead in the movies of the '30's. I guess it's all relative.

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Diana R. Tomchick
Associate Professor
University of Texas Southwestern Medical Center
Department of Biochemistry
5323 Harry Hines Blvd.
Rm. ND10.214B
Dallas, TX 75390-8816, U.S.A.
Email: [email protected]
214-645-6383 (phone)
214-645-6353 (fax)



On Jan 26, 2011, at 6:17 AM, <[email protected]>
<[email protected]> wrote:

> I notice in the trailers that the intrepid group is all spiffed out in seemingly new REI-like toggery. No old clothes .. and everyone's makeup is perfect. What a crock.. aren't there any Gabby Hayes-like (or Marjorie Main-like) scruffy sorts available for these acting gigs?
>
> T
>
>
> Jan 25, 2011 04:16:50 PM, [email protected] wrote:
> I saw the initial release of Raiders of the Lost Ark in Alexandria, Louisiana, with a bunch of other archeologists.  We dressed like we always did in the field (jeans and T-shirts), but carried no field gear.  I think I had already retired my pith helmet by then, but I had worn fedoras for ages.
>
> Roger Moore
> Houston
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Leslie Bell
> To: [email protected]
> Sent: Mon, Jan 24, 2011 9:18 am
> Subject: Re: [Texascavers] Will new film "Sanctum" be the "Vertical Limit" of Caving?
>
> I think we should get a group of cavers together and go see it dressed up in gear, for fun.
> Kind of like the Harry Potter fanatics whenever a new Potter movie comes out.
>
> Leslie Bell
> --- On Sun, 1/23/11, Nico Escamilla <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> From: Nico Escamilla <[email protected]>
> Subject: Re: [Texascavers] Will new film "Sanctum" be the "Vertical Limit" of Caving?
> To: "Allan Cobb" <[email protected]>
> Cc: [email protected]
> Date: Sunday, January 23, 2011, 10:02 AM
>
> Where's the "like" button here?
>
> Nico
>
> On Sun, Jan 23, 2011 at 9:51 AM, Allan Cobb <[email protected]> wrote:
> Linda and I will go see the movie when it comes out.  I am going to see a MOVIE not a DOCUMENTARY.  I go to movies for entertainment and am happy to temporarily suspend reality for a little entertainment.
>
> Allan
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------- Visit our website: http://texascavers.com To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected] For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected]


________________________________

UT Southwestern Medical Center
The future of medicine, today.

---------------------------------------------------------------------
Visit our website: http://texascavers.com
To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected]
For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected]


--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- 
anyone going from San Marcos or austinites traveling through San Marcos that 
would like to carpool to honey creek please contact me off list

"Semper Exploro" Ryan MonjarasMaverick GrottoCowtown GrottoDFW GrottoUT 
GrottoBexar Grotto(832)754-5778

--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- 
 
Lawsuit claims BLM approval violated laws

 
By _Keith Rogers_ (http://www.reviewjournal.com/about/print/rjstaff.html) 
LAS VEGAS REVIEW-JOURNAL
Posted: Jan. 25, 2011 | 6:07 p.m. 
Updated: Jan. 26, 2011 |  8:03 a.m.
 
