texascavers Digest 2 Aug 2010 15:56:58 -0000 Issue 1119
Topics (messages 15628 through 15638):
Re: 2010 Texas Cavers Reunion!
15628 by: Allan Cobb
15629 by: Bill Bentley
15630 by: mark gee
15631 by: Karen
15632 by: mark gee
15634 by: Sheryl Rieck
15637 by: Fritz Holt
Personal Road-trip Report 5 of 20
15633 by: David
Location for TCR
15635 by: Allan Cobb
Carbonate stromatolites on Mars?
15636 by: caverarch.aol.com
Re: Getting wet at the 2010 Texas Cavers Reunion
15638 by: Fritz Holt
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--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
I'm excited to spend my birthday @ my first ever TCR!
Well, my birthday is the week before TCR. Perhaps we should proclaim TCR to
also be a birthday party for all Libras! That should balance things right up.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
And I thought texascavers had quit working!
----- Original Message -----
From: Allan Cobb
To: Mallory Mayeux
Cc: TexasCavers
Sent: Sunday, August 01, 2010 5:53 PM
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] 2010 Texas Cavers Reunion!
----- Original Message -----
I'm excited to spend my birthday @ my first ever TCR!
Well, my birthday is the week before TCR. Perhaps we should proclaim TCR to
also be a birthday party for all Libras! That should balance things right up.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I hope the weather and beer is cool, not to noisey, four-wheeiers, and some
water in the creek to enjoy. I know that all my friends will be there. Look
foward to a good time for all. Not as much of a drive will be nice to. Thank
you
for finding a place for us to enjoy.
Happy Caving !!
Mark
________________________________
From: Sheryl Rieck <[email protected]>
To: TexasCavers <[email protected]>
Sent: Sun, August 1, 2010 6:28:50 PM
Subject: RE: [Texascavers] 2010 Texas Cavers Reunion!
I just find this exceedingly rude and disrespectful to a person who works very
hard to put TCR together. I took the time before shooting off my mouth to look
the entire site over and see what was there that I could enjoy instead of
immediately bitching because I don’t ride a dirt bike or enjoy off-road
activities. Besides, I attend TCR for the camaraderie of seeing friends and
acquaintances I don’t get to see as often as I would like. Enjoy your birthday.
Sheryl
From:[email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Sunday, August 01, 2010 5:02 PM
To: [email protected]; [email protected]; [email protected]
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] 2010 Texas Cavers Reunion!
Non-cavers who aren't serious motorized off-road vehicle aficionados will
>
>
>
>likely be scared off by the site's scrublands landscape and their
>
>
>
>ORV-focused "tour of the park" video and photo album.
>
>
>
I'm a caver who REALLY doesn't care about motorized off-road vehicles and who
seriously doesn't want to spend a weekend listening to them roar through the
park.
At least Inks Lake and Longhorn Caverns are within a few miles of this
miserable
TCR site.
Julia, who will likely skip this TCR and spend my birthday somewhere fun
-----Original Message-----
From: Frank Binney <[email protected]>
To: Allan Cobb <[email protected]>; Texas Cavers <[email protected]>
Sent: Sun, Aug 1, 2010 3:43 pm
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] 2010 Texas Cavers Reunion!
> This year TCR will be on the 3100 acre Hidden Falls Adventure Park
> (www.hiddenfallsadventurepark.com) on the weekend of October 15-17.
Jeeze, big difference between this arid off-road-vehicle park and the lush,
verdant river banks and cool, clear waters of Paradise Canyon!
I was hoping to convince my girlfriend to fly back with me for this year's
TCR but I don't dare send her the link to the Hidden Falls website.
Non-cavers who aren't serious motorized off-road vehicle aficionados will
likely be scared off by the site's scrublands landscape and their
ORV-focused "tour of the park" video and photo album.
Frank (aficionado of shady swimming holes)
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--- Begin Message ---
Go libras! Sounds great to me, but I *might* be a little biased... birthday
is the following week. Looking forward to TCR.
Cheers,
Karen
On Sun, Aug 1, 2010 at 6:53 PM, Allan Cobb <[email protected]> wrote:
> ----- Original Message -----
> I'm excited to spend my birthday @ my first ever TCR!
>
> Well, my birthday is the week before TCR. Perhaps we should proclaim TCR
> to also be a birthday party for all Libras! That should balance things
> right up.
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Is it OK to feed the Libras!
________________________________
From: Bill Bentley <[email protected]>
Cc: TexasCavers <[email protected]>
Sent: Sun, August 1, 2010 8:03:14 PM
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] 2010 Texas Cavers Reunion!
And I thought texascavers had quit working!
----- Original Message -----
>From: Allan Cobb
>To: Mallory Mayeux
>Cc: TexasCavers
>Sent: Sunday, August 01, 2010 5:53 PM
>Subject: Re: [Texascavers] 2010 Texas Cavers Reunion!
>
>
>----- Original Message -----
>> I'm excited to spend my birthday @ my first ever TCR!
