texascavers Digest 6 Feb 2011 23:55:55 -0000 Issue 1240

Sun, 6 Feb 2011 16:03:47 -0800 (PST) 

texascavers Digest 6 Feb 2011 23:55:55 -0000 Issue 1240

Topics (messages 17043 through 17066):

looking for Charley Loving
        17043 by: Jon

Re: Link
        17044 by: David

AMCS needs Spanish to English translation
        17045 by: Mixon Bill
        17051 by: Gill Edigar

Scholarships for Cave/Karst Students
        17046 by: R D Milhollin

Re: Mexico
        17047 by: tbsamsel.verizon.net

Monterrey safety update
        17048 by: David
        17050 by: Mark Minton
        17052 by: Gill Edigar
        17055 by: tbsamsel.verizon.net
        17064 by: Bruce Anderson

karst related
        17049 by: David

Mexico updates
        17053 by: David
        17054 by: David
        17056 by: tbsamsel.verizon.net
        17063 by: Chris Vreeland

Re: [SWR] James Cameron's Sanctum in 3D
        17057 by: Karen Perry
        17058 by: Speleosteele.aol.com

Not just Texas
        17059 by: Ron Miller

Re: translating
        17060 by: Mixon Bill

Re: James Cameron's Sanctum in 3D
        17061 by: Mark Alman

Poisonous New Pseudoscorpion Found in Glenwood Caverns, Colorado
        17062 by: Lee H. Skinner

Mexico cave connection
        17065 by: Mixon Bill

Poisonous New Pseudoscorpion - full article :
        17066 by: JerryAtkin.aol.com

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----------------------------------------------------------------------
--- Begin Message --- 
Charley please contact me off list.  I have a story for you.
 
JC

--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- 
Are those rock formations in their logo, karstic ?

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_7F2abYG8jyc/TRvRDc3pReI/AAAAAAAAAlU/XOaI0C0a7Zo/S1600-R/1293668538_187.jpg

--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- The Association for Mexican Cave Studies has received a potential AMCS archaeology bulletin from prominent Mexican caver Carlos Lazcano. The title is "REGRESO AL MUNDO OLVIDADO: descubrimiento de antiguos pueblos de la cultura Casas Grandes en la Sierra Madre Occidental." Included are maps and descriptions of quite a few shelter caves. All the text except a couple of short forewords is in Spanish, and Carlos has been unable to find a translator. Ideally, the AMCS would like to publish it with parallel Spanish and English texts.
The whole thing is about 32,000 words, not a trivial project and not one to be undertaken by a student who needs frequent recourse to a Spanish/English dictionary. But it looks pretty straightforward. For someone good in both languages, the limiting factor would be just having to type it all. It could be divided among several translators.
Anyone possibly interested in undertaking (part of) such a project, please contact me. 
--Bill Mixon, AMCS editor
----------------------------------------
A fearless man cannot be brave.
----------------------------------------
You may "reply" to the address this message
came from, but for long-term use, save:
Personal: [email protected]
AMCS: [email protected] or [email protected]

--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- 
And it probably wouldn't hurt if the translator were a
caver/archeologist. Technical terms specific to those doctrines get
lost in the translation otherwise.
--Ediger