A federal lawsuit filed Tuesday in Las Vegas claims the Bureau of Land  
Management violated federal environmental and American Indian cultural laws 
when  the agency approved a wind energy project near Great Basin National Park. 
The 36-page complaint states that despite "very significant and unknown  
environmental and cultural impacts," the BLM gave "fast track" approval of the 
 Spring Valley Wind project in White Pine County four miles from a cave 
where  more than 1 million Mexican free-tailed bats roost in the fall, and near 
the  sacred Western Shoshone swamp cedar site where Indians were massacred 
during the  Goshute War of 1863. 
"BLM refused to conduct the full environmental analysis required by the  
National Environmental Policy Act. Instead, under pressure from high-level BLM 
 officials and the industry proponent, BLM rushed through a short-cut 
analysis in  order to meet arbitrary funding deadlines desired by the 
industry," 
according to  the lawsuit filed by attorneys for the Center for Biological 
Diversity, the  Western Watershed Project, the Ely Shoshone Tribe, the 
Duckwater Shoshone Tribe  and the Confederated Tribes of the Goshute 
Reservation. 
The lawsuit seeks to block the BLM from allowing Spring Valley Wind to go  
forward with "ground-clearing, site preparation and wind tower construction  
until such time as BLM has fully complied with law." 
In addition, the plaintiffs ask the U.S. District Court to strike BLM's 
Oct.  15 decision to approve the 75-turbine Spring Valley Wind project on 
public land  northwest of Great Basin National Park. 
Rob Mrowka, an ecologist with the Center for Biological Diversity, said 
that  while renewable energy is globally important for addressing threats of 
climate  change, such projects "must be properly located with careful 
consideration of  the values of not only the site but also of the surrounding 
area." 
The lawsuit claims the project's "industrial sprawl would likewise impair  
many other on-site and migratory native wildlife species including greater 
sage  grouse and raptors." 
A spokeswoman for the BLM's state office in Reno who was sent a copy of the 
 complaint said the BLM can't comment on litigation. 
George Hardie, project manager for Pattern Energy, the parent company of  
Spring Valley Wind, said in an e-mail, however, that he is disappointed the  
lawsuit was filed but confident it will be dismissed because in his view, 
"if  the Spring Valley project is not environmentally acceptable, then no 
project in  Nevada will ever be acceptable." 
"Pattern Energy and the BLM have worked extremely hard to make the Spring  
Valley wind project as environmentally benign as possible," Hardie wrote in 
the  e-mail. 
He said the project "has put in place the most extensive and forward 
looking  mitigation and adaptive management plan ever devised for any wind 
energy 
project  in the United States to minimize the impact to wildlife and the 
environment. In  fact, our mitigation and adaptive management plans for bats, 
sage grouse and  other avian species were all designed with the full input 
and ultimate  concurrence of both the Nevada Department of Wildlife and the 
U.S. Fish and  Wildlife Service." 
Biologists think as many as 3 million Mexican free-tailed bats roost for 
one  to three days in Rose Cave across from the planned wind farm during their 
 southern migration. Because of the location, they fear that many of the 
2,000  bats per minute that leave the cave might either collide with wind 
turbines, or  suffer from deadly "barotrauma," the rapid expansion of an 
animal's lungs from a  sudden change in barometric pressure at the trailing 
edge of 
a rotor blade. 
Meanwhile, they are trying to use "Star Wars" technology, such as thermal  
imaging scopes, infrared optics and marine-grade radar to keep bats from  
tangling with wind turbines by detecting when they leave the cave and 
triggering  a slow-down of turbine blades if they approach them. 
The lawsuit notes that the project was approved over concerns from the  
National Park Service and biologists from the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service 
and  the Nevada Department of Wildlife. 
Contact reporter Keith Rogers at [email protected] or  
702-383-0308. 
_http://www.lvrj.com/news/lawsuit-claims-blm-violated-laws-with-wind-energy-
project-114614369.html_ 
(http://www.lvrj.com/news/lawsuit-claims-blm-violated-laws-with-wind-energy-project-114614369.html)

--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- 

http://channel.nationalgeographic.com/episode/the-real-sanctum-6322/Overview
 
 
THU JAN 27 8P 
The Real Sanctum explores the back story of Producer/Writer and expedition 
leader Andrew Wight, who teams up with Hollywood director James Cameron to make 
a 3-D feature film of a cave diving expedition. Cameron's film is inspired by 
Wight's true story of near disaster when his expedition team became trapped in 
a cave system in the Nullarbor Plain, Australia.


Read more: 
http://channel.nationalgeographic.com/episode/the-real-sanctum-6322/Overview#ixzz1CG9h35Cd

--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The trailers to the flick show the sotano in a rugged forested area. The Nullarbor Plain has few (if any) trees. Where is the verisimilitude in that?
 
R


Jan 27, 2011 12:08:46 PM, [email protected] wrote:

http://channel.nationalgeographic.com/episode/the-real-sanctum-6322/Overview
THU JAN 27 8P THU JAN 27 7P THU JAN 27 9P THU JAN 27 8P THU JAN 27 7P
The Real Sanctum explores the back story of Producer/Writer and expedition leader Andrew Wight, who teams up with Hollywood director James Cameron to make a 3-D feature film of a cave diving expedition. Cameron's film is inspired by Wight's true story of near disaster when his expedition team became trapped in a cave system in the Nullarbor Plain, Australia.


Read more: http://channel.nationalgeographic.com/episode/the-real-sanctum-6322/Overview#ixzz1CG9h35Cd

--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- 
I’ve been to the Nullarbor Plain and I can tell you there are no trees there 
which is the derivation of the name Null – as in no and Arbor as in trees.  
However, it is (was) a good place to look for meteorites as it is a flat 
featureless limestone plain.  Any dark colored rock on the surface is a 
meteorite.  Some very nice and old caves out there with very usual salt 
speleothems.

Geary

From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Thursday, January 27, 2011 12:17 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] The Real Sanctum - tonight on National Geographic TV

The trailers to the flick show the sotano in a rugged forested area. The 
Nullarbor Plain has few (if any) trees. Where is the verisimilitude in that?

R


Jan 27, 2011 12:08:46 PM, [email protected] wrote:

http://channel.nationalgeographic.com/episode/the-real-sanctum-6322/Overview
THU JAN 27 8P THU JAN 27 7P THU JAN 27 9P THU JAN 27 8P THU JAN 27 7P
The Real Sanctum explores the back story of Producer/Writer and expedition 
leader Andrew Wight, who teams up with Hollywood director James Cameron to make 
a 3-D feature film of a cave diving expedition. Cameron's film is inspired by 
Wight's true story of near disaster when his expedition team became trapped in 
a cave system in the Nullarbor Plain, Australia.


Read more: 
http://channel.nationalgeographic.com/episode/the-real-sanctum-6322/Overview#ixzz1CG9h35Cd
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