>Well, my birthday is the week before TCR. Perhaps we should proclaim TCR to
>also be a birthday party for all Libras! That should balance things right up.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Don't misunderstand me. It isn't that I didn't want to bitch. I just prefer
to talk about Allan behind his back.
SHeryl
From: Don Cooper [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Monday, August 02, 2010 12:19 AM
To: Sheryl Rieck
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] 2010 Texas Cavers Reunion!
I'd have bitched too, but Frank beat me to it!
Alan does work hard to make this thing work, but that doesn't mean I have to
agree with him.
But the deal is done. I'll try to find those hidden falls. If this
location doesn't work out I can say 'told ya so'.
We'll just have to see, won't we?
-Don C
On Sun, Aug 1, 2010 at 6:28 PM, Sheryl Rieck <[email protected]> wrote:
I just find this exceedingly rude and disrespectful to a person who works
very hard to put TCR together. I took the time before shooting off my mouth
to look the entire site over and see what was there that I could enjoy
instead of immediately bitching because I don't ride a dirt bike or enjoy
off-road activities. Besides, I attend TCR for the camaraderie of seeing
friends and acquaintances I don't get to see as often as I would like. Enjoy
your birthday.
Sheryl
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Sunday, August 01, 2010 5:02 PM
To: [email protected]; [email protected]; [email protected]
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] 2010 Texas Cavers Reunion!
Non-cavers who aren't serious motorized off-road vehicle aficionados will
likely be scared off by the site's scrublands landscape and their
ORV-focused "tour of the park" video and photo album.
I'm a caver who REALLY doesn't care about motorized off-road vehicles and
who seriously doesn't want to spend a weekend listening to them roar through
the park.
At least Inks Lake and Longhorn Caverns are within a few miles of this
miserable TCR site.
Julia, who will likely skip this TCR and spend my birthday somewhere fun
-----Original Message-----
From: Frank Binney <[email protected]>
To: Allan Cobb <[email protected]>; Texas Cavers <[email protected]>
Sent: Sun, Aug 1, 2010 3:43 pm
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] 2010 Texas Cavers Reunion!
> This year TCR will be on the 3100 acre Hidden Falls Adventure Park
> (www.hiddenfallsadventurepark.com) on the weekend of October 15-17.
Jeeze, big difference between this arid off-road-vehicle park and the lush,
verdant river banks and cool, clear waters of Paradise Canyon!
I was hoping to convince my girlfriend to fly back with me for this year's
TCR but I don't dare send her the link to the Hidden Falls website.
Non-cavers who aren't serious motorized off-road vehicle aficionados will
likely be scared off by the site's scrublands landscape and their
ORV-focused "tour of the park" video and photo album.
Frank (aficionado of shady swimming holes)
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Allan,
No complaints. I have only been to the last five TCR gatherings and all were
most enjoyable. I would hope to never miss a future event. Paradise Canyon was
by far the best site, followed by Honey Creek. The only complaint with PC might
be no showers but that is the norm for TCR sites. I might add that Mike Walsh's
hosting of the convention this year at the TCC headquarters was a most
enjoyable event at a great location but might be a little crowded for the
numbers that usually attend the TCR. The video did not mention whether swimming
was allowed at the waterfall pool or elsewhere, is it?
While not a super enthusiast, I have a 250cc Honda four wheeler and enjoy
riding it when the opportunity arises, which is seldom. I will certainly
trailer it to TCR for the moderate to easy trails. The fun is riding the
roads/trails to view the scenery, wildlife and for the riding enjoyment. This
will also give my daughters, Mandy and Jenny, an opportunity to hone their
riding skills. They had Honda mini trail bikes during junior and senior high
which were mostly ridden on property we owned. Looking forward to another great
gathering of friends, old and new.
Hopefully I won't offend our fine chefs or those who enjoy a varied cuisine,
but in an effort to not bust the food budget and hopefully please the majority,
I have a recommendation. Why not angel hair spaghetti with quality sauce,
Lettuce and tomato salad, French bread with butter and more of last years
delicious cupcakes or apple or peach cobbler for dessert. I AM NOT volunteering
for food preparation, only suggesting.
A geezer of simple tastes.
-----Original Message-----
From: Allan Cobb [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Sunday, August 01, 2010 5:48 PM
To: 'A Texas Caving Remailer for Texas Cavers'
Subject: Re: [Texascavers] 2010 Texas Cavers Reunion!
We do not have the park to ourselves. However, the use is rather light at
the park and with 3100 acres, it is not likely to be a real problem. Most
people who go out there are day use only. I have thought about all these
questions that have come up and mulled it over before even visiting the
site. After visiting the site, I am certain that it will all work out well.
Paradise Canyon was a great place but it too had its problems. I had many
complaints from people about that site, too. After the accident last year,
I had a number of people ask me to move TCR somewhere else. So I did.
Finding a location is no easy task. This site fits almost all of the
criteria that I look for when choosing a site. The reality of it is that
you cannot please everyone. Yes, it would be much better if it had a river
running through it but if it did, I probably could not have gotten it as a
TCR site. One of the most important criteria for me is that it works out
with a few hassles as possible for me. This site fits that.