On Sat, Feb 5, 2011 at 10:11 AM, Mixon Bill <[email protected]> wrote:
> The Association for Mexican Cave Studies has received a potential AMCS
> archaeology bulletin from prominent Mexican caver Carlos Lazcano. The title
> is "REGRESO AL MUNDO OLVIDADO: descubrimiento de antiguos pueblos de la
> cultura Casas Grandes en la Sierra Madre Occidental." Included are maps and
> descriptions of quite a few shelter caves. All the text except a couple of
> short forewords is in Spanish, and Carlos has been unable to find a
> translator.  Ideally, the AMCS would like to publish it with parallel
> Spanish and English texts.
>
> The whole thing is about 32,000 words, not a trivial project and not one to
> be undertaken by a student who needs frequent recourse to a Spanish/English
> dictionary. But it looks pretty straightforward. For someone good in both
> languages, the limiting factor would be just having to type it all. It could
> be divided among several translators.
>
> Anyone possibly interested in undertaking (part of) such a project, please
> contact me.
> --Bill Mixon, AMCS editor
> ----------------------------------------
> A fearless man cannot be brave.
> ----------------------------------------
> You may "reply" to the address this message
> came from, but for long-term use, save:
> Personal: [email protected]
> AMCS: [email protected] or [email protected]
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> Visit our website: http://texascavers.com
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected]
> For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected]
>
>

--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- 
forwarded from Carol Tiderman:

The Cave Conservancy Foundation is awarding a $5,000 Undergraduate, a
$5,000 Master and a $15,000 PhD cave / Karst studies scholarships for
2011. The attached provides details. Information can be found on the
following website: www.caveconservancyfoundation.org/fellowships.htm
<http://www.caveconservancyfoundation.org/fellowships.htm>

Please forward this information to region, section, and other
announcement venues that you believe may convey this to interested parties.

It is a stretch, but the NSF funds research & I expect there are other
sources

--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Am reading MEXICO CITY NOIR edited by Paco Ignacio Taibo II. His introduction to this collection of short stories would be a good start in getting one's head around this without reading Octavio Paz, Carlos Fuentes, & Roberto Bolano.
 
T


Feb 3, 2011 10:32:59 PM, [email protected] wrote:
And the winner is .... drum roll...

For the first Nuevo Laredo City Police Chief assassinated in 2011. .....
drum roll please.....

Gen. Manuel Farfan Carreola !!

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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- 
The U.S. State Department released this statement yesterday:

"Recently, Monterrey has seen a significant increase of armed
robberies in restaurants, coffee shops and
convenience stores.  The robberies follow a similar modus operandi: a
small group of armed individuals enter
their target location, guard the doors and take purses, wallets,
phones and other valuables from the patrons
inside.  None of these robberies have resulted in violence or kidnapping."


I saw somewhere else that they ordered their embassy and consulate
staff to not be on the road at night
around Monterrey, but haven't found confirmation of that.


Anybody have any theories about how things got like this?    I lived
in Monterrey briefly during the summers
of 1987 and 1988, and did all kinds of stuff at night, and I never
felt or sensed danger.    It seems to me these
guys see expensive things they want, and they see that they can never
have those things while working
the kinds of  jobs their parents worked.




Not related below, but worth mentioning,

The U.S. gov't recently posted to be careful around water at 2
particular hotels in Cozumel,
as there have been cases of Legionnaries disease, suggesting it is in
the jacuzzi's or the bath water, or
swimming pool.

--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- As far as I recall and can determine, Legionnaire's disease is caused by an aerosol, so water alone should have little to do with it's spread. It was originally supposed to have been transmitted through air ducts, and it is a water-borne bacterium, so water could certainly play some direct role. <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legionellosis> <http://www.cdc.gov/legionella/patient_facts.htm> 

Mark Minton

At 06:55 PM 2/5/2011, David wrote:

The U.S. gov't recently posted to be careful around water at 2
particular hotels in Cozumel,
as there have been cases of Legionnaries disease, suggesting it is in
the jacuzzi's or the bath water, or swimming pool.


Please reply to [email protected]
Permanent email address is [email protected]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- 
What has happened, David, is that 3 factions (drug cartels, political
parties, independent bandits) have all been putting pressure on the
police & local governments to the point that the police are totally
ineffective and, perhaps, in cahoots with any and/or all of them. It
results in general lawlessness and promotes and encourages robberies
by bands of free-lance bandits--on all levels. What you have is chaos
and confusion as to what's really going on, where, when, why, and by
whom. The solution, when it comes, and the getting to it, is gonna be
interesting. And don't forget: Every 100 years there is a revolution
in Mexico.
--Ediger


On Sat, Feb 5, 2011 at 5:55 PM, David <[email protected]> wrote:
> The U.S. State Department released this statement yesterday:
>
> "Recently, Monterrey has seen a significant increase of armed
> robberies in restaurants, coffee shops and
> convenience stores.  The robberies follow a similar modus operandi: a
> small group of armed individuals enter
> their target location, guard the doors and take purses, wallets,
> phones and other valuables from the patrons
> inside.  None of these robberies have resulted in violence or kidnapping."
>
>
> I saw somewhere else that they ordered their embassy and consulate
> staff to not be on the road at night
> around Monterrey, but haven't found confirmation of that.
>
>
> Anybody have any theories about how things got like this?    I lived
> in Monterrey briefly during the summers
> of 1987 and 1988, and did all kinds of stuff at night, and I never
> felt or sensed danger.    It seems to me these
> guys see expensive things they want, and they see that they can never
> have those things while working
> the kinds of  jobs their parents worked.
>
>
>
>
> Not related below, but worth mentioning,
>
> The U.S. gov't recently posted to be careful around water at 2
> particular hotels in Cozumel,
> as there have been cases of Legionnaries disease, suggesting it is in
> the jacuzzi's or the bath water, or
> swimming pool.
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> Visit our website: http://texascavers.com
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected]
> For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected]
>
>

--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- & for years, the Mexican constabulary/bureaucracy has been underpaid and individuals try to improve their financial status  via versions of the mordida.


Feb 5, 2011 09:32:56 PM, [email protected] wrote:
What has happened, David, is that 3 factions (drug cartels, political
parties, independent bandits) have all been putting pressure on the
police & local governments to the point that the police are totally
ineffective and, perhaps, in cahoots with any and/or all of them. It
results in general lawlessness and promotes and encourages robberies
by bands of free-lance bandits--on all levels. What you have is chaos
and confusion as to what's really going on, where, when, why, and by
whom. The solution, when it comes, and the getting to it, is gonna be
interesting. And don't forget: Every 100 years there is a revolution
in Mexico.
--Ediger


On Sat, Feb 5, 2011 at 5:55 PM, David wrote:
> The U.S. State Department released this statement yesterday:
>
> "Recently, Monterrey has seen a significant increase of armed
> robberies in restaurants, coffee shops and
> convenience stores.  The robberies follow a similar modus operandi: a
> small group of armed individuals enter
> their target location, guard the doors and take purses, wallets,
> phones and other valuables from the patrons
> inside.  None of these robberies have resulted in violence or kidnapping."
>
>
> I saw somewhere else that they ordered their embassy and consulate
> staff to not be on the road at night
> around Monterrey, but haven't found confirmation of that.
>
>
> Anybody have any theories about how things got like this?    I lived
> in Monterrey briefly during the summers
> of 1987 and 1988, and did all kinds of stuff at night, and I never
> felt or sensed danger.    It seems to me these
> guys see expensive things they want, and they see that they can never
> have those things while working
> the kinds of  jobs their parents worked.
>
>
>
>
> Not related below, but worth mentioning,
>
> The U.S. gov't recently posted to be careful around water at 2
> particular hotels in Cozumel,
> as there have been cases of Legionnaries disease, suggesting it is in
> the jacuzzi's or the bath water, or
> swimming pool.
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> Visit our website: http://texascavers.com
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected]
> For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected]
>
>

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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- 
It has been a known fact for some time, here along the border, that Monterrey 
isnow controlled by the "narcos".  There are actually three cartels, Gulf 
Cartel, Zetas, Pactic Cartel.  Throw in the Mexican Army and the Mexican Navy 
(Marines) and you have a five way mix.  The cartels are actually out manuvering 
the Mexican miliatry.  The mexican miliatry has just been effective enough to 
disrupt things so that now you have the robberies, protection and other crap.  