(Frank, you must have forgotten what the Texas Hill Country actually looks
like.)
So, come out to TCR and have fun or stay away and miss it. I much prefer
that people at least give me the benefit of the doubt that this will work as
a TCR site. This will be a good TCR but the final choice is yours about
whether you attend or not. I would much prefer that people contact me
directly if they have complaints rather than posting them in a public forum.
Everyone is welcome at TCR even if you complain.
Allan
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--- Begin Message ---
I headed north on Tollway 87 out of Woodstock. I believe I was
hoping to get to Glenns Falls and was going to decide then
whether to cross into Vermont or continue northward on Tollway 87.
But I didn't see the exit south of Albany, and ended up lost in the
Schenectady area. After taking time out to
look at the map, it seemed that if I were ever going to visit Howe
Caverns, this would be the time to do it.
So I took the tour.
Had I decided this earlier in the day, like when I was in the
Woodstock cafe, my day would have probably been
wonderful, but I was thinking about doing the cave later in the week,
or on the way back down.
I eventually found a very nice Italian food cafe next to a parachute
landing, so I got to eat a dish I have never had before,
and watch the parachuters. That was the town of Duanesburg. I
then took off back in the direction of Glenns Falls, hoping to cut
across some country back roads. But I got lost in Rotterdam and
again in Schenectady.
I am in a tiny country town called Ballston Spa a few miles southwest
of Saratoga Springs.
The reality of my situation is that it would be an ill-fated mission
to continue northeast to the convention, eventhough
I am less than 3 1/2 hours a way. My only potential Craiglist
rider to help me get home, wants to leave Vermont on
Monday, and is only going to Virginia. Since my phones are not
working and that may be my only hope of getting
home.
My cell phone service, Boostmobile.com, does not seem to have service
in this area??
On the subject of Howe's Cavern's, the cave itself is impressive and
would have been a great cave to go caving
in back in the day before it was commercialized. It has large
stream passage, with some nice flowstone, and
one interesting passage like a twisting slot canyon.
Tonight I plan to walk around the downtown area of Saratoga Springs
and maybe Glenns Falls, too. I will sleep in
my mini-van somewhere around there, hopefully at a cheap roadside
campground.
If I continue on northeastward on Monday, then I should cross into
Vermont in the morning
around the town of Fairhaven. At this time, I can't confirm that I
will continue north up thru Orwell to Burlington on
Route 22A. Instead, I would explore southwestern Vermont, and then
turn around and head back towards Virginia.
Obviously, that is not the most rewarding option.
Maybe after a good night's rest, I will come up with a better plan.
It has been a long day, and I am too tired to
drive much farther north.
To be continued.
David Locklear
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--- Begin Message ---
Since so many people have complained about my choice for the location of TCR, I
am will to make a deal. Anyone who wants to can find a better site. For one
week only, I am willing to change the location if a better site can be found.
Here is your chance to make a difference. Channel all your energy that has
been used for complaining into finding a site. Send me informaion on location,
description, cost, and availability. Now get out there and get to looking!
Allan
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Mars Site May Hold 'Buried Life'
from BBC News Online
Researchers have identified rocks that they say could contain the fossilised
remains of life on early Mars. The team made their discovery in the ancient
rocks of Nili Fossae.
Their work has revealed that this trench on Mars is a "dead ringer" for a
region in Australia where some of the earliest evidence of life on Earth has
been buried and preserved in mineral form. They report the findings in the
journal Earth and Planetary Science Letters.
The team, led by a scientist from the Search for Extraterrestrial Intelligence
Institute (Seti) in California, believes that the same "hydrothermal" processes
that preserved these markers of life on Earth could have taken place on Mars at
Nili Fossae. The rocks there are up to four billion years old, which means they
have been around for three-quarters of the history of Mars.
http://snipr.com/103o3g
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ANOTHER PLUS IS THAT WITH A NORMAL TURNOUT, TCR PARTICIPANTS WILL PROBABLY FAR
OUTNUMBER OFF-ROADERS THAT WEEKEND.
Fritz
________________________________
From: Frank Binney [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Sunday, August 01, 2010 5:56 PM
To: Joe Ranzau; [email protected]
Cc: [email protected]; Texas Cavers
Subject: [Texascavers] Getting wet at the 2010 Texas Cavers Reunion
Whoops! My apologies to Alan.
I didn't mean to criticize the TCR location itself or Alan's hard work in
arranging it. I'm planning to attend and am confident it will be a great
weekend. There are ample places to get wet within the 3100 acre site, varied
topography for lots of activities and lots of shady, inviting campsites.
My negative observation was directed at the website of Hidden Fall Adventure
Park. Their normal audience is obviously the serious off-road vehicle set and
this is what their "guide to the park" video and photo album focus on. If you
search past all that, however, you'll see there's a lot of the karstlands hill
country scenery and small water features so many of us enjoy.
See you in October-and thanks Alan and others who are putting this on,
Frank
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