Now the people in Monterrey with means no longer drive from Monterrey to the 
valley to shop but rather they hire private iarcraft to fly to them to the 
valley.  If driving to Monterry from here, it is best to convoy during the day 
only, even if using the auot pista.  Along the border no one goes into Mexcio 
at night if it all.  The good restuarants are now moving from Mexico to the US 
side.

As Gill says it will be interesting although if a revolution were to occur now 
the Naros would probably win.  Thye have too much money.

Bruce
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: [email protected] 
  To: [email protected] ; [email protected] 
  Sent: Sunday, February 06, 2011 3:10 AM
  Subject: Re: Re: [Texascavers] Monterrey safety update


  & for years, the Mexican constabulary/bureaucracy has been underpaid and 
individuals try to improve their financial status  via versions of the mordida. 


  Feb 5, 2011 09:32:56 PM, [email protected] wrote:

    What has happened, David, is that 3 factions (drug cartels, political
    parties, independent bandits) have all been putting pressure on the
    police & local governments to the point that the police are totally
    ineffective and, perhaps, in cahoots with any and/or all of them. It
    results in general lawlessness and promotes and encourages robberies
    by bands of free-lance bandits--on all levels. What you have is chaos
    and confusion as to what's really going on, where, when, why, and by
    whom. The solution, when it comes, and the getting to it, is gonna be
    interesting. And don't forget: Every 100 years there is a revolution
    in Mexico.
    --Ediger


    On Sat, Feb 5, 2011 at 5:55 PM, David wrote:
    > The U.S. State Department released this statement yesterday:
    >
    > "Recently, Monterrey has seen a significant increase of armed
    > robberies in restaurants, coffee shops and
    > convenience stores.  The robberies follow a similar modus operandi: a
    > small group of armed individuals enter
    > their target location, guard the doors and take purses, wallets,
    > phones and other valuables from the patrons
    > inside.  None of these robberies have resulted in violence or kidnapping."
    >
    >
    > I saw somewhere else that they ordered their embassy and consulate
    > staff to not be on the road at night
    > around Monterrey, but haven't found confirmation of that.
    >
    >
    > Anybody have any theories about how things got like this?    I lived
    > in Monterrey briefly during the summers
    > of 1987 and 1988, and did all kinds of stuff at night, and I never
    > felt or sensed danger.    It seems to me these
    > guys see expensive things they want, and they see that they can never
    > have those things while working
    > the kinds of  jobs their parents worked.
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > Not related below, but worth mentioning,
    >
    > The U.S. gov't recently posted to be careful around water at 2
    > particular hotels in Cozumel,
    > as there have been cases of Legionnaries disease, suggesting it is in
    > the jacuzzi's or the bath water, or
    > swimming pool.
    >
    > ---------------------------------------------------------------------
    > Visit our website: http://texascavers.com
    > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected]
    > For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected]
    >
    >

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[email protected]

--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- 
This post is aimed at new cavers, or cavers new to the internet:


The link below has thousands of images related to karst:

      
http://www.google.com/images?um=1&hl=en&rlz=1C1_____enUS416US416&biw=1280&bih=699&tbs=isch:1&sa=1&q=karst&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=

After clicking on the image, look to the right of the screen, and you
will see an option in Google to make
the images larger.

Then if that isn't big enough, just click again on the image, and it
should double in size, but you will need a big
monitor to view it.    ( That only works on some of them )




Below are ten of the more interesting images:

     
http://www.isgs.illinois.edu/maps-data-pub/publications/geobits/graphics/karst-slice.png

     http://www.earlham.edu/~nelsopa/geo/karst_cave.jpg

     
http://www.raingod.com/angus/Gallery/Photos/Asia/China/Guangxi/images/LiJiangKarstPeak01.jpg

     http://image20.webshots.com/20/7/38/86/197273886PkbmJp_ph.jpg

     http://www.canadiangeographic.ca/atlas/Images/Glossary/Karst.jpg

     http://www.indiana.edu/~librcsd/etext/hoosier/image/gm-15.jpg

     http://www.wondermondo.com/Images/Asia/Lebanon/North/Baatara.JPG

     
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/library/policy/army/fm/5-484/fig2-16.gif

     
http://images.travelpod.com/users/koppers/asian_odyssey.1168084740.moon_hill_bxw.jpg

     
http://www.sciencephoto.com/images/showFullWatermarked.html/E415178-Karst_landscape-SPL.jpg?id=694150178


Similarly, you can find educational karst videos on the web, like this
one by Dr. Albert Ogden

     http://vimeo.com/14368976


David Locklear
caver in Fort Bend County

--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- 
I will be posting all my Mexico related stuff at the link below:

    http://www.facebook.com/pages/News-Updates-Mexico-Edition/184577178248871

This spot is just not for cavers, but anybody who loves Mexico and is
worried.

David Locklear

--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- 
My attempt to move my comments about Mexico to Facebook hits its first snag
in less than 2 hours.

The profile picture I was temporarily using, ( that I randomly
selected off a world-wide link on the web )
was a copyrighted picture.     The owner of which, quickly noticed it.

What do you think the chances are that out of the gazillion pictures
on the web, I could have selected
one owned by a CaveTex reader, and then one that would actually click
on my Facebook page ??

Has to be something like 1 in a million trillion!

Anyways, I immediately changed it, and put my own photo.


   http://www.facebook.com/pages/News-Updates-Mexico-Edition/184577178248871

--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The owner/agency has a webcrawler that does this so miscreants don't keep the owner from making money off of their property.

T

Feb 6, 2011 01:26:15 AM, [email protected] wrote:
My attempt to move my comments about Mexico to Facebook hits its first snag
in less than 2 hours.

The profile picture I was temporarily using, ( that I randomly
selected off a world-wide link on the web )
was a copyrighted picture. The owner of which, quickly noticed it.

What do you think the chances are that out of the gazillion pictures
on the web, I could have selected
one owned by a CaveTex reader, and then one that would actually click
on my Facebook page ??

Has to be something like 1 in a million trillion!

Anyways, I immediately changed it, and put my own photo.


http://www.facebook.com/pages/News-Updates-Mexico-Edition/184577178248871

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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- No, the owner just knows what his own pictures look like. I only crawl in caves. 

On Feb 6, 2011, at 3:18 AM, [email protected] wrote:
The owner/agency has a webcrawler that does this so miscreants don't keep the owner from making money off of their property. 

T

Feb 6, 2011 01:26:15 AM, [email protected] wrote:
My attempt to move my comments about Mexico to Facebook hits its first snag 
in less than 2 hours.

The profile picture I was temporarily using, ( that I randomly
selected off a world-wide link on the web )
was a copyrighted picture. The owner of which, quickly noticed it.

What do you think the chances are that out of the gazillion pictures
on the web, I could have selected
one owned by a CaveTex reader, and then one that would actually click
on my Facebook page ??

Has to be something like 1 in a million trillion!

Anyways, I immediately changed it, and put my own photo.


http://www.facebook.com/pages/News-Updates-Mexico-Edition/184577178248871

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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- 
Most of the cave stuff was on man made sets. The rappels where on a 12 foot 
stage with much padding & air mattress at bottom. The rest was CG.........Nat'l 
Geo did a show called the Real Sanctum.... I thought it would be about 
Nullabore but was more of how they made the movie.
Karen

--- On Sat, 2/5/11, Bill Bentley <[email protected]> wrote:


From: Bill Bentley <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [SWR] James Cameron's Sanctum in 3D
To: [email protected], [email protected], [email protected]
List-Post: [email protected]
Date: Saturday, February 5, 2011, 3:44 PM


I paid $7.50 matinee price...

I enjoyed it, but I was about to burst as my wife would not let me say a word 
to critique it at all...

Bill
----- Original Message ----- From: "John Lyles" <[email protected]>
To: <[email protected]>; <[email protected]>
Sent: Saturday, February 05, 2011 3:00 PM
Subject: [SWR] James Cameron's Sanctum in 3D


> Saw it yesterday. I agree with Ray, its a lot better than I thought I might 
> be, more reasonable than The Cave, Descent, and ....
> Journey into Amazing Caves (grin).
> 
> Comments:
> The "yahoo" part that offended me was the marine-style rappelling over the 
> edge of the big pit, face first, just jumping out and screaming. And the 
> callus disregard for the edge of that pit, one guy (the jerk, of course) 
> standing there using his cellphone - in the jungle.
> Using multiple ropes side by side on such a descent was insane too. No 
> tangles for Hollywood though. when they reached the bottom, a tean was just 
> waiting right in the fall zone.  This kind of stupidity could lead some 
> irresponsible copy-cats to win Darwin awards in the future.
> 
> But the diving stuff was interesting, for this non-cave non-diver. I had to 
> count the # of dead bodies in this flick, and i got tired of the "put me out 
> of my misery" drownings.
> 
> The 3D effects were great for cave diving. Good idea, Mr. Cameron. You might 
> win an award there. Also, one shot of rap'ping down a narrow pit in 3D was 
> awesome. And those shots looking up the deluge of waterfalls, awesome.
> 
> Even for a squeeze pusher, the dives through the tight restriction had me 
> sweating and grinding my teeth. Then the awesome passage discoveries, well, i 
> felt like Frank was quite a man.
> 
> I felt he was modeled a little bit after caver Bill Stone. And the National 
> Geographic sponsorship?
> Nah, couldn't be...
> 
> Could Josh be modeled after Aaron Stockton, Mr. SWR chairman?
> 
> The booming passage they were following ("the biggest cave in the world") had 
> my adrenaline pumping, nice work Frank. He needed to be given more respect 
> for his drive to follow the cave - even if it was for survival.
> 
> The credits say it was filmed in Australia, but I thought some of the scenes 
> were from Golandrinas, Yucatan, and even Devils' Sinkhole (Jacqui, take a 
> look).
> 
> My overall opinion is thumbs up, go see it right away, its worth the $11 in 
> 3D. This one will be in a lot of caver video collections at some point, in 2D.
> 
> jtml
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> SWR mailing list
> [email protected]
> http://caver.net/mailman/listinfo/swr_caver.net 


_______________________________________________
SWR mailing list
[email protected]
http://caver.net/mailman/listinfo/swr_caver.net

--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- 
 
I haven't seen the movie yet, but I'm going to this afternoon. I've invited 
Dallas/Fort Worth area cavers to
join Diana and me to see it and wear caving clothes, helmets, and 
headlamps. 
 
I am prepared to be entertained. I expect to laugh and have a good time, 
like mountaineers must have when they went to see Sylvestor Stallone in 
"Cifflhanger."
 
Word I've heard is that when the DVD comes out the original documentary of 
the actual 1988 Nullabor incident Sanctum is sort of based on will be 
included. 
 
Having been involved in serious flooding while underground (reference my 
caving books Yochib and Huautla), 
I can attest to it being mighty scary and intense. 
 
Cavingly,
 
Bill Steele
Irving, Texas
 
In a message dated 2/6/2011 7:40:56 AM Central Standard Time, 
[email protected] writes:

Most of the cave stuff was on man made sets. The rappels where on a 12 foot 
stage with much padding & air mattress at bottom. The rest was 
CG.........Nat'l Geo did a show called the Real Sanctum.... I thought it would 
be about 
Nullabore but was more of how they made the movie.
Karen

--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- 
CIUDAD JUAREZ, Mexico --  Thirty-five  animals at a zoo in the northern Mexico 
state of Chihuahua have frozen  to death during the region's coldest weather in 
six decades.               Serengeti Zoo owner Alberto Hernandez says 14 
parrots, 13  serpents, five iguanas, two crocodiles and a capuchin monkey died. 
He  said Saturday that power failures cut off electrical heating at the zoo  in 
the town of Aldama.              Temperatures have dropped to 9 degrees 
Fahrenheit (minus 13 Celsius) in the area, the coldest weather in 60 years.     
          
Power outages have affected much of northern Mexico,  forcing factories and 
businesses to close. Dozens of people are in  shelters. Schools have been 
closed 
in Chihuahua state but are expected  to open Tuesday as the weather warms.

--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- Gill mentioned that archaeology experience might be necessary to translate that stuff. I wouldn't worry about it. It looks pretty non- technical to me. Despite not knowing Spanish to any extent, I can get the gist of most of it easily. The author is not an archaeologist. 
--Bill
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A fearless man cannot be brave.
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- 
I plan on going this AM (in caving gear? We'll see.), but, I'm not expecting a 
great movie.


I swear  by www.rottentomatoes.com and they're giving it a dreadful 29 out of a 
100. 


Yikes!

Read about it hear:   http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/sanctum/


"Sanctum is beautifully photographed, and it makes better use of 3-D technology 
than most, but that doesn't make up for its ham-handed script and lifeless 
cast."


It'll be fun and nice to look at, but, IMHO, the best movies about caves and 
caving still are the Planet Earth series and Amazing Caves.
 
 
Mark

 
 





________________________________
From: "[email protected]" <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]; [email protected]
Sent: Sun, February 6, 2011 7:53:44 AM
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] Re: [SWR] James Cameron's Sanctum in 3D


I haven't seen the movie yet, but I'm going to this afternoon. I've invited 
Dallas/Fort Worth area cavers to
join Diana and me to see it and wear caving clothes, helmets, and headlamps. 

I am prepared to be entertained. I expect to laugh and have a good time, like 
mountaineers must have when they went to see Sylvestor Stallone in 
"Cifflhanger."

Word I've heard is that when the DVD comes out the original documentary of the 
actual 1988 Nullabor incident Sanctum is sort of based on will be included. 


Having been involved in serious flooding while underground (reference my caving 
books Yochib and Huautla), 

I can attest to it being mighty scary and intense. 

Cavingly,

Bill Steele
Irving, Texas

In a message dated 2/6/2011 7:40:56 AM Central Standard Time, 
[email protected] writes:
Most of the cave stuff was on man made sets. The rappels where on a 12 foot 
stage with much padding & air mattress at bottom. The rest was CG.........Nat'l 
Geo did a show called the Real Sanctum.... I thought it would be about 
Nullabore 
but was more of how they made the movie.
>Karen

--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- 
National Geographic article at

http://is.gd/eoUY5r

--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- 
From Jim Coke via Peter Sprouse to you:
I would like to share a bit of great exploration news from Quintana Roo Mexico. Robert Schmittner connected Sistema Aktun Hu to the Nohoch Nah Chich region of Sistema Sac Actun. His team made this connection on 30 January 2011 to establish what could be interpreted as the 4th longest cave in the world. Sac Actun is presently the longest cave in Mexico, and the longest underwater cave in the world. It is my great pleasure to congratulate Robbie and all the many cave explorers that have surveyed in the numerous regions of this marvelous 
cave.
Sistema Sac Actun was discovered in 1987. The first map of Sac Actun and tales of cave explorations are reported in AMCS Activities Newsletter #17 (December 1988). Further explorations and the eventual connection of Sac Actun to Sistema Nohoch Nah Chich are reported in AMCS Activities Newsletter #30 (June 2007).
Explorations in Sistema Actun Hu began in January 2007.[See AMCS Activities Newsletter 33.] Aktun Hu cave was surveyed to include the Cenote Outland cave. Outland was first explored by Mike Madden in 1992. Mike's explorations were abandoned due to logistical and landowner issues. Explorations in Aktun Hu bloomed during 2008, 2009, and 2010.
For the enthusiasts of pure underwater cave survey, Sac Actun has a 215246m length and a depth of -71.6m. Since a cave is a cave whether it's filled with water or air, the total length of Sac Actun including all wet and dry passages 
is 217363m (depth of 77.6m).
This new length for Sac Actun, 217363m, is a bit longer than the reported 217133m length of Wind Cave (NP) reported by Rod Horrocks on the NSS GEO2 cave page at this date. Having a 230m surplus of surveyed passage over Wind Cave is hardly a significant length advantage for Sac Actun. I expect the Wind Cave 
explorers to make up this difference quickly. I also  expect further
explorations to find an ever evasive connection from Sac Actun to Sistema Dos 
Ojos.


Again my congratulations to all cave exploration teams in this area.

Jim Coke

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A fearless man cannot be brave.
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You may "reply" to the address this message
came from, but for long-term use, save:
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message --- 
 
The new pseudoscorpion is top of the food chain in Glenwood  Caverns.
Photograph courtesy Dave Steinmann
 
Christine Dell'Amore 
_National Geographic News_ (http://news.nationalgeographic.com/)  
Published February 4, 2011 
 
Unless you've been living in a _cave_ 
(http://science.nationalgeographic.com/science/earth/surface-of-the-earth/caves-article.html)
 , you probably 
haven't run across this new species  of poisonous, nearly blind pseudoscorpion. 
The 0.5-inch-long (1.3-centimeter-long) species, Cryptogreagris  
steinmanni, was discovered recently in high-altitude caverns near Glenwood  
Springs, 
_Colorado_ 
(http://travel.nationalgeographic.com/travel/united-states/colorado-guide/) . 
Pseudoscorpions are essentially scorpions that lack a stinging tail. 
However,  the new species does have long, venom-tipped pincers that likely help 
it 
nab  agile prey, such as springtails, in the gloom. 
Most likely, the new pseudoscorpion lives only in _Glenwood Caverns and 
Historic Fairy Caves_ 
(http://glenwoodcaverns.com/glenwood-springs-cave-tours.html) , the study  
authors say. 
"A lot of these caves are islands, almost like an isolated environment 
where  invertebrates ... evolve into being adapted to underground life," said  
biospeleologist David Steinmann, a zoology department associate with the 
_Denver Museum of Nature and  Science_ (http://www.dmns.org/) . Steinmann 
collected the new species after it was discovered  in 2000 by tour guide Micah 
Ball. 
With its primitive eyes and pale color, the arachnid is perfectly suited to 
 its dark, chilly existence and has probably been scurrying through the 
passages  for millions of years, Steinmann said. 
New Pseudoscorpion Elusive—Until Now 
Little is known about C. steinmanni, but it's thought to be rare,  
relatively long-lived, and able to curl up into a defensive ball when  
threatened. 
The animal went unnoticed for so long because it blends in well with the  
rocks—and because few people have been crawling around caves looking for tiny 
 creatures. 
Steinmann, an avid caver, has discovered more than a hundred new 
_invertebrate_ (http://animals.nationalgeographic.com/animals/invertebrates/)  
species 
so far in Colorado caves,  including at least seven in Glenwood Springs 
alone. (_See cave pictures._ 
(http://science.nationalgeographic.com/science/photos/caves-gallery/) ) 
"It's always fun to see what's out there."  
The new-pseudoscorpion study appeared in December 2010 in the  journal 
_Subterranean  Biology_ (http://www.fi.cnr.it/sibios/subtbiol.htm) . 
_http://is.gd/eoUY5r_ (http://is.gd/eoUY5r)